Wang to B&B: "Thanks for nothing!"
- Thread starter Mach5
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This is exactly what Voyager needed for its characters, confronting the truly varied backgrounds of the people on board. It would have been much more interesting than the trechnobable and aliens of the week. I would also say Ethan Phillips is vastly dis-served by failing to appreciate the character he played. He did a fine job and I pretty much always enjoyed Neelix. But then, Jar Jar Binks was the only thing I really liked about the Star Wars prequels.
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Why would they invent a character we were expected to hate?
It doesn't make sense.
Then I saw Man on the Moon and "Andy Kaufman" explained Wrestling, and the importance of a "Heel" to me.
I agree as well
It's Wang's fault. He's the actor and is paid to read the lines written. If the lines written aren't to his satisfaction, he can always leave the show.
The consoles on Voyager fully represented the technology of the age. It brought a clear, quick and lively conversion of the billions of bytes of info. that was brought to them.
IIRC, various reports from the set tell us that Garrett Wang was told exactly what all the other would-be-director actors were told. They needed to be prepared to "go to director's school", ie. to start shadowing the director of an episode, to build a rapport with them, to see the whole thing through the director's eyes for the entirety of that episode. Stewart, Frakes, McFadden, Dawson, McNeill, etc, all did this. Wang refused - not outright - but he failed to show; he would do his acting bit, then go home. He thought Berman would still let him direct anyway. And Berman said no, because Wang had refused to do his homework.
Only if your employer lets you out of your five-year contact.
I really wish they kept Kes and killed of Harry. We might have had a few good episodes in place of those black and white B movie horror holodeck nightmares. I can promise I'll be skipping them when they come up yet again as I watch instantly on Netflix!
How could they if for 7 years Wang never expressed any displeasure with the job?
All that Wang is saying now, is way after the fact.
Considering Harry was never a prime element in any of those eps., I don't think getting rid of him would have made those not happen. "Capt. Proton" was Tom's thing, not Harry's.
Very true, but Kes would have added more interesting storylines. Rewatching those episodes, I'm realizing that they each had an interesting story taking place. I think the Capt. Proton bit just felt cheesy to me back then. Now, I find I've enjoyed each episode with Capt. Proton though I still find Harry utterly irrelevant to the series. If he were removed there would be no significant change. I appreciate him for his newbie status on the ship. I just wish they'd kept Kes. She had such great development in season 3 and after she left, Janeway's character changed from a nurturing matriarch to more stubborn and dominating, even with Seven who was more like her child in many ways. Yet she was more nurturing with Kes than she was ever with Seven.
??? EpisodeS? There's only one, "Bride of Chaotica!". It's also seen in part of "Night" and part of "Shattered". "A few good episodes in place of those"? Bride was a Tom episode mainly and was a campy tribute to those old sci-fi serials (the robot actually came from one of those old serials), complete with Emperor Ming ripoff. Kes episodes would've replaced "Demon", "Timeless" (in part), "The Disease", "Nightingale".
I don't buy Braga or Berman or whoever's line that they got rid of Kes because she was a dead end and had nothing interesting for her. Season 3 clearly showed that she could get interesting. She even got a catsuit before Seven showed up. Kim/Wang was saved because he was on Hollywood's 50 most beautiful list for 1997. Of course, Kes was the most expendable of the cast by role (hydroponics/nurse; Paris had some field medic training). Of course, they could have made Kim's post Ensign Recurring like how Ayala was often seen at Tuvok's post.
I don't know about Kim never being a central cast member. There was ample opportunity for him to go from wide-eyed innocent to experienced explorer, but the producers never let the character grow. I think Kim's best outing was in Timeless, where he was bitter and blunt, brought down by the hardships after they lost Voyager. One of my friends said as we were watching, 'Our little Harry's all grown up.'
Characters are supposed to change over time, to grow. Why does it seem like the producers just won't let some of them do so?
Characters are supposed to change over time, to grow. Why does it seem like the producers just won't let some of them do so?
In a book that's easy, but on TV there is audience response to episodes. Presumably those featuring Harry Kim didn't do as well as those featuring other cast members. Also, while I've no idea how he actually got on with cast and crew, if Garret had wanted more to do and had been involved with those making to show to give the impression that he was capable of such, the lack of result is indication that the efforts he made were not equal to Garret's desires.
I don't know what happened on the Voyager set
I think Harry Kim had an important role. He is as close as most of the Trek shows came to an "everyman" character.
He wasn't half Klingon or Vulcan. He wasn't a career Star Fleet officer (yet). He wasn't a guy with a grudge or a troubled past. He was just....the young guy getting started in Star Fleet. I can sort of see how it would serve the series to keep him in that role as long as possible.
Anyway, all the Trek shows (besides TOS) seem like ensemble dramas to me. Certainly each series had characters who starred in more episodes, usually the Captains and another favorite character like Data or Seven of Nine. But often we got many stories about the other regular characters doing something on the holodeck, going off on a tangent mission, being altered by an alien probe, etc.
I think that's sort of why the TNG movies declined in popularity really fast. TNG had to be dumbed down a lot more for movies than TOS. It had to be made into the Picard and Data show or something because major sci-fi films are never about an ensemble of characters unless you have a wookie or robot or something for comedy relief.
I think Harry Kim had an important role. He is as close as most of the Trek shows came to an "everyman" character.
He wasn't half Klingon or Vulcan. He wasn't a career Star Fleet officer (yet). He wasn't a guy with a grudge or a troubled past. He was just....the young guy getting started in Star Fleet. I can sort of see how it would serve the series to keep him in that role as long as possible.
Anyway, all the Trek shows (besides TOS) seem like ensemble dramas to me. Certainly each series had characters who starred in more episodes, usually the Captains and another favorite character like Data or Seven of Nine. But often we got many stories about the other regular characters doing something on the holodeck, going off on a tangent mission, being altered by an alien probe, etc.
I think that's sort of why the TNG movies declined in popularity really fast. TNG had to be dumbed down a lot more for movies than TOS. It had to be made into the Picard and Data show or something because major sci-fi films are never about an ensemble of characters unless you have a wookie or robot or something for comedy relief.
I guess we'll have to disagree about Kes.
The development I saw she got during season 3 was just a build up for her to leave IMO. I'm also very divided on Kes anyway. I saw potential in the character but I found they made her to stoic to really get to know her. If it wasn't suggested by the doctor to be a nurse or by Neelix to start the hydroponics bay, what were her own ambitions in life? In 3 years I never got the impression to WHO Kes really was, much like Harry. By s3, I just saw her as prop for Robert Picardo to act off of. I don't see the writers having interest in developing Kes any more than they did Harry. Which was the reason why it came down to the two of them being cut to begin with.
I also think a majority of us focus on Harry's personality growth or rank while ignoring all that he did bring to the table. Most of the new technology of Voyager was created by him. He created the portal device in "Time & Again", he understood Slim Steam tech more than Be'Lanna, "Non Sequitier" showed he had an advanced understanding of shuttle design, He was the only one besides Seven that could read and intergrate Borg tech. That know how went into the building of two Delta Flyer's.
For a Jr Engineer, Harry had the skills of a senior officer.