What stories would you have liked to have seen on Voyager?
- Thread starter JanewayRulz!
- Start date
Well, no.
RobertScorpio
Pariah
Meanwhile, I say if they kept showing two shows at the same time, overlapping so that there was never any single point where there was no Star trek, or no alternative Star Trek, it could never have been murdered. Look at the radically polar audiences numbering the hard liners of DS9 vs. Voyager that for every one soul that wanted a rich ongoing huge tapestry of interweaving story lines, someone wanted throwaway popcorn reset button my what a smashing ass that borg has minutiae.
It was Berman's arrogance that had him think that he needed to concentrate completely on one show that the honed fine laser pinpointing of his ability would result in something universally accepted and cherished by the super public which ate his shit because homogenization leads to the lowest common denominator.
"Titsplosions".
Sisko went on about the adversarial nature of baseball, but would we want to watch a game of baseball which only had one team? Eggs in one basket is asking for trouble. If they'd kept up the two show paradigm there wouldn't have been any clear point where Star Trek on TV could have been exterminated. It could still be on today in some form or another. Just because Enterprise had failed, a second show running along side Enterprise, it may have held the tide long enough for Enterprises replacement to be conceived.
It's not unlike how the First Evil chose to abuse the break in the lineage of potential slayers during the final season of Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
Of course, that's all if streamlining was Berman's choice and not the TPTB at Paramount or UPN cutting him off one series at a time and then the movies, like some slow winding meandering terminal illness robbing you of life by huge but definable fractions.
It was Berman's arrogance that had him think that he needed to concentrate completely on one show that the honed fine laser pinpointing of his ability would result in something universally accepted and cherished by the super public which ate his shit because homogenization leads to the lowest common denominator.
"Titsplosions".
Sisko went on about the adversarial nature of baseball, but would we want to watch a game of baseball which only had one team? Eggs in one basket is asking for trouble. If they'd kept up the two show paradigm there wouldn't have been any clear point where Star Trek on TV could have been exterminated. It could still be on today in some form or another. Just because Enterprise had failed, a second show running along side Enterprise, it may have held the tide long enough for Enterprises replacement to be conceived.
It's not unlike how the First Evil chose to abuse the break in the lineage of potential slayers during the final season of Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
Of course, that's all if streamlining was Berman's choice and not the TPTB at Paramount or UPN cutting him off one series at a time and then the movies, like some slow winding meandering terminal illness robbing you of life by huge but definable fractions.
RobertScorpio
Pariah
But with all that said, it seemed to me that TREK-TV had run its course. After 600 hours, and more episodes than Gunsmoke, it was time, IMO, to stop. The good to bad ratio of episodes was getting pretty narrow. Some people obviously did not like TREK XI. But I did. And not having a failing TREK series running at the same time was a major move forward for the new movie series.
Rob
Rob
Meanwhile, I say if they kept showing two shows at the same time, overlapping so that there was never any single point where there was no Star trek, or no alternative Star Trek, it could never have been murdered. Look at the radically polar audiences numbering the hard liners of DS9 vs. Voyager that for every one soul that wanted a rich ongoing huge tapestry of interweaving story lines, someone wanted throwaway popcorn reset button my what a smashing ass that borg has minutiae.
it's these arrogant jack-assery statements that remind me why i dislike so many DS9 fans. i'm sorry that voyager wasn't up to your high-brow dramatic standards that so much of trek is known for.
what's the point of going on with this argument. i'm just wasting pixels here.
So realistically maybe they only should have made another thousand hours of Star Trek if the diminishing returns had reached such inconsumable levels as you say Robert.
Berman was asleep at the wheel. Usually that's a bad thing. Tankers crashing into penguins and shit, but the new cabin boy shouting orders form the poopdeck had some real zing and woz going places and taking the ship to those places with him.
Law and order, and CSI.
Berman was asleep at the wheel. Usually that's a bad thing. Tankers crashing into penguins and shit, but the new cabin boy shouting orders form the poopdeck had some real zing and woz going places and taking the ship to those places with him.
Law and order, and CSI.
Kes just needed some more thought put into her. I mean it would've been more interesting to actually show the earlier life cycle of a race as short-lived as the Ocampa and the advantages that come from it: She'd be introduced as a 10 year kid, then by S2 she's physically 14 or so, then by S3 she's about 18 and then S4 she's in optimal adult age (mid twenties).
As for advantages to this life-cycle: She could learn things faster and have better adaptability, after all Ocampa would likely have these accelerated traits to survive to adulthood so quickly.
As for advantages to this life-cycle: She could learn things faster and have better adaptability, after all Ocampa would likely have these accelerated traits to survive to adulthood so quickly.
I think her sweet as pie attitude sucked most of all.
That's not who she was during "Caretaker".
In the premiere, Kes and some her age were considered rebels to the Ocampa. Kes in "Caretaker" spoke up, she was forthright. She stood up for herself! She was breaking Ocampan law by going to the surface. The Ocampa didn't even invite such ideas.
How did she go from that too, I only speak when spoken to? From"Our people used to have incredible mental powers and we forgot how to use them because we became lazy." to "I'll never use my powers again."?
She defied her elders to their face but was lead around on a string by Neelix? If Neelix was more Sid to her Nancy, maybe but he wasn't.
Kes lost her edge when she lost her guts.
When she was used to serve Janeway coffee, instead of learning how a warp core works. Thru her learning, we could have learned how shuttles get built or the ship gets repaired. she'd want to learn all that. Shouldn't she? I know some of you did.
Didn't anybody find it odd that someone that's lived underground and knows nothing of space or starships, isn't one bit amazed by Voyager?
Neelix was more fascinated by water and a replicator, than Kes was about being in a new environment. Hell, most folks get excited at the grand opening of a new mall.
Without that, Kes was boring.
Oh, this is a lovely old argument that hasn't come up since I've been back on this board. How does it never occur to you folks that people can like both DS9 and VOY? And every other Star Trek? And all sorts of other sci-fi? I like all sorts of shows; but I'm a lowest common denominator moron for liking VOY, too? Man, I thought folks were past that. VOY could have pushed harder and given us more, but us fans are hardly drooling morons for enjoying it.
Maybe the characters captivated us. Maybe to some of us the lead character was an inspiration. Maybe it wasn't all about Michael Bay titsplosions.
Plus, I think sometimes we have to step outside ourselves once in a while and view Trek not as fans. I think we need to take into perspective that just because DS9 is raved about on Trek message boards, Ds9 wasn't much of a hit outside of it. While Voyager many not be seen as favorite here, Voyager, Capt. Janeway & Seven of Nine are way more recognized to mass public than most of the cast of DS9 are.
Opinions here aren't things set in stone.
Plus I think we should keep perspective that all Trek is different in theme, tone and setting for a reason. The different styles captures a different type of sci-fi fan. TNG might not appeal to the Star Wars fan but Voy. or DS9 might. Voy. might not be to the liking of the Dr. Who fan but TNG or TOS might. It's still Trek but variety for different styles.
I did use the words polar and hardliners, but perhaps i should have included "extremists" as well when I was describing the worst fanatics attacking other fanatics pretty much indistinguishable from each other by an outside vantage.
Rainbows of emotion at play here other than that tacky bullshit.
Rainbows of emotion at play here other than that tacky bullshit.
Seeing belanne cope with her depression, instead of ignoring it.
Having an ep based on janeway and the loneliness she is suffering were she goes and dose something reckless
Having an ep based on janeway and the loneliness she is suffering were she goes and dose something reckless
That was what saved Juggernaut" for me, when I realized she was trying to do that ON the ship, and that Janeway was letting her do just that.
Go back to season 2, and look at the lineup of eps.
"Tuvix" is right before "Resolutions".
In "Tuvix" we get that bonding scene between Janeway and Kes where Janeway actually admits to what she feels regarding the separation from the Alpha Quadrant and Mark....
(People who didn't like her voice in season 1... listen to her give this season 2 speech, especially as she's stroking her throat in an effort not to let that voice crack under the weight of her emotion.)
JANEWAY: Oh, I struggle with it every day. Sometimes I’m full of hope and optimism. Other times. Then I dream about being with Mark and it’s so real. Then when I wake up and realize it’s just a dream, I’m terribly discouraged. In those moments, it’s impossible to deny just how far away he really is. And I know that someday I may have to accept that he’s not part of my life anymore.
She doesn't do anything "reckless" in that ep, but does something part of the fandom finds unforgiveable.
The very next week, we see "Resolutions" which is like watching the tale of Voyager in microcosm.
Janeway is presented with an insolvable problem... flung 75,000 light years away from Earth ( or infected on an uninhabited planet, unable to leave.)
She sets a course for home at the end of Caretaker (or she sets up her lab to find a cure that her EMH couldn't find despite not disconnecting from the problem for 17 days/nights).
She keeps her eyes on the prize, holding her course on the planet, searching for protein cofactors in every new insect she discovers... until she meets an obstacle even she can't surmont. A storm which destroys her lab and equipment / supplies which can't be (?) replicated.
Then she turns to the job of basic labor/survival... and discovers after (?) how many weeks on this planet that her roommate is a gorgeous man who's very taken with her.
Now... does she do something "reckless" after that?
Inquiring minds DO NOT BELIEVE MULGREW!!!!!!
