What If: Star Trek (TMP)

[Data Holmes]

Some real interesting ideas in this thread.


I always had an idea on some "reworkings" for TMP, as if I were in charge.




I would have had the opening be the crew of epsilon nine watching a battle between a klingon fleet and romulian fleet of ships near a previously uncharted nebula inside of klingon space. Set the scene that those two have been waring after a falling apart of their alliance. Durring the battle several of the ships try and make a run into the nebula... this is when suddenly plasma "bursts" fly out of the nebula cloud and "waporize" the closest ships on both sides.

This catches the starfleet crew off guard who go from "board, popcorn, night watchmen" mode to "oh, shit! Wat was that!" mode and call in commander branch.

As they moniter several more ships are zapped, and the nebula starts to move, accelerating slowly at first but getting toward light speed, on a course for earth.

Then cut to spock and all... this part remains largly unchanged but tightened a little with the "preachings" cut down.

Then cut to starfleet headquarters, Kirk rushing to a meeting with Nogura. Search is right, this scene is needed to show that kirk is not happy with riding a desk, and uses this "turn of events" to get an off world mission. Kirk is given overall command of the mission with the enterprise and another ship, Decker remains captain of the enterprise.

Enterprise is rushed out of dock, and has main drive trouble. Kirk orders the other ship ahead (a mistake) while they attempt to fix the problem and continue under high sublight speed.

The crew watches the other ship get blasted by the nebula and Decker starts to question Kirks ability in private. This creats a hostile relationship between the two.

Spock shows up and fixes the problem with the drive. This part also remains largly unchanged.

When they intercept the intruder, kirk orders decker to go in to the heart of the cloud. Decker refuses and kirk assumes command of the enterprise. They get shot at and decker has a "see" moment and McCoy gives the "pushing speech".

Spock and decker make contact, this causes the intruder to pause. and the enterprise enters the cloud.

THis segment is amazing, but needs to be trimmed.

Most of the stuff inside the cloud happens the same: Probe takes Ilia, Ilia probe shows up, intruder starts back toward earth but drops it's "cloud cover", Decker gets assigned to work with the Ilia probe because of their past...

Spock tries to mind meld with the Ilia probe, but gets "overloaded". In sickbay, Kirk spock and McCoy put it together from the info spock got that it was a human probe and that it landed on a machine planet some time ago. That it was sent back but was damaged by something and went dormant, it's propulsion system acting like a magnet to solar dust creating the nebula around it. That it's become intelligent and is looking to "complete it's mission".

When they reach earth V'ger sends out it's signal.

No response makes the Ilia probe ask the crew why the creator didn't respond...

This makes them think what she/it ment by "the creator". The big three are stumped and decker comes up with the "god in their own image" thought, needing to see v'ger deal...

Ilia probe agrees and the "inner door" opens. At this moment a ship decloaks from underneth the enterprise and starts to rush in. A klingon ship.

The enterprise follows and the klingons broadcast a "we claim this ship" message to the enterprise. They start to transport klingon solders down toward where the signal is comming from and one of the solders shoots the antenna cluster as the enterprise trys to transmit the code.

Kirk determins that they need to beam down and enter the code to the probe manually.

They beam into a compartment and make their way to the probe unit. as they get close kirk and decker realize that someone has to run over to it and enter the code while the others hols back the klingons.

kirk says he will go but the ilia probe holds his arm and stops him... the look to decker and he sees. He says ok and decker goes with the ilia probe.

As decker starts to enter the code in under fire he gets hit. The crew and kirk try and get to him, but he tells them no. He finishes the code and the light show starts. McCoy and Spock pull Kirk back and they return to the beam cordinates.

Once they are back on the ship it starts pulling back heading for the enterence to the tube and they recieve a message from decker over the intercom, he's there and not at the same time. Think Dave from the end of 2010 when he's talking to HAL.

Says something like "It's ok, Jim. They need you more than they needed me. You will see..." then the signal disapears.

Kirk looks confused, spock does the eyebrow, and McCoy says "what the hell does that mean?"

The ship rocks and kirk says, "lets get to the bridge".

Light show as the V'ger craft phases out, and the enterprise is left floating in space over earth. End scene plays as it does in the film.

 

[trevanian]

TREK THE LOST YEARS by Gross is a good unauthorized book on the failed trek revivals.

There has not been a definitive volume on this era yet, though Pocket did produce a well-intended, but error-riddled book on PHASE II. There's a thread on TITANS here right now, and you can probably find a few old ones on it as well.

OH I didn't know Phase II was error filled. I don't have the book with me anymore but I wonder how much was un-information now =/.

Mostly a lot of misidentifying tech folk. Reeves-Stevenses didn't seem to know the difference between Magicam and Brick Price movie miniatures as I recall, but they DID have access to more info than anybody else, so parts are very useful.

 

[trevanian]

There's a thread on TITANS here right now, and you can probably find a few old ones on it as well.

I don't see any thread in this forum...


CuttingEdge

planet of the titans revisited

 

[ClayinCA]

But that is SO interesting about the TNG-style.

I always watched TMP and thought "wow, this doesn't feel like TOS, this doesn't feel like the later movies (obviously), this feels like TNG."

I always thought the same thing. In fact, it's interesting to note that the three times when Gene Roddenberry was allowed to have the most control over the kind of Star Trek he wanted to make, you get "The Cage," Star Trek: The Motion Picture, and Star Trek: The Next Generation, and all three of those are much more like each other than they are like the original series.

 

[captcalhoun]

they shooulda made Kitumba...

 

[Gagarin]

But that is SO interesting about the TNG-style.

I always watched TMP and thought "wow, this doesn't feel like TOS, this doesn't feel like the later movies (obviously), this feels like TNG."

I always thought the same thing. In fact, it's interesting to note that the three times when Gene Roddenberry was allowed to have the most control over the kind of Star Trek he wanted to make, you get "The Cage," Star Trek: The Motion Picture, and Star Trek: The Next Generation, and all three of those are much more like each other than they are like the original series.

Whoa.
You're right.

 

[DaleC76]

Already. I actually like TMP overall story-plot, and its my favorite Trek film along with TWOK. TMP is good but it had serious production/editing problems. I would demanded if i was Executive Producer / Director time to finish it right. I would add more character moment and more action. I would redesign uniforms so it would look more like TOS(but with darker tone f.e. maroon red, Navy blue e.c.c.).
During Klingon's attack on Vger i would have let one Klingon ship escape tossed out the wormhole scene. I would then add scene instead where Enterprise is ambushed by declocking Klingon ship that escape earlier. Klingon managed to disable Enterprise shield for a moment and when it is arming torpedo for the kill Vger energy pulse destroys the Klingon ship and save the Enterprise just in time.

I think having Decker & Illia merge is better because of their prior relationship. I would be okey if Kirk had offered himself before Decker but for Illia probe to reject him and then cut to scene where Illia look at Decker then they merged..

I agree with your suggestions. Having Kirk merge with Ilya doesn't make sense. As you said, it was their prior relationship that drives that scene. What they could have done to make Kirk more proactive? Having Decker merge with Ilya should have been the point of the last act of the movie, with Kirk and others in agreement. And THAT is when your Klingon ship/commander makes his unexpected return. Have Kirk and company locked in some kind of space battle, decoying enough time so that Decker can make to where he has to go, with Ilya, the heart of Voyager, so that the merge can happen.

Rob

I've always thought Kirk was a little weak in the movie, with not enough to do.

I would have combined the Decker and Ilia parts. Kirk has to take the Enterprise from a female captain, who is also a former lover - adding a little more drama to the bridge scenes. After the female captain is abducted, Kirk is the one who has to awaken her memories.

At the end of the movie, Kirk combines with V'ger, with results similar to Decker's original fate, or perhaps V'ger just takes what it needs from Kirk, leaving him shaken, but intact as the movie ends. In this version the female captain would probably also end up being 'alive' and restored.

 

[ClayinCA]

But that is SO interesting about the TNG-style.

I always watched TMP and thought "wow, this doesn't feel like TOS, this doesn't feel like the later movies (obviously), this feels like TNG."

I always thought the same thing. In fact, it's interesting to note that the three times when Gene Roddenberry was allowed to have the most control over the kind of Star Trek he wanted to make, you get "The Cage," Star Trek: The Motion Picture, and Star Trek: The Next Generation, and all three of those are much more like each other than they are like the original series.

Whoa.
You're right.

Thank you! I love being right.

 

[TigerOfDarkness]

I'd change V'Ger and the ending, bringing in some ideas from Harlan Ellison's TMP pitch and The Planet Of The Titans and have Kirk and co discover that V'Ger was launched 65 million years ago by intelligent dinosaurs. V'Ger blames mammals (and so humans) for destroying the dinosaurs (it found the info in the Enterprises memory banks).

V'Ger decides to warn the dinosaurs and slingshots around the galactic core, taking the Enterprise with it, back 65 million years.

Unfortunately, the tidal forces wreck V'Ger, though the Enterprise is stil manoeuverable. The Enterprise escapes just in time to see the now lifeless hulk of V'Ger impact with the Earth and whipe out the dinosaurs.

A trip to the Gaurdian Of Forever planet (maybe in a sequel) gets the Enterprise back home.

 

[CuttingEdge100]

TigerOfDarkness,

I'd change V'Ger and the ending, bringing in some ideas from Harlan Ellison's TMP pitch

What was Harlan Ellison's TMP pitch?


CuttingEdge100

 

[Maurice]

I'd change V'Ger and the ending, bringing in some ideas from Harlan Ellison's TMP pitch and The Planet Of The Titans and have Kirk and co discover that V'Ger was launched 65 million years ago by intelligent dinosaurs. V'Ger blames mammals (and so humans) for destroying the dinosaurs (it found the info in the Enterprises memory banks).

V'Ger decides to warn the dinosaurs and slingshots around the galactic core, taking the Enterprise with it, back 65 million years.

Unfortunately, the tidal forces wreck V'Ger, though the Enterprise is stil manoeuverable. The Enterprise escapes just in time to see the now lifeless hulk of V'Ger impact with the Earth and whipe out the dinosaurs.

A trip to the Gaurdian Of Forever planet (maybe in a sequel) gets the Enterprise back home.

Frankly, that's terrible. The heroes do what, watch as V'ger sucks them back in time and crashes? That makes them spectators.

 

[Blip]

Some real interesting ideas in this thread.


I always had an idea on some "reworkings" for TMP, as if I were in charge.




I would have had the opening be the crew of epsilon nine watching a battle between a klingon fleet and romulian fleet of ships near a previously uncharted nebula inside of klingon space. Set the scene that those two have been waring after a falling apart of their alliance. Durring the battle several of the ships try and make a run into the nebula... this is when suddenly plasma "bursts" fly out of the nebula cloud and "waporize" the closest ships on both sides.

This catches the starfleet crew off guard who go from "board, popcorn, night watchmen" mode to "oh, shit! Wat was that!" mode and call in commander branch.

As they moniter several more ships are zapped, and the nebula starts to move, accelerating slowly at first but getting toward light speed, on a course for earth.

Then cut to spock and all... this part remains largly unchanged but tightened a little with the "preachings" cut down.

Then cut to starfleet headquarters, Kirk rushing to a meeting with Nogura. Search is right, this scene is needed to show that kirk is not happy with riding a desk, and uses this "turn of events" to get an off world mission. Kirk is given overall command of the mission with the enterprise and another ship, Decker remains captain of the enterprise.

Enterprise is rushed out of dock, and has main drive trouble. Kirk orders the other ship ahead (a mistake) while they attempt to fix the problem and continue under high sublight speed.

The crew watches the other ship get blasted by the nebula and Decker starts to question Kirks ability in private. This creats a hostile relationship between the two.

Spock shows up and fixes the problem with the drive. This part also remains largly unchanged.

When they intercept the intruder, kirk orders decker to go in to the heart of the cloud. Decker refuses and kirk assumes command of the enterprise. They get shot at and decker has a "see" moment and McCoy gives the "pushing speech".

Spock and decker make contact, this causes the intruder to pause. and the enterprise enters the cloud.

THis segment is amazing, but needs to be trimmed.

Most of the stuff inside the cloud happens the same: Probe takes Ilia, Ilia probe shows up, intruder starts back toward earth but drops it's "cloud cover", Decker gets assigned to work with the Ilia probe because of their past...

Spock tries to mind meld with the Ilia probe, but gets "overloaded". In sickbay, Kirk spock and McCoy put it together from the info spock got that it was a human probe and that it landed on a machine planet some time ago. That it was sent back but was damaged by something and went dormant, it's propulsion system acting like a magnet to solar dust creating the nebula around it. That it's become intelligent and is looking to "complete it's mission".

When they reach earth V'ger sends out it's signal.

No response makes the Ilia probe ask the crew why the creator didn't respond...

This makes them think what she/it ment by "the creator". The big three are stumped and decker comes up with the "god in their own image" thought, needing to see v'ger deal...

Ilia probe agrees and the "inner door" opens. At this moment a ship decloaks from underneth the enterprise and starts to rush in. A klingon ship.

The enterprise follows and the klingons broadcast a "we claim this ship" message to the enterprise. They start to transport klingon solders down toward where the signal is comming from and one of the solders shoots the antenna cluster as the enterprise trys to transmit the code.

Kirk determins that they need to beam down and enter the code to the probe manually.

They beam into a compartment and make their way to the probe unit. as they get close kirk and decker realize that someone has to run over to it and enter the code while the others hols back the klingons.

kirk says he will go but the ilia probe holds his arm and stops him... the look to decker and he sees. He says ok and decker goes with the ilia probe.

As decker starts to enter the code in under fire he gets hit. The crew and kirk try and get to him, but he tells them no. He finishes the code and the light show starts. McCoy and Spock pull Kirk back and they return to the beam cordinates.

Once they are back on the ship it starts pulling back heading for the enterence to the tube and they recieve a message from decker over the intercom, he's there and not at the same time. Think Dave from the end of 2010 when he's talking to HAL.

Says something like "It's ok, Jim. They need you more than they needed me. You will see..." then the signal disapears.

Kirk looks confused, spock does the eyebrow, and McCoy says "what the hell does that mean?"

The ship rocks and kirk says, "lets get to the bridge".

Light show as the V'ger craft phases out, and the enterprise is left floating in space over earth. End scene plays as it does in the film.

I love it - definitely the best idea I've seen so far in this thread.

 

[TigerOfDarkness]

TigerOfDarkness,

I'd change V'Ger and the ending, bringing in some ideas from Harlan Ellison's TMP pitch

What was Harlan Ellison's TMP pitch?


CuttingEdge100

From what I've read, he story involved the time-line being changed and intelligent reptiles being the dominant life on Earth. I don't recall much else, though.

I'd change V'Ger and the ending, bringing in some ideas from Harlan Ellison's TMP pitch and The Planet Of The Titans and have Kirk and co discover that V'Ger was launched 65 million years ago by intelligent dinosaurs. V'Ger blames mammals (and so humans) for destroying the dinosaurs (it found the info in the Enterprises memory banks).

V'Ger decides to warn the dinosaurs and slingshots around the galactic core, taking the Enterprise with it, back 65 million years.

Unfortunately, the tidal forces wreck V'Ger, though the Enterprise is stil manoeuverable. The Enterprise escapes just in time to see the now lifeless hulk of V'Ger impact with the Earth and whipe out the dinosaurs.

A trip to the Gaurdian Of Forever planet (maybe in a sequel) gets the Enterprise back home.

Frankly, that's terrible. The heroes do what, watch as V'ger sucks them back in time and crashes? That makes them spectators.

Instead of spectating as Decker saves us all? Thanks for reading it though.

I considered afterwards that maybe it would be better (and cheaper) if the Enterprise escaped before V'Ger slingshots and they find V'Ger's remains in the Gulf of Mexico crater and deduce what happened and note the irony etc., but you have a point.

 

[Maurice]

As to the posts that mention bringing Klingons back later in the script, they are pointless attempts to up the action quotient and would only be sound and fury signifying nothing. V'ger IS the threat, The biggest threat EVER, and you could've had plenty of action as the crew tries to deal with it, if that's what you wanted.

 

[Data Holmes]

Some real interesting ideas in this thread.


I always had an idea on some "reworkings" for TMP, as if I were in charge.




I would have had the opening be the crew of epsilon nine watching a battle between a klingon fleet and romulian fleet of ships near a previously uncharted nebula inside of klingon space. Set the scene that those two have been waring after a falling apart of their alliance. Durring the battle several of the ships try and make a run into the nebula... this is when suddenly plasma "bursts" fly out of the nebula cloud and "waporize" the closest ships on both sides.

This catches the starfleet crew off guard who go from "board, popcorn, night watchmen" mode to "oh, shit! Wat was that!" mode and call in commander branch.

As they moniter several more ships are zapped, and the nebula starts to move, accelerating slowly at first but getting toward light speed, on a course for earth.

Then cut to spock and all... this part remains largly unchanged but tightened a little with the "preachings" cut down.

Then cut to starfleet headquarters, Kirk rushing to a meeting with Nogura. Search is right, this scene is needed to show that kirk is not happy with riding a desk, and uses this "turn of events" to get an off world mission. Kirk is given overall command of the mission with the enterprise and another ship, Decker remains captain of the enterprise.

Enterprise is rushed out of dock, and has main drive trouble. Kirk orders the other ship ahead (a mistake) while they attempt to fix the problem and continue under high sublight speed.

The crew watches the other ship get blasted by the nebula and Decker starts to question Kirks ability in private. This creats a hostile relationship between the two.

Spock shows up and fixes the problem with the drive. This part also remains largly unchanged.

When they intercept the intruder, kirk orders decker to go in to the heart of the cloud. Decker refuses and kirk assumes command of the enterprise. They get shot at and decker has a "see" moment and McCoy gives the "pushing speech".

Spock and decker make contact, this causes the intruder to pause. and the enterprise enters the cloud.

THis segment is amazing, but needs to be trimmed.

Most of the stuff inside the cloud happens the same: Probe takes Ilia, Ilia probe shows up, intruder starts back toward earth but drops it's "cloud cover", Decker gets assigned to work with the Ilia probe because of their past...

Spock tries to mind meld with the Ilia probe, but gets "overloaded". In sickbay, Kirk spock and McCoy put it together from the info spock got that it was a human probe and that it landed on a machine planet some time ago. That it was sent back but was damaged by something and went dormant, it's propulsion system acting like a magnet to solar dust creating the nebula around it. That it's become intelligent and is looking to "complete it's mission".

When they reach earth V'ger sends out it's signal.

No response makes the Ilia probe ask the crew why the creator didn't respond...

This makes them think what she/it ment by "the creator". The big three are stumped and decker comes up with the "god in their own image" thought, needing to see v'ger deal...

Ilia probe agrees and the "inner door" opens. At this moment a ship decloaks from underneth the enterprise and starts to rush in. A klingon ship.

The enterprise follows and the klingons broadcast a "we claim this ship" message to the enterprise. They start to transport klingon solders down toward where the signal is comming from and one of the solders shoots the antenna cluster as the enterprise trys to transmit the code.

Kirk determins that they need to beam down and enter the code to the probe manually.

They beam into a compartment and make their way to the probe unit. as they get close kirk and decker realize that someone has to run over to it and enter the code while the others hols back the klingons.

kirk says he will go but the ilia probe holds his arm and stops him... the look to decker and he sees. He says ok and decker goes with the ilia probe.

As decker starts to enter the code in under fire he gets hit. The crew and kirk try and get to him, but he tells them no. He finishes the code and the light show starts. McCoy and Spock pull Kirk back and they return to the beam cordinates.

Once they are back on the ship it starts pulling back heading for the enterence to the tube and they recieve a message from decker over the intercom, he's there and not at the same time. Think Dave from the end of 2010 when he's talking to HAL.

Says something like "It's ok, Jim. They need you more than they needed me. You will see..." then the signal disapears.

Kirk looks confused, spock does the eyebrow, and McCoy says "what the hell does that mean?"

The ship rocks and kirk says, "lets get to the bridge".

Light show as the V'ger craft phases out, and the enterprise is left floating in space over earth. End scene plays as it does in the film.

I love it - definitely the best idea I've seen so far in this thread.

Thanks.

 

[RandyS]

I would have:

1. Chosen a script that wasn't a ripoff of "The Doomsday Machine" and "The Changeling".

2. Never have allowed those endless special effect scenes of the Enterprise's ride through VGER.

3. I would have used the uniforms from movies II-VI, and thrown out the ones from TMP.

4. I would have given Sulu, Scotty, Chekov, and Uhura more to do than just their usual "yes sir" roles.

5. Picked a better opening theme. Something along the lines of the one used in First Contact. If only TNG could have ripped that off instead....

 

[Stardate]

But that is SO interesting about the TNG-style.

I always watched TMP and thought "wow, this doesn't feel like TOS, this doesn't feel like the later movies (obviously), this feels like TNG."

I always thought the same thing. In fact, it's interesting to note that the three times when Gene Roddenberry was allowed to have the most control over the kind of Star Trek he wanted to make, you get "The Cage," Star Trek: The Motion Picture, and Star Trek: The Next Generation, and all three of those are much more like each other than they are like the original series.

This only shows how great Gene Roddenberry was. We are never going to know how ,the Cage, would be received by general public. However TMP would become biggest grossing Trek movie at the box office and 2nd most popular movie in 1979. TNG created by Roddenberry is the most successful Trek series ever when it was on the air.

 

[Stardate]

Alright after rethinking about my suggestion earlier about 1 Klingon escaping then later would battle with Enterprise doesn't really fit with movie plot. I agree that threat is Vger and we should focus on that.

Here are some ideas i have.
1. I would also add Nogura scene into the movie. We need more info how Kirk got his command from Starfleet. I didn't like how Kirk used Vger situation to get Enterprise captain chair back behind Decker back. Admiral Kirk comes as a bully. I would rather let Nogura after briefing him about Vger, ordering Kirk to take command of the Enterprise briefly because of his experience facing the unknown.
2. I would change Epsilon 9, a Starfleet monitoring station to starship USS Epsilon(unknown class) who is monitoring the Klingon border. USS Epsilon is order to intercept the energy cloud when it crosses Federation space. USS Epsilon suffers the same fate being pattern by Vger.
more to follow

 

[Nebusj]

1. I would also add Nogura scene into the movie. We need more info how Kirk got his command from Starfleet. I didn't like how Kirk used Vger situation to get Enterprise captain chair back behind Decker back. Admiral Kirk comes as a bully. I would rather let Nogura after briefing him about Vger, ordering Kirk to take command of the Enterprise briefly because of his experience facing the unknown.

While the Nogura scene might have been worth including, having Kirk be put on the Enterprise against his will makes him a passive character as the movie starts out --- and given the time he spends sitting in a chair watching special effects and the time he spends watching Decker and Ilia-bot have their awkward little date, that leaves him barely breathing on his own initiative. I grant it would add a pleasant little dose of irony to everyone assuming he railroaded Nogura into giving him the Enterprise, but I doubt that would make it up to the audience.

2. I would change Epsilon 9, a Starfleet monitoring station to starship USS Epsilon(unknown class) who is monitoring the Klingon border. USS Epsilon is order to intercept the energy cloud when it crosses Federation space. USS Epsilon suffers the same fate being pattern by Vger.
more to follow

Well ... what's the difference between the USS Epsilon being patterned and the com station being patterned? For the story potential they're pretty much the same, and at least a com station opens up the collection of Star Trek Hardware that we see on screen. We already know there are other starships in the fleet, even if we hadn't seen other designs except in the cartoon.

 

[Stardate]

I grant it would add a pleasant little dose of irony to everyone assuming he railroaded Nogura into giving him the Enterprise, but I doubt that would make it up to the audience.

I do think it would show Kirk in better light for audience.

Well ... what's the difference between the USS Epsilon being patterned and the com station being patterned?

It is always cool seeing different starship class. They did great with Enterprise Refit didn't they.. Also difference is that i found it unrealistic that mighty Starfleet had only Enterprise in intercept range. Having USS Epsilon would make the plot better.