Was Reed too much of a whimp?

[SFRabid]

After watching season three again I noticed that Reed showed more aggression towards Hays than he ever did the enemy. In season three I first noticed it when Archer put the alien in the air lock to get information. Reed should have been the one doing this but instead he stood there whining "Sir, you're hurting him." When it came to aggressive, in-charge get things done attitude he was overshadowed by Archer and Trip. There were times when Hoshi came across more forceful and confident than Reed. There were times when I was not sure if I was watching Malcolm Reed or Donna Reed. (I bet not many people here remember that show.)

I sometimes think the part was miscast. I wonder what it would have been like if they switched Keating to helm or engineering and had either Trinneer or Montgomery as head of security?

 

[commodore64]

Interesting! I don't think Reed was miscast as much as some rather spotty writing. I liked the idea of a rather upper-crust security guard. And they laid a foundation of a guy who came from a long line of military officers, though the only one who didn't serve in the Navy. Unfortunately (and what seems prevalent in ENT), it was a nice idea without a lot of follow-up. I mean, the actor kept the upper-crust accent and the writing had him as rather stiff and formal, but without digging terribly into why. That was probably a mistake. It would've been interesting, for example, if after Shuttlepod One they had an episode with Trip and Reed where Reed confessed he had a boarding school education and came from a stiff-upper lip family, even though he was a man of great feeling.

I agree with your assessment of Reed being angrier at Hayes than at the enemy and again think that was a mistake. It's part of the reason I really hate Harbinger. I liked that Reed and Hayes didn't get along and don't mind them coming to blows over their disagreements, but their disagreements seem so manufactured. I felt sorry for Keating who had to play a guy pissed off for little reason.

And here we go back to Reed's background. What if this man who can't show his feelings (which I think was the writer's intention), was angry at Hayes and saw a lot of his father in him. I think that would've given the disagreement more layers and depth. Instead, I was wondering why exactly Reed was so bent out of shape. Also, I think that back story could've explained why he went into Section 31.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I don't think Reed was a wimp. I thought he was pretty cool. Plus his sister was hot.

I agree with your assessment of Reed being angrier at Hayes than at the enemy and again think that was a mistake. It's part of the reason I really hate Harbinger. I liked that Reed and Hayes didn't get along and don't mind them coming to blows over their disagreements, but their disagreements seem so manufactured.

Plus, the writers also screwed up when they said that LIEUTENANT Reed outranked MAJOR Hayes. (yes, I'm aware of the different rank systems, but a Major outranks both a 'naval' and 'marine' Lieutenant)

 

[LeadHead]

Reed was no wimp, he just got hurt the predictable number of times someone would for the number of dangerous situatios he was in. As for being more pissed at Hayes than the Xindi, I don't buy that. He was angry, but so was the entire crew. It didn't stick out. Reed was pretty much alone in his dislike of Hayes and the MACO's, making it stick out much more.

 

[joncreed]

I don't think Reed was a wimp. I thought he was pretty cool. Plus his sister was hot.

I agree with your assessment of Reed being angrier at Hayes than at the enemy and again think that was a mistake. It's part of the reason I really hate Harbinger. I liked that Reed and Hayes didn't get along and don't mind them coming to blows over their disagreements, but their disagreements seem so manufactured.

Plus, the writers also screwed up when they said that LIEUTENANT Reed outranked MAJOR Hayes. (yes, I'm aware of the different rank systems, but a Major outranks both a 'naval' and 'marine' Lieutenant)

Reed wasn't a wimp, he was worse- a TWIT!

I was also irritated by lack of research on military ranks! Malcolm should have been a Lieutenant Commander, his "Naval" rank would be the equivalent of Hayes' "Marine Corp" rank of Major BUT Reed's seniority could've been taken into account and thus he would "outrank" Hayes. Being a Lieutenant in the Navy is equal to that of a Captain in the Army, Marines and Air Force; Reed just being Starfleet Lieutenant would NOT outrank MAJOR Hayes. World War 2 vets Gene Roddenberry and James Doohan must have been spinning in their graves.

 

[Captain59]

Riker called him "larger than life," so I wouldn't call that person a whimp.

 

[Hoshi's sis]

After watching season three again I noticed that Reed showed more aggression towards Hays than he ever did the enemy. In season three I first noticed it when Archer put the alien in the air lock to get information. Reed should have been the one doing this but instead he stood there whining "Sir, you're hurting him." When it came to aggressive, in-charge get things done attitude he was overshadowed by Archer and Trip. There were times when Hoshi came across more forceful and confident than Reed. There were times when I was not sure if I was watching Malcolm Reed or Donna Reed. (I bet not many people here remember that show.)

I sometimes think the part was miscast. I wonder what it would have been like if they switched Keating to helm or engineering and had either Trinneer or Montgomery as head of security?

Not sure about being a wimp, since he showed some pretty good fighting techniques against Hayes in Harbinger and he never seemed to one to back away from a confrontation. To me, he just didn't look the part or sometimes act the part, compared to Worf or Odo who did. He also come across as petty and immature to me, with his rivalry with Hayes.

 

[The Academic]

Reed wasn't a wimp, he was worse - a TWIT!

Malcolm Reed was neither a wimp nor a twit. He was British.

 

[Hoshi's sis]

Reed wasn't a wimp, he was worse - a TWIT!

Malcolm Reed was neither a wimp nor a twit. He was British.

He certainly didn't act British. Just an extremely exaggerated version of how Hollywood most of the times perceive British people.

 

[The Academic]

Reed wasn't a wimp, he was worse - a TWIT!

Malcolm Reed was neither a wimp nor a twit. He was British.

He certainly didn't act British. Just an extremely exaggerated version of how Hollywood most of the times perceive British people.

Reality and perception of reality are the same thing in Hollywood (and its cultural dependencies, of course).

 

[SFRabid]

Bond was Brittish so I don't think that had anything to do with how Reed came across. Also, Keeting did pretty well with the mirror episodes Reed. Much better than the normal Reed. But, I think the mirror episodes Mayweather would have made a better normal episodes head of security.

Also, in many episodes Trip was portraid as the one wanting to get involved when he saw something he perceived as wrong. That started early when he saw the mother weaning her child off of what ever it was breathing and he thought she was hurting it. That is the attitude of someone that becomes head of security. They never gave Reed those traits.

 

[bluedana]

Being a Lieutenant in the Navy is equal to that of a Captain in the Army, Marines and Air Force; Reed just being Starfleet Lieutenant would NOT outrank MAJOR Hayes. World War 2 vets Gene Roddenberry and James Doohan must have been spinning in their graves.

Reed was in the Starfleet chain of command. The MACOs weren't. Their respective ranks would not have mattered, any more than it mattered whether "Sub-Commander" outranked "Commander." When Archer left the bridge, T'Pol was in command. When T'Pol left, and if Trip wasn't there, Reed was in command. The MACOs never were.

 

[Penguin]

Bluedana. As you said Hayes was not in the Enterprise chain of command.

Well neither was T-Pol so her rank didn't mean anythng either. she had no business being left in command as Trip was the second highest ranking Human Starfleet Officer on board and Enterprise was Human officered and crewed Startship except fo Phlox who never woulld have had comand r4esponsibilities.

Also, in the third season T-Pol had no rank at all she had resigned her commision from TVHV and was not a Starfleet Officer so she was a civilan and there is no way you can make a civilian First Officer and in command on the ship when the Captain is not on board.

Roddenbury and Doohan would have got up out of their graves if they could have over that.

 

[Hopeful Romantic]

Penguin, I've lost count of how many times you've brought up this "T'Pol had no business being XO/being in command/being higher ranking than Trip" thing.

We get it. You don't like the way the show set it up. But the show did set up T'Pol as Archer's second in command. No one questioned it, so it must have been sanctioned by Starfleet Command, and accepted by the crew. They may not have set it up to your satisfaction, but that's the way it was.

This was a science fiction TV show, set 150 years from now. Fiction. TV. Future. Okay? Give it a rest.

Let's get back on topic.

 

[Thor Damar]

Reed wasn't a wimp, he was worse - a TWIT!

Malcolm Reed was neither a wimp nor a twit. He was British.

He certainly didn't act British. Just an extremely exaggerated version of how Hollywood most of the times perceive British people.

As a Brit may I please ask how exactly we're suppose to bloody behave perchance?

 

[c0rnedfr0g]

He seemed very wishy-washy and soft spoken, and was submissive towards his parents. Also, he was a pessimist full of self-pity, and his favorite food is pineapple.

But I still liked him. He's my favourite of the security/tactical officers in the 5 series.

 

[Brainiac]

As a Brit may I please ask how exactly we're suppose to bloody behave perchance?

Like George McDonald Fraser's immortal Sir Harry Paget Flashman... or like John Steed from The Avengers... or like Austin Powers... or like Roddy St. James, the mouse from Flushed Away...

'Go fetch me some pineapple nibblets from the galley, Jeeves, and make it snappy... chop-chop!'

 

[JiNX-01]

So, Dominic didn't know how to act British?

 

[Thor Damar]

So, Dominic didn't know how to act British?

That's odd because he's a British actor!

 

[pookha]

i didnt have that much problem with the conflict we saw between malcolm and hayes because it reflected some real world stuff that went on between the army and the marines especially in afghanistan were some of it leaked to the public.


throw in commies comment that perhaps also malcolm saw a little too much of his father in hayes.

i do think at times malcolm was poorly written in some of the expanse episodes.shipment especially comes to mind.

as for the airlock incident ..
malcolm actually comes in on it near the end and it may be he was just stunned at first that it was archer doing something like that.