This means absolutely NOTHING as the STTMP theme was reused for another movie as well as STNG.
RAMA
What is your honest opinion of Enterprise?
- Thread starter indolover
- Start date
This means absolutely NOTHING as the STTMP theme was reused for another movie as well as STNG.
RAMA
I tuned into the first episode out of curiosity. And there were two things that annoyed me almost immediately.
Firstly: they name the first Klingon we see, Klang. Klang???They couldn't be fucking serious! It was if they were deliberately trying to say something stupid about their own show. Who the hell would name a character with such a stupid sounding name???
The second thing that really annoyed me was the patronizing attitude of the Vulcans and how they supposedly mentored humanity into space beyond our solar system. It really grated on my nerves and went against the impression I got from TOS that we had gotten into deep space all on our own. I really didn't like what ENT setup and was suggesting. Of course, they were taking their cue from a film that I thought was eminently stupid anyway.
After that I'd drop in every now and then and occasionally would see a nugget of interest, but nothing of substance. And as someone said upthread the show was basically rehashing previous ideas yet in a lacklustre manner. It had nothing of its own. It really was TNG/VOY redux in a different setting.
Well as we saw they really didn't mentor much, they tried to slow the advance of humans into space until Ki'Shara. The plotline that included a recessive Vulcan culture was ultimately summarized by a handful of producers-writers well versed in the ST franchise. The fact is, as other episodes of ENT showed, humans got into space through very hard work and lots of trial and error, often despite the Vulcans.
Klang? A character name bothers you THAT much? How many alien names have you heard that sound normal...Klatu??? It seems like simply "Kling" altered with a different vowel to suggest an early Klingon by the viewers point of view. The fact you read that much into it basically shows your state of mind when watching it.
Eh ENT really isn't much like other ST shows. I like the early space exploration feel of it...the advanced astronauts vibe.
Its quite telling if you avg up ENT's best season on IMDB that it ranks higher than any TOS season by fan ratings.
RAMA
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Yes, I'm not one of those people with the knee jerk reactions to the finale. As outlined elsewhere on this thread and other places most people hate it because of emotional reasons and preconceptions instead of what was on screen. I quite enjoyed it.
RAMA
I actually hated it for what was on the screen. I thought it was a pretty disjointed mess that was no way to say good-bye to these characters that a lot of people did actually like. Not that I wanted anything like that stupid, sappy montage from DS9 either...
Yes well another of the contentious episodes I like in ST is STNG's "Masks". I think its a near-masterpiece but a lot of people don't seem to like it. I just simply choose to believe they're all nuts and move on..
RAMA
Maybe on teh internets people think this. In real life, I've encountered many people who think it's great. I really like it myself.
antiquityscion
Commander
I liked Enterprise. While it was on the air, they kept changing the days and times, so it was hard to keep up, so I didn't get to see every episode. It wasn't until I bought it on DVD after it was canceled that I saw all the episodes. I think I actually like it more now, than when it was on air. Maybe partly because I know they won't be making any more episodes, and partly because I can watch each episode one after the other ad don't have to wait a week to see the next one.
You do realize there's a big fat honking difference between reusing a piece of Star Trek music in another Star Trek project, and taking some soft rock song that had nothing to do with Star Trek and using it as a theme song, right?
Oh, that's right, you actually liked TATV and "Masks"...
I thought season 3 did a pretty good job of doing something different overall, at least enough to not be lumped together with the first 2 seasons. Sure there were some episodes straight out of the Trek textbook (Doctor's Orders comes instantly to mind, although I liked that episode anyway), but overall it still felt fresh to me even if some the individual episodes followed the formula.
As for season 4, I didn't feel it was as strong as people always say. It was definitely better than the first 2 seasons, but season 3 is still the clear winner for me. Season 4 seemed to borrow even more from old Trek than previous seasons.
We had a story arc with back story for the Augments / Data, we had a back story trying to shoehorn an explanation for why the makeup artists on TOS didn't give the Klingons ridges, we had a back story for the Federation of Planets, we had a back story for why the Vulcans on ENT were poorly acted, and we had another Mirror Universe episode that tried to bring in as much as it could from TOS. Don't get me wrong, I still quite liked season 4, but I don't see how it's any fresher than the other 3 seasons.
(At least we can agree on TATV.)
antiquityscion
Commander
That was one thing I didn't like about Enterprise: the opening theme. First couple times hearing, it was fine. But over and over? didn't work.
I wouldn't have minded if they remixed the song in seasons 3-4, but as an instrumental.
There is no difference. The lyrics in the song fit exploration very well. Why does it matter what genre the music is in?
Yes, I liked both those episodes though Masks is many times better than TATV.
RAMA
Something fr you consideration, which is to say something in a similar vein.
Already disliked the pilot, was totally disappointed. The premise was 100 years before Kirk & Co, no transporters, no nothing from the other shows, and then we have a Klingon in the first 5 minutes and Archer getting beamed out of the exploding Suliban thing in the last 5 minutes. The only difference to the other shows was that they needed to push a button to open the sliding doors. Oh my GOD!
After hearing that season 3 might be interesting I looked into it again. But then the Xindi looked like the bad guys from Galaxy Quest, and I couldn't even try to take the show seriously anymore.
After hearing that season 3 might be interesting I looked into it again. But then the Xindi looked like the bad guys from Galaxy Quest, and I couldn't even try to take the show seriously anymore.
If nothing else, Season 3 is definitely worth a fair chance. It's the only part of ENT that I felt was really great (the rest I thought was good, but not too exciting). Trek has always had ridiculous looking aliens, so I wouldn't hold that against it.
I felt that Enterprise had a really exciting mandate that the writers and casters totally failed to live up to; yet, out of a very limited capacity for interesting writing, the guest writers and the actors did manage to do some good work here and there in the first two seasons. Finally, Bermaga's hands came off the reigns long enough for Season 3 to be really interesting, but the first quarter or third of Season 4 was again, completely useless, and basically like Season 1 but with a "let's write sequential arcs" tint.
They did manage to (mostly) get away from Trek's predisposition for taking Dr. Seussian moral high grounds and trying to ethnocentrically push this "Starfleet: Fixers of Backward Civilizations" motif that permeated TNG and Voyager. Interestingly, all the core writers and showrunners migrated from TNG to Voyager and DS9 was by far the superior production. It's not surprising that when a few DS9 writers showed up on Enterprise, sci-fi gold resulted.
In short? It haphazardly managed to produce some good stuff despite absolutely awful, creatively exhausted hacks sitting behind the wheel. And some of the cast pulled some embers out of this dead fire here and there - mostly Trip, T'Pol, Phlox, and Archer in Season 3.
They did manage to (mostly) get away from Trek's predisposition for taking Dr. Seussian moral high grounds and trying to ethnocentrically push this "Starfleet: Fixers of Backward Civilizations" motif that permeated TNG and Voyager. Interestingly, all the core writers and showrunners migrated from TNG to Voyager and DS9 was by far the superior production. It's not surprising that when a few DS9 writers showed up on Enterprise, sci-fi gold resulted.
In short? It haphazardly managed to produce some good stuff despite absolutely awful, creatively exhausted hacks sitting behind the wheel. And some of the cast pulled some embers out of this dead fire here and there - mostly Trip, T'Pol, Phlox, and Archer in Season 3.
While I wouldn't call the people who dislike "Masks" nuts, I definitely appreciated it. Granted, most of TNG I saw as a child and have not re-watched since, but it made a strong impression on me from a visual standpoint.
I didn't mind the song, and I particularly liked what was done with the opening montage. You could actually feel like ENT was connected in some way to the world we knew.
Which brings me to my thoughts on the series. I am not one of those who would like to wipe ENT from canon, by any means. It's actually TOS that sticks out to me at times, as not "fitting" right, compared to the other four, for a number of reasons--visual, aesthetic, and social. From a visual standpoint, I would say that aside from DS9, the set and costume designers demonstrated the most thought we've seen from them, hands down. You could actually visualize the technology aboard the Enterprise as being in some way related to what we know. There were elements that reminded me very strongly of the interior of the space shuttle or the Apollo capsules, as well as nods to TOS. But the best thing visually, believe it or not, were actually the uniforms. They were actual flight suits. They were practical, looked like they could've been inspired by NASA, and NOT there for titillation.
Which brings me to a problem I had with the show: the obvious attempts to pander to the shallow end of the male demographic. The whole decon and neuropressure massage thing was gratuitous. Now, I think decon as a concept makes good sense...and especially in light of some of the possible discoveries we are now finding about real life. But there is NO way that is at all what it would be like. They should have based it on the very un-sexy procedures that go on when you leave a Level 4 biolab. Yeah, you'd give up the sex appeal, but it would work with the other visual elements of the series that are a clear bridge between our world and TOS.
I just don't have any patience, though, with substituting sex for plot. Sex can work as part of a plot, but if it's just a blatant insertion of eye candy, it doesn't work at all.
As a concept, ENT had tremendous promise. Unfortunately, it was not executed as well as it could have been. Some of the writing I fault...but I also fault the casting.
I am going to say it: I think that Scott Bakula was miscast. I say that as a fan of his, too, not a detractor. He is far better in roles that do not require him to demonstrate a command presence (even the flawed command presence we would expect in this context). Given this, I think that he and the writers never met up, and the material for this character fell short. And that, unfortunately, set a tone for the series.
Now, unlike some, I DO think very well of the exploration of the Vulcans. Contrary to their propaganda, they were very RARELY ever paragons of tolerance. Far from it. The development of their race on ENT was very much in line with what I thought they would have been like.
I admit I wish that I'd stuck with the series to watch Seasons 3 and 4, which I heard were very good.
As a fanfic writer, I do choose to acknowledge ENT as canon...though I am not sure I fully acknowledge VOY. So, ENT is not the worst, for me, but I think it had more promise that was never fulfilled.
Hate the song. Would have preferred this:
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfWgU1fj3nM[/yt]
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfWgU1fj3nM[/yt]
