What do we think of Alien 3?

[Tulin]

Interesting. Can you tell us which one they singled out?

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Eh, A3 is pretty much the prototype for all his other works. His "signature" is pretty clear throughout the movie.

And he sure wishes it wasn't... which says a lot about the experience of making the movie but even more about the final product... because lets face it, even if making the movie was terrible for him, if the final product was good he wouldn't be distancing himself from it the way he is.

Fincher gave an interview to The Guardian when Benjamin Button came out. He ends up talking Alien 3:

I had to work on it for two years, got fired off it three times and I had to fight for every single thing. No one hated it more than me; to this day, no one hates it more than me.

He explains some of his reasons for feeling that.

 

[Anwar]

Interesting. Can you tell us which one they singled out?

The scene where Newt and Hicks are cremated while the Alien is being born. The whole "birth/death" thing.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Interesting. Can you tell us which one they singled out?

The scene where Newt and Hicks are cremated while the Alien is being born. The whole "birth/death" thing.

In my opinion, that's the single most powerful scene in the entire Alien saga. I've wept at that scene.

 

[The Wormhole]

I actually enjoy Alien 3. After recentally rewatching the quadrilogy, I find Alien 3 to be surprisingly enjoyable, considering all the criticism it gets. It's not a masterpiece, and I wouldn't call it the best, but it's pretty decent.

 

[Bisz]

The Production staff thought it was good, Fincher is simply a perfectionist who doesn't like it when he's not 100% in control. The "If it was good he'd talk about it!" stuff is just BS by the A3-haters who don't do their homework.

Fincher gave an interview to The Guardian when Benjamin Button came out. He ends up talking Alien 3:

I had to work on it for two years, got fired off it three times and I had to fight for every single thing. No one hated it more than me; to this day, no one hates it more than me.

So, Anwar...

Nice try there but I do believe that was a FAIL.

How firmly is your foot in your mouth now?

How hard is it to spew your gush all over this forum defending a movie thats loathed and despised by its very director?

 

[Allyn Gibson]

The Production staff thought it was good, Fincher is simply a perfectionist who doesn't like it when he's not 100% in control. The "If it was good he'd talk about it!" stuff is just BS by the A3-haters who don't do their homework.

Fincher gave an interview to The Guardian when Benjamin Button came out. He ends up talking Alien 3:

I had to work on it for two years, got fired off it three times and I had to fight for every single thing. No one hated it more than me; to this day, no one hates it more than me.

So, Anwar...

Nice try there but I do believe that was a FAIL.

How firmly is your foot in your mouth now?

How hard is it to spew your gush all over this forum defending a movie thats loathed and despised by its very director?

I have defended (and will defend) Alien 3 to my dying breath. As compromised as the film was by the studio, Fincher's direction works. The editing works. Take the cremation scene, for instance; it's visually poetic. Fincher gave a lot of himself to that movie, as that interview actually makes clear. He had passion for the film. The studio didn't have that passion. The studio didn't even have a vision.

I don't see a disconnect between Anwar's quote and Fincher's interview quote. Fincher hates the film, true, and he's distanced himself from it the past fifteen years. But he hates it because it's a compromised piece of art and it was a difficult creative experience, which is different than the reasons someone like saturn5 has for hating the film, which has to do with its place (or lack thereof, depending upon perspective) in the Alien mythos. Fincher isn't going to judge the film from that viewpoint; his baggage with the film is very different.

 

[saturn5]

Plenty of meaningful character death in both Alien and Aliens, no stereotyping of the characters, they're great and Ripley never becomes Rambo, it's her love for Newt and all the other characters that makes her do the impossible. The characters are very credible and well drawn, reminding me of many soldiers I've served with over the years. And Aliens still works even if you haven't see the Special Edition and don't know about Ripley's daughter.
Ripley is scared of androids BECAUSE of her experience with Ash in Alien!
Also we all loved Alien and it's hardly an action film so the idea that folks don't like A3 because of it's lack of conventional warfare is spurious.
You made a typo, I like stories with action/character/wit/excitment etc and that's why I like Aliens
Thanks Biszc, couldn't have said it myself.
Don't defend Fincher, he's to blame, I remember he once said he killed off Newt because he found her 'annoying'! Jeez, you wonder did he actually ever watch Aliens? He just wanted to make his own crappy gorno flick in space, hijacked the Aliens saga and ruined it.
You like films that spit on the fans? I'm amazed Anwar likes Voyager, that beggars belief.
I wept at the cremation scene because I knew it had just ruined my enjoyment of Alien/Aliens!
As for the bugs, they're ok in every film except AvP:R where you can't make them out.
Just watching Alien 4 whilst I write this and you know it's not half bad, not a patch on the first 2 but still pretty good. Interestingly whilst in Aliens Ripley has to learn to trust Bishop in Alien 4 it's Call who has to learn to trust Ripley.
Got to ask yourself had Alien 3 been the first in the series would anyone have bother to make a sequal? Don't think so whilst they certainly would have with Alien/Aliens. Alien 3 betrays what the saga is all about, Alien has such an ancient, people trapped with monster in remote location theme (the minotaur?) but Scott brings such class to it that it feels brand new. Cameron takes it to a whole new level. Alien 3 is the terrible film Alien could have been, it's like Insemnoid or something. It's bleak tone is totally different to all the other films which have an ending you can feel good about.
Who wants to see Alien 3 where you come away from the cinema feeling, saddened and depressed when you can see Alien/Aliens and come away excited and exilhirated?

 

[Anwar]

Plenty of meaningful character death in both Alien

Yes.

and Aliens,

No.

no stereotyping of the characters, they're great and Ripley never becomes Rambo,

The entire cast of Aliens were stereotypes, and Ripley IS just She-Rambo (improbably).

it's her love for Newt and all the other characters that makes her do the impossible.

Her "love" for Newt didn't make sense either, she was just projecting her feelings of loss of her REAL daughter onto Newt. She was Ripley's "rebound" and when she died in A3 Ripley realized "Wait, I didn't even know her for a day..." and grieved more appropriately for EVERYONE she lost. Far better than she grieved in Aliens.

Also we all loved Alien and it's hardly an action film so the idea that folks don't like A3 because of it's lack of conventional warfare is spurious.

It's exactly because of lack of warfare. With Alien no one had any expectations of the movie, but after Aliens the new audience were actionholics who wouldn't tolerate non-action.

Don't defend Fincher, he's to blame, I remember he once said he killed off Newt because he found her 'annoying'!

I don't defend, I PRAISE.

Jeez, you wonder did he actually ever watch Aliens? He just wanted to make his own crappy gorno flick in space, hijacked the Aliens saga and ruined it.

He restored the spirit of the saga.

You like films that spit on the fans? I'm amazed Anwar likes Voyager, that beggars belief.

Welcome to the world where people don't all like generic mainstream stuff.

And if the audience DESERVED to be spat at, then yes I'm okay with it.

Got to ask yourself had Alien 3 been the first in the series would anyone have bother to make a sequal?

Yes, but the next cast would have to be totally new characters.

Who wants to see Alien 3 where you come away from the cinema feeling, saddened and depressed when you can see Alien/Aliens and come away excited and exilhirated?

People with stronger stomachs and brains capable of comprehending more than action scenes.

 

[Admiral James Kirk]

Anwar, you're a tougher man than me. I stopped trying to persuade people when I realized their minds were totally closed off to the idea of Alien 3 not being a horrible film. The problem is that if an opinion gets repeated often enough it becomes a fact even though it's just an opinion. Personally I don't think these people are Alien fans so much as they are AlienS fans. They're no different from all those so-called Star Wars fans who are actually just Empire Strikes Back fans and slam every SW movie including the original because it isn't just like Empire. You can't talk to these people. They're beyond thinking. They have all the ability to think for themselves as a suicide bomber and about as pleasant to be around most of the time.

 

[MeanJoePhaser]

Ripley should've died in the infirmary instead of Charles Dance's character, and he and Charles Dutton fight over leadership...who's the CHARLES IN CHARGE.

There's a subtle in joke that both men are wearing Chuck Taylor Converses.

Plus Charlie Brown graffiti.

Also, there's an alien loose, badly rendered by cruddy CGI.

At the climax Charles Bishop Weyland The 86th appears, and reveals he is NOT an android but a replicant...Bladerunner fans gush...everyone goes home, except the alien who jumps in the molten pit because he failed to save the queen. "God save the Queen" plays over the closing credits, along with blooper reels ala SMOKEY AND THE BANDIT 2.

PLANS FOR ALIEN 4 PROCEED AT LESS THAN LUDICROUS SPEED.

 

[Bisz]

They're beyond thinking. They have all the ability to think for themselves as a suicide bomber and about as pleasant to be around most of the time.

Ah shit! Your're on to me... there go my weekend plans

 

[saturn5]

Lets not make this personal, keep it polite.

The central argument here seems to be that we all agree Alien 3 is a bleak and depressing film that quite deliberately abuses the fans of Alien/Aliens. Now some people seem to like that whilst others understandably feel aggrieved. There's little common ground between the 2 sides. According to the polls we've posted Alien 3 defenders are in a slight majority to the haters (33 votes for -28 votes against) whilst Aliens is by far the most popular of all the saga, more votes than all the rest put together, Aliens 18, Alien 14 and Alien3 2 (and I think we can all guess who that was!).

It's pretty obvious that the faults picked with Aliens are only to try and defend A3 which obviously detracts from it's predecessor

 

[Smiley]

Alien 3 has its moments, but I don't think it's a good movie. Putting aside whether it follows from either of the first two films, I have trouble keeping straight who the characters are and what the geography of the prison is. I find it hard to muster up any enthusiasm for anyone besides Ripley and sometimes Dutton. The workprint is slightly better than the theatrical version, but I have no real interest in seeing the movie in any form again.

 

[Neutral Zone]

I though it was a great film. Problem is that it was the 3rd film and by this time people were getting tired of the whole thing. The prison planet scenario and twist at the end was a great concept and should have killed of the films and left it at a trilogy. The 4th one was a goofy story with the DNA and continual working on a super Ripley.

 

[MeanJoePhaser]

I though it was a great film. Problem is that it was the 3rd film and by this time people were getting tired of the whole thing. The prison planet scenario and twist at the end was a great concept and should have killed of the films and left it at a trilogy. The 4th one was a goofy story with the DNA and continual working on a super Ripley.

It was worth it to see Ripley make that hoop shot. Also, the fanboy dream of a robot Winona Ryder.

 

[Deckerd]

Apparently Ron Perlman nearly ruined that shot because he broke character and started laughing when she did it. The had to do some nifty editing. The unedited footage you can hear everyone else whooping in disbelief.

 

[saturn5]

I though it was a great film. Problem is that it was the 3rd film and by this time people were getting tired of the whole thing. The prison planet scenario and twist at the end was a great concept and should have killed of the films and left it at a trilogy. The 4th one was a goofy story with the DNA and continual working on a super Ripley.

It was worth it to see Ripley make that hoop shot. Also, the fanboy dream of a robot Winona Ryder.

Plenty of good stuff about Alien 4, IT is the underappreciated ep of the saga;

1. Great opening sequence with Ripley's voiceover and the scientists clustered around the clone tube

2. Kim Flower's ass is TERRIFIC, just a peach

3. Obvious that Joss has the beginning of Firefly here, Ron Pearlman's character is blatantly Jayne whilst Call is River Tam (knowing all the goverment's secrets)

4. The revelation that The Company was bought out by Walmart. Equally funny that the future still has the home shopping channel.

5. The swimming sequence, preying on a lot of fears.

6. The relationship between Ripley and Call is great, in Aliens Ripley had to learn to trust android Bishop, in A4 android Call has to learn to trust Ripley.

7. The scene where Ripley is shown a picture of a little girl and smiles sadly

8. Ripley gradually regains her humanity as time goes on

9. The newborn choosing the more human Ripley as it's mother figure rather than the queen.

10. Ripley's ingenious way of killing the newborn

11. The colossal explosion when the Auriga hits earth which seems to take out Angola and most of Madagascar

12. Finally a happy ending for Ripley, she's wiped out the bugs, she's regained her humanity, she's got her little girl/android pal back, she's finally reached Earth. She takes command of The Betty and becomes a female version of Mal Reynolds.