Watchman - The Ultimate Cut

[23skidoo]

I imagine had Watchman been the critical and commercial success everyone was hoping it'd be, the release of the Ultimate Cut a couple weeks ago would have probably garnered more attention.

I finally received my copy of the DVD edition via Amazon yesterday. (After being told by HMV and two other retail chains that it was only being issued to Blu-Ray, and by Best Buy that it wasn't being released at all). For anyone who hasn't paid attention to what's been going on, the Ultimate Cut is 3 1/2 hours long and combines both the longer Directors Cut versioon of the film as released to DVD/BR earlier in the year with the Tales of the Black Freighter animated segments (along with footage of the newsstand guys not included in either the original or Directors Cut version).

As a result the film starts to feel more like Alan Moore's graphic novel. The imposition of the pirate segments is jarring at first (especially if you're unfamiliar with the original book) but I think it works. As a result, the film definitely feels longer and more complex, which I think was a criticism of the original movie - that it wasn't complex enough and felt too short. That said, I can understand why the studio wouldn't allow the release of a film roughly the same length as Titanic, as this is definitely not a film for casual viewers. And as it is, the fact it's a gore and sex-filled R-rated superhero film were already factors working against it being a popular success (even the Batman films never passed PG-13). Add in a gory cartoon (in a culture where cartoons as still considered to be for kids; one reason why anime has never become a huge mainstream Joe and Jane Moviegoer success in North America) and the film probably would have been closed after its opening weekend.

As for the extras in the 5-disc set, I'm a little disappointed, but again there might have been more had this been a massive hit. Basically, all of the extras from the Directors Cut release and the Black Freighter DVD are present, plus I think one additional featurette and there's a couple of new commentaries by the writers and Dave Gibbons. The Under the Hood faux-documentary is included. I was kind of hoping this would also be integrated into the Ultimate Cut (like Under the Hood is interspersed throughout the original novel) but that was probably asking too much. (The Blu-Ray version I think includes a few more bells and whistles but whether there's anything new to this set I couldn't say.)

Also included in the set is the Watchmen Motion Comics. I could have done without this piece of garbage, which I bought separately in the spring. It's basically a talking book version of the graphic novel, with limited and faked motion added to some of the panels. My big problem with it is the whole thing is read by a single reader -- a male actor -- even the female roles. And it doesn't work. I know sole readers are the usual way audio books are presented, and whoever is hired to do the reading has to make do, so male actors have to read female voices, and female actors have to do the men. Sometimes it works not too badly (both Catherine Tate and Michelle Ryan did good jobs impersonating David Tennant in recent Doctor Who audio books, for example, and David Tennant nailed Tate's Donna Noble in his readings). But add in visuals as they did with the Watchmen Motion Comics and it really spotlights the fact it's all one guy. I found the Motion Comics unwatchable and the only part of the exercise where I 100% agreed with Alan Moore's decision to take his name off the credits. I could have done without it being included in the Ultimate set -- and now I have 2 copies of the damn thing (in a city where it's becoming increasingly more difficult to find used-DVD stores willing to buy anymore).

My other criticism is the size of the box. One trend in packaging I approve of is the move to slimline cases for box sets. Whereas a 10-disc set of The Prisoner used to take up half a shelf, now you can fit 10 discs in the space of about 3 standard "clamshell" cases. The Watchmen box is way too big for a 5-disc set in 2009 (the Blu-Ray box, which I've seen, isn't much better). (I also like slimline better than clamshell because there's less likelihood of the disc coming loose during shipping - I just had to return 2 DVD sets to Amazon because of the clamshell-packed discs falling out en route).

Still, I'm glad I have the Ultimate Set because I do think Watchmen is a better movie for including the Black Freighter material. Even if I'm only one of about 10 people who liked the movie.

Alex

 

[Bad Bishop]

I have the 3-hour Director's Cut and never felt any need for the animated Black Freighter inserts. I have rented Tales of the Black Freighter separately and I was satisfied to view it apart from the main film. I'll probably purchase it later because I did enjoy Under The Hood too.

 

[Klaus]

I've been waiting for this version to buy it, thanks...

 

[Ethros]

I'm hoping this gets released on Region 2

I watched This Review on Youtube of it, and it sounds like he gives it a fair review. Basically sums up what I thought it would be like, an interesting experiment for a "complete Watchmen translation", but the intercutting of the TOTBF doesn't work as well in the move of medium from comic to film.

Still, I love the film, easily my favourite movie of 2009, and I really enjoyed the Black Freighter animated DVD, so I'm really looking forward to seeing this.


On a side note, I thought the motion comic was excellent, but I too have the DVD of it already, and its inclusion in this set seems a bit excessive

 

[Admiral_Young]

I've been waiting for this...forgot that it came out last month and didn't see any copies when I went into Best Buy to get it. I'm curious as to how the audio commentary is? I've been holding out on buying any of the previous releases because of the lack of a commentary track.

 

[ClayinCA]

There are two commentary tracks on this version - one by director Zack Snyder and one by original comic book artist Dave Gibbons. I haven't listened to either yet, so I can't speak as to their quality.

 

[Leroy]

I think one of the movies problems is that WB stupidly marketed the film as an action superhero flick like Spiderman or X-Men when it was more of a gritty murder mystery, conspiracy thriller, type movie. That and immature people can't handle nudity like Dr. Manhattan.

 

[Stone_Cold_Sisko]

My big problem with it is the whole thing is read by a single reader -- a male actor -- even the female roles. And it doesn't work. I know sole readers are the usual way audio books are presented, and whoever is hired to do the reading has to make do, so male actors have to read female voices, and female actors have to do the men.

I've always found this to be somewhat weird and creepy. Moreso when it's a guy doing the female voices.

 

[barnaclelapse]

I still need to pick it up, but it's definitely at the top of my damn Christmas wish list.

 

[ManOnTheWave]

I completely missed this. I'll have to go out and get it now.

 

[Lapis Exilis]

As a result the film starts to feel more like Alan Moore's graphic novel.

Hmmm - my biggest problem with the film was that it was too much like Alan Moore's graphic novel. Because if I want to experience that again, it's easy enough to open it and reread it. A good adaptation in a new medium works with the medium to make a separate but related work. Snyder only seems interested in making slavishly faithful moving versions of comic books.

I think one of the movies problems is that WB stupidly marketed the film as an action superhero flick like Spiderman or X-Men when it was more of a gritty murder mystery, conspiracy thriller, type movie. That and immature people can't handle nudity like Dr. Manhattan.

I don't think it's so hard for people to accept Dr. Manhattan's nudity, but it goes entirely unexplained throughout the movie, making it seem an entirely gratuitous choice. I'd have much preferred Snyder clipped 5 seconds of his endless love affair with slow motion and inserted a line or two where Manhattan explains why clothes are meaningless to him. I mean, of all the things to leave out when he was so concerned with keeping details in.

 

[coolghoul]

Is there more nekkidness in the Ultimate cut?

I did notice (and I watched it very recently on the DVD version) that DocM wears black briefs occasionally - seemed to be when he's "in public".

 

[coolghoul]

Is there more nekkidness in the Ultimate cut?

I did notice (and I watched it very recently on the DVD version) that DocM wears black briefs occasionally - seemed to be when he's "in public".

 

[Davros]

I have the 3-hour Director's Cut and never felt any need for the animated Black Freighter inserts. I have rented Tales of the Black Freighter separately and I was satisfied to view it apart from the main film. I'll probably purchase it later because I did enjoy Under The Hood too.

I agree and have already made the purchase of the Black Freighter/Under The Hood DvD.

 

[23skidoo]

I think one of the movies problems is that WB stupidly marketed the film as an action superhero flick like Spiderman or X-Men when it was more of a gritty murder mystery, conspiracy thriller, type movie. That and immature people can't handle nudity like Dr. Manhattan.

Not to mention this is a superhero film where none of the heroes are really heroic. And, yeah, the idea of superheroes having sex makes people uncomfortable (it's still a rare thing to see DC or Marvel heroes demonstrating a sex life). A lot of people were also apparently really upset at how the rape of Silk Spectre and later events were handled.

I've always found this to be somewhat weird and creepy. Moreso when it's a guy doing the female voices.

It can work, but it's rare. Aside from David Tennant one of the only other examples I can think of is the late English actor John Thaw's reading of the Modesty Blaise short story "I Had a Date with Lady Janet". He did such a good job on Modesty's voice that I still hear him whenever I read a Modesty Blaise novel or comic strip. Even though the guy was an Ian McShane type.

Hmmm - my biggest problem with the film was that it was too much like Alan Moore's graphic novel. Because if I want to experience that again, it's easy enough to open it and reread it. A good adaptation in a new medium works with the medium to make a separate but related work. Snyder only seems interested in making slavishly faithful moving versions of comic books.

A fair comment and one not too far removed from Alan Moore's rationale for opposing having his works adapted for film. On the other hand, Snyder was also responding to past precedent set by the Lord of the Rings trilogy. Some fans all but rioted in the streets because a couple of characters were dropped and some lines changed. And there are people who refuse to see the Harry Potter films because each one isn't 5 hours long and feature every single scene from the books. Watchmen has such a devoted following, that Snyder probably would have been strung up if he'd departed too much from the source material (he took a big enough risk with the ending). If you want to see how Hollywood might have treated Watchmen in the past, check out YouTube for the viral 80s-style cartoon show based on the Watchmen (I'm disappointed the Ultimate Cut didn't include the viral videos), or the videogame that came out a few months ago.

Is there more nekkidness in the Ultimate cut?

Not that I noticed. The film incorporates the Director's Cut, which I think added a bit to the Nite Owl/Silk Spectre love scene, but that's about it. If you were hoping for closeups of Dr. M's weinerschnitzel, you're probably out of luck!

Alex

 

[Lapis Exilis]

Hmmm - my biggest problem with the film was that it was too much like Alan Moore's graphic novel. Because if I want to experience that again, it's easy enough to open it and reread it. A good adaptation in a new medium works with the medium to make a separate but related work. Snyder only seems interested in making slavishly faithful moving versions of comic books.

A fair comment and one not too far removed from Alan Moore's rationale for opposing having his works adapted for film. On the other hand, Snyder was also responding to past precedent set by the Lord of the Rings trilogy. Some fans all but rioted in the streets because a couple of characters were dropped and some lines changed. And there are people who refuse to see the Harry Potter films because each one isn't 5 hours long and feature every single scene from the books. Watchmen has such a devoted following, that Snyder probably would have been strung up if he'd departed too much from the source material (he took a big enough risk with the ending). If you want to see how Hollywood might have treated Watchmen in the past, check out YouTube for the viral 80s-style cartoon show based on the Watchmen (I'm disappointed the Ultimate Cut didn't include the viral videos), or the videogame that came out a few months ago.

The difference is LotR and HP are books and graphic novels are, well, graphic. Turning a print book into a film is by nature creating a work of art that is distinct because you are creating images out of words. Turning a graphic novel into a film by lovingly recreating every image is not really adaptation. It begs the question of why create the film at all if all it's going to do is be essentially the same work as the original.

And I'll admit I had problems with the whole idea of taking Watchmen to film because the brilliance of Watchmen has as much to do with what it did with the medium of comic books as it had to do with story of deconstruction of heroes, etc, etc. I was hoping, when it did get to film, that someone would take the opportunity to play with and explore film as a medium the way Moore did with comic books, and all Snyder did was recreate the comic. He kind of completely missed the point of why Watchmen was so revolutionary, and in the process, he produced a really boring film where the only interest is how closely it adheres to the original work.

 

[Harvey]

It seemed to adhere to the original work visually. It was such a slave to the original artwork that when Snyder altered the ending he had Gibbons draw new artwork for it. But I don't think the film really understands the themes and ideas represented by the graphic novel. It's hard to reconcile glorified badass violence (in slow motion!) with the graphic novel that I read.

 

[Stone_Cold_Sisko]

The difference is LotR and HP are books and graphic novels are, well, graphic. Turning a print book into a film is by nature creating a work of art that is distinct because you are creating images out of words. Turning a graphic novel into a film by lovingly recreating every image is not really adaptation. It begs the question of why create the film at all if all it's going to do is be essentially the same work as the original.

I tend to agree with this sentiment. I'm over the "recreate every frame on film" thing, both from Watchmen and also 300 and Sin City.

I much prefer the Dark Knight, Spider-Man 2, X-Men 1/2 style of adaptation.

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

^Agreed. When I finally saw the movie, I realized that my concerns about Watchmen being directed by the same guy that did 300 were absolutely justified. While Alan Moore has done some amazing things with the medium of comic books, Frank Miller is an ultra-violent, misogynistic moron. I'm not surprised to discover that someone who could enjoy Miller's work enough to make a whole movie about it could also make a Watchmen movie that totally misses the point of Moore's work.

My big problem with it is the whole thing is read by a single reader -- a male actor -- even the female roles. And it doesn't work. I know sole readers are the usual way audio books are presented, and whoever is hired to do the reading has to make do, so male actors have to read female voices, and female actors have to do the men.

Sometimes it works. There's a really good audio version of Mostly Harmless out there with Martin Freeman doing all the parts. He is clearly having a lot of fun doing the different voices & accents for all of the incidental characters. With the main characters, he's only so-so. His Trillian is just kinda flat & lifeless. However, his Random is absolutely spectacular. He doesn't really do anything to his voice to make it sound like a petulant teenage girl but he totally nails the raging emotions of the character nonetheless.

However, I agree it would be very different for a "motion comic." For one thing, you're adding a visual element so it would be jarring to see different characters and yet have them all sound the same. Secondly, sometimes it's not such a problem with audio books because the majority of the text is narration, not dialogue. But with a comic book, there's little to no narration. I don't see why they wouldn't have made the extra expense of hiring a few other voice actors to flesh out the piece.

I did notice (and I watched it very recently on the DVD version) that DocM wears black briefs occasionally - seemed to be when he's "in public".

I'm very glad that Dr. Manhattan wears briefs during the Vietnam scenes. A 100-ft. tall Dr. Manhattan is scary enough. A proportional giant glowing dick taking up the entire screen would have simply been too scary for words!

I would say that the real reason why Harry Potter, The Lord of the Rings, and even V for Vendetta made better movies than Watchmen is because movies have a tendency to only work when focusing on a single narrative. There are exceptions, but generally movies don't have the same ability that books do to meander through the entire fictional universe. So while Harry Potter, The Lord of the Rings, and V for Vendetta contain a lot of extra subplots in book form, they can ultimately each be distilled into a single narrative spine that the rest of the movie can be reconstructed around-- Harry's ongoing battle against Voldemort, Frodo & Sam taking the One Ring to Mt. Doom, V's crusade against the corrupt regime of Chancellor Sutler.

On the otherhand, Watchmen doesn't have a narrative spine. It's a latticework of intricate plots & subplots & character development. If you remove too much of it, the story collapses and you lose so much of what made the book work in the first place. In particular, they totally gutted Laurie's story, which hurt because she was the most dynamic character in the book.

The only time the movie really succeeded at being a movie was in the opening montage that gave us the history of the Minutemen and so forth. That was great cinema. The rest was lost in translation.

 

[Leroy]

If they really wanted to make the motion comic good they should have had Alan Moore do the voices for everyone male and female.