What if the Original first officer was never killed?

[C.E. Evans]

In general, I agree with you but I would also expect their professional military combat reflexes to kick in at that moment, instilled by training and drilling, on maximizing their odds of survival.

Oh, I forgot, Starfleet isn't a military ...

It likely would have been different if it was an enemy ship approaching, but a displacement wave of unknown strength...it could either rock the ship gently or rock the ship hard. I think when Cavit saw it was going to do far worse than rock the ship...

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[Oddish]

It was strangely convenient that Voyager lost the exact people there "happened" to be outside replacements for. Cavit was replaced by Chakotay. The chief engineer was replaced by Torres (I know some argue that shouldn't have happened, but we'll set that aside for now). And Stadi was replaced by Paris. And while both ships lost their doctors, Voyager just happened to have a holographic backup.

 

[at Quark's]

Which makes me wonder. Did Chakotay's Maquis crew also suffer any fatalities when they were transported to the DQ? Can't recall any mention of that (but perhaps there was?).

Or was the Val Jean better suited to that kind of transport?

 

[C.E. Evans]

Which makes me wonder. Did Chakotay's Maquis crew also suffer any fatalities when they were transported to the DQ? Can't recall any mention of that (but perhaps there was?).

Or was the Val Jean better suited to that kind of transport?

Being a smaller ship. there may have been less room for its crew to be thrown around in. There may also have been fewer console panels--meaning less exploding console panels for people to be around.

 

[Oddish]

I would think they had a doctor or combat medic onboard. Since we never see them, I assume they were killed.

 

[at Quark's]

Or he was woefully unqualified compared to Tom Paris, who had the awesome credentials of studying a full two semesters of Biochemistry on Starfleet Academy.

<Not even sure if that's supposed to mean biochemistry as a main focus, or just any of say 20 subjects he had to study those semesters>

But you're probably right.

 

[Farscape One]

A lot of those deaths on Voyager, if the doctor and nurse were any indication, happened because of exploding consoles. Because Starfleet never believed in surge protectors.

Joking aside, consoles exploding and various bulkheads parts hitting the crew were the killers.

Perhaps the reason why we don't hear about deaths on the Maquis ship, as stated above, was because it's compact. In a way, every person almost acted like a pillow for each other, for lack of a better metaphor.

 

[at Quark's]

The enterprise D seems to have even more consoles and more space- so would the death toll have been higher still?

As for those inexplicably exploding consoles, perhaps Starfleet should start a campaign "LCARS and alcohol are OK, but LCARS and flying don't mix".

 

[Finn]

It was strangely convenient that Voyager lost the exact people there "happened" to be outside replacements for. Cavit was replaced by Chakotay. The chief engineer was replaced by Torres (I know some argue that shouldn't have happened, but we'll set that aside for now). And Stadi was replaced by Paris. And while both ships lost their doctors, Voyager just happened to have a holographic backup.

Who said the Maquis crewmembers who survived being pulled into the DQ perfectly replaced every Starfleet who was killed...? I don't think they ever stated how many Maquis joined and how many Starfleet folks died in Caretaker.



As for the characters you mentioned...because they are the cast... Chakotay was a high value due to his Starfleet training, and as B'elanna...there were bound to be a couple of engineers among the Maquis. As for Paris, they needed a pilot who knew the Badlands and Stadi didn't.

Also, I don't recall there being a doctor on Chakotay's ship

 

[DonIago]

^You're kind of using real-world reasons to justify the in-universe plot machinations though. It is a little convenient that there's surviving Maquis and other non-Starfleet crew who are perfectly situated to take the place of the Voyager crew who perished, with the only significant case of potential overlap that we see being the Torres/Carey tension that lasts for a single episode.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I don't recall there being a doctor on Chakotay's ship

We actually know very little about the crew of the Val Jean. There was, what, one scene in total that takes place aboard that ship? We had almost no chance to see Chakotay's crew in action before they got pulled into the DQ.

For all we know, they DID have a doctor, or at least a medical corpsman or two.

 

[Farscape One]

In "PARALLAX", Janeway mentions they needed an astrogation plotter and chief transporter officer in addition to the CMO and Chief Engineer. We know from dialogue in "CARETAKER" that the Chief Engineer, Stadi, CMO, and Nurse were killed. Chakotay is already XO, since he replaced Cavit. The first two I mentioned were likely other casualties. (Unless Voyager launched without either of those positions filled... something I doubt.) It sounded like she was about to go on, but Chakotay at that moment gave her a padd with Maquis who he thought would be good candidates as officers.

In season 7's "REPRESSION", we see the Mess Hall full of former Maquis. It looked like around 30, which I think dialogue in other episodes said about 1/4 of the crew is Maquis. A little imprecise, but it works.

(One of my gripes about the show was how they were all over the place with their crew count. Even after losing a LOT of people over the years, and even accounting for gains like Seven, Naomi, and the Borg kids, it never worked out correctly on screen. Particularly frustrating were all the former Maquis deaths in season 2... Kurt Bendera, Michael Jonas, Lon Suder, Hogan. You can count Seska, too, as she was portraying as one while spying on the Maquis.)

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

Had Cavit always been destined to survive then Kim might've been a minor speaking role and killed in transit or a special guest appearance and killed as a result of the Caretakers experiment, leaving the Ops Manager role open for Chakotay, who'd also be the second officer to make his place as the "token Maquis" all the more obvious.

I can definitely see Cavit as putting up more of an argument with Janeway in how to do things, especially with a bunch of terrorists running loose on the ship, not to mention Paris at the helm, a hologram replacing his buddy, and a couple of natives whose allegiances aren't known.

 

[Oddish]

can definitely see Cavit as putting up more of an argument with Janeway in how to do things, especially with a bunch of terrorists running loose on the ship, not to mention Paris at the helm, a hologram replacing his buddy, and a couple of natives whose allegiances aren't known.

And that would be a good thing, IMO.

 

[Summer Solstice]

In season 7's "REPRESSION", we see the Mess Hall full of former Maquis. It looked like around 30, which I think dialogue in other episodes said about 1/4 of the crew is Maquis. A little imprecise, but it works.

(One of my gripes about the show was how they were all over the place with their crew count. Even after losing a LOT of people over the years, and even accounting for gains like Seven, Naomi, and the Borg kids, it never worked out correctly on screen. Particularly frustrating were all the former Maquis deaths in season 2... Kurt Bendera, Michael Jonas, Lon Suder, Hogan. You can count Seska, too, as she was portraying as one while spying on the Maquis.)

In "Displaced" I think the crew count is 148, but it wasn't obvious to me whether that included the EMH. The crew count didn't jump out at me as being wrong until I think it was in season 6 when the number given was 150. Even with the Borg kids, they lost more people than that.

Had Cavit always been destined to survive then Kim might've been a minor speaking role and killed in transit or a special guest appearance and killed as a result of the Caretakers experiment, leaving the Ops Manager role open for Chakotay, who'd also be the second officer to make his place as the "token Maquis" all the more obvious.

I can definitely see Cavit as putting up more of an argument with Janeway in how to do things, especially with a bunch of terrorists running loose on the ship, not to mention Paris at the helm, a hologram replacing his buddy, and a couple of natives whose allegiances aren't known.

Early on, it was interesting to see the interactions between Harry and B'Elanna as a way of seeing how the Starfleet and Maquis crews were getting along. Without Kim we would lose that but adding Cavit would give more conflict.

 

[at Quark's]

Memory alpha lists 22 named crewmembers of the Val Jean, and 12 unnamed. So, if true (and I'm not going to check it), that would mean a crew complement of at least 34 and that's not even taking into account the possible casualties they suffered or the crewmen we simply never saw or heard about.

Moreover those guys were on assignments involving combat with the Cardassians. I would think a 34-sized crew (but probably significantly larger) expecting to do combat on some occasions would take with them one or a few persons with at least a rudimentary level of medical schooling.

 

[Oddish]

Without Kim we would lose that but adding Cavit would give more conflict.

Possibly Harry's loss could have been used to better dramatic effect than his essentially forgettable life. Possibly, his loss could be the devastating, heart-wrenching event that leads to the two sides beginning to make peace and work together. As the last holdout against an accord with the Maquis, Cavit could have been the most profoundly affected.

I would think a 34-sized crew (but probably significantly larger) expecting to do combat on some occasions would take with them one or a few persons with at least a rudimentary level of medical

Probably a few combat medic types. They might have all been lost in the accident, though. Or, more valuable somewhere else.

 

[DonIago]

^Their fault for all being huddled around a medical console when the displacement wave hit them.

 

[Farscape One]

To be fair, the doctor's office was the only area that had chairs. If you are bracing for impact, it's better to sit than srand against a bulkhead.

 

[WarpTenLizard]

With a character as complex and unique as Commander Cabbage, or whatever his name was, the possibilities are endless!

• He and Chakotay might share the role of First Officer, with Commander Cadburry grimacing irritably while Chakotay gives his impassioned hippie speeches and tells legends.
• And when Chakotay claims something is "too risky," Cavalry could demonstrate by jogging towards the risky thing.
• The two XOs might bond over their bland gray buzzcuts, until Season 3, when they fight over the last bottle of black shoe polish to dye their hair.
• He could grimace irritably when welcoming Seven of Nine aboard
• When Kes has her premonition and screams at the away team to get out of the Borg cube, Commander Cavity-Search would instead jog towards the Borg drones.
• After being assimilated, Commander Catspit wouldn't feel any different, except for being bald.
• He could grimace irritably at the Borg Queen
• When B'Elanna shouts that the Warp Core is going to breach, Commander Cadaver would jog over to the Warp Core to get a better look
• "Captain Proton: Rise of the Silver Jogger," in which he could wear a shinny speedo and grimace irritably while jogging right into Chaotica's Death Beam
• He could jog towards Species 8472 while grimacing irritably

....just off the top of my head.