Was SEVEN of Nine a dominatrix?

[Prax]

I can't speak for everyone, and I know that there are probably different types of men out there that are into such things, but as a man, there is no greater turn off than a dominatrix type woman.

It might be more of a Hollywood thing to depict guys getting all excited over a cruel, hot, domineering woman. Hollywood has been known to create stereotypes before...that just can't be found in regular society.

 

[Sakonna]

I think BOTH characters could have co-existed on the show. Seven was very one note but it was an in your face note. Kes was wasted potential.

I have often thought what a fascinating dynamic Seven and Kes could have had. A real missed opportunity.

I don't think Seven was for fans. Seven was for non-fans.

I was talking with some non-Trek-fan friends at some point, and I was intrigued by the 6 characters they all knew: Kirk, Spock, Scotty (from the catchphrase), Picard, Data, and Seven. I thought it was interesting that Seven was the only post-TNG character that penetrated the mass consciousness. Which is a good thing... it helps a franchise to have iconic, memorable characters that everyone knows.

I was thinking more along the lines of what the writers and Berman's main attempt were when they created the character. Why did they give her the personality they did. they could have just as easy made her more human like and put her in a catsuit or they could have created any number of female characters that are also sexy. We could have gotten someone more like Jadzia or Troi or any number of options.
What i'm curious about isn't that they brought in eye candy and tried to create a sexy character but they decided this type of character was going to be the type of sexy character they wanted.

I do think you're right, that a domintrix influence was going on in their minds. They just then did a great job of justifying it with character development and a compelling performance. But I do believe it's one of the seeds.

I can't speak for everyone, and I know that there are probably different types of men out there that are into such things, but as a man, there is no greater turn off than a dominatrix type woman.

I don't doubt that's true for many. But there are also plenty of men out there who legitimately love the domination thing. Trust me.

 

[psCargile]

I can't speak for everyone, and I know that there are probably different types of men out there that are into such things, but as a man, there is no greater turn off than a dominatrix type woman.

It might be more of a Hollywood thing to depict guys getting all excited over a cruel, hot, domineering woman. Hollywood has been known to create stereotypes before...that just can't be found in regular society.

I recall back in the 90s, HBO's "Real Sex" featured dominatrixes and men that called upon their services where usually business executives, the guys in charge all day that wanted a woman to boss them around. And there is, or was, the Netflix doc about Kink.com that, well. . .weird shit is out there.

 

[ThatChapThere]

Obviously if she had been ugly her acting wouldn't have factored. Seven is remembered for those looks more than anything else. It was her role, defined her meaning. I can imagine the other actors resenting the cheap attention she received. It's always nice to see the pretty one getting the credit. I especially felt sorry for the character and actress who played Kes. What a slap in the face. I think BOTH characters could have co-existed on the show. Seven was very one note but it was an in your face note. Kes was wasted potential.

Because of course if they had, say, some old ugly bald dude on voyager he would not have been popular for his acting.

 

[Sophie74656]

Because of course if they had, say, some old ugly bald dude on voyager he would not have been popular for his acting.

You re absolutely right. That would never.....hey wait a minute!

 

[Refuge]

Because of course if they had, say, some old ugly bald dude on voyager he would not have been popular for his acting.

Well yes, put that ugly bald dude in Seven's catsuit and he wouldn't have been popular..

 

[ThatChapThere]

Well yes, put that ugly bald dude in Seven's catsuit and he wouldn't have been popular..

I don't want to think about this.

 

[Six of Twelve]

Well, I don't know. Robert Picardo had a nice, trim figure....

 

[Sophie74656]

Well yes, put that ugly bald dude in Seven's catsuit and he wouldn't have been popular..

Ok I kind of want to see that now

 

[Sakonna]

Obviously if she had been ugly her acting wouldn't have factored.

Because of course if they had, say, some old ugly bald dude on voyager he would not have been popular for his acting.

Yeah, but you can't pretend that the franchise is not using different metrics for it's male and female castmembers. In terms of male Trek regular characters where mainstream sex appeal was clearly not a concern, you have (at least) Bones, O'Brien, Odo, Quark, the Doctor, Neelix, and Phlox.

In terms of female Trek regular characters where mainstream sex appeal was clearly not a concern, you have... no one.

(Maybe Pulaski, if we count her? Though that is an interesting example of one of the few times in television history a young woman was replaced by an older one... if only briefly)

 

[ThatChapThere]

Yeah, but you can't pretend that the franchise is not using different metrics for it's male and female cast members. In terms of male Trek regular characters where mainstream sex appeal was clearly not a concern, you have (at least) Bones, O'Brien, Odo, Quark, the Doctor, Neelix, and Phlox.

In terms of female Trek regular characters where mainstream sex appeal was clearly not a concern, you have... no one.

(Maybe Pulaski, if we count her? Though that is an interesting example of one of the few times in television history a young woman was replaced by an older one... if only briefly)

Good point. I was being slightly tongue-in-cheek though. I'm sure there are a lot of female characters where that wasn't the main concern.

 

[Voth commando1]

Gates McFadden always had a working or middle class mom feel. She's good looking I'll admit but even in Season 1 she wasn't there for sex appeal.

 

[Sakonna]

Good point. I was being slightly tongue-in-cheek though. I'm sure there are a lot of female characters where that wasn't the main concern.

I'll grant you a Janeway. She was 40 at the time Voyager started, so it wouldn't have occurred to any of these execs to perceive her as a sexual being. Just looking at all the other Trek women (thinking of regulars only: Uhura, Troi, Crusher, Yar, Kira, Dax, Torres, Kes, Seven, Hoshi, T'Pol), I do think the decision-makers found sex appeal essential for them in a way it just wasn't for the men -- if not a singular main concern, at least co-equal to whatever else they saw as the most important qualities of the role. Writing this out, I'm suddenly struck we never had a quirky female alien regular, in the mold of Quark, Neelix, or Phlox.

(I worked in casting for years, so that might make me particularly jaded on this point. Much of my career has been spent fulfilling various version of the "I need to believe she could be a surgeon AND a stripper" request )

 

[Voth commando1]

So a female alien sex appeal...hmm I know we need a green babe regular!

 

[Gary7]

I agree, Seven didn't give a dominatrix vibe at all, except for Harry Kim's fantasy.
Maybe if Seven had a latex sheen to her suit and a little whip coiled on her hip as a non-energy weapon to wield. And I absolutely agree that Jeri Ryan pulled off the Seven character beautifully. It is much harder than it looks to act emotionless without being too stiff. Ryan struck a great balance and her character development was excellent. Very believable all the way through. I don't know if it was just becoming too routine seeing her in a catsuit or if it was Ryan's skill, but I found the novelty of an extremely exposing tight catsuit distracting only for the 1st season, and in time I rarely found myself noticing... and if I did, it was only because of a color change or a VERY overtly exposing episode. Remember when the Doctor had a body switch with Seven? The catsuit sexual allure popped right back to the surface, because of the acknowledged body fascination.

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