Vulcan's red sky

[Therin of Andor]

However, if we return to the prime universe, it`ll be blue. Unless thay change it again.

Did you see my earlier pic? If Sydney, Australia, can have about nine hours of vibrant red sky, simply because the air is filled with fine red dust blown across from our desert "red centre" overnight, then Vulcan's blue sky can take on a red/orange/yellow hue, too.

 

[DrBashir]

I'd like to know where Vulcan gets enough oxygen for them to breathe. There's no sign of forests. With a population of six billion, roughly the same as 2011 Earth, there's a fairly hefty demand for oxygen.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Haven't we really only seen one city and its outskirts?

 

[DrBashir]

Also the Vulcan trilogy on Enterprise. Still not a lot of vegetation.

Trying to recall if we saw Vulcan at all on Voyager.

 

[Kertrats47]

Just some caves, I think, in the episode "Gravity." I can't recall any other scenes set on Vulcan in Voyager...

 

[DrBashir]

So, we have:

Amok Time - Surface & Orbit (remastered)
Journey to Babel - Orbit (remastered)
Yesteryear - Surface
The Search for Spock - Surface & Orbit
The Voyage Home - Surface
Unification Part 1 - Interiors only & Orbit
Sarek - Orbit
Gambit Part 2 - Interior & Orbit
Home - Interiors, surface
The Forge, Awakening, Kir'Shara - Surface, interiors, & orbit

Any others?

 

[Timo]

Haven't we really only seen one city and its outskirts?

In TAS "Yesteryear" (and apparently also TOS-R "Amok Time"), we saw Shi'Kahr, the hometown of Spock. In ENT, we saw the Vulcan capital. We have no particular reason to think that the two would be the same, and indeed there was no visual resemblance.

In STXI, we saw a further city that was architecturally distinct from both the above. It was set in the "Vasquez Rocks" landscape, though, and later on we saw the same landscape around the apparent Sarek mansion and the underground refuge of the Vulcan leadership. Either that type of terrain is found in various parts of Vulcan, or then these three locations are somehow intertwined (which would make sense, because Sarek and the government couldn't get to their bunker from a faraway city due to Nero's transporter jamming and his likely urge to shoot down all small fliers).

So, that could be two or three cities, then - two if the Capital was the same in both incarnations, despite architectural differences (because neither ENT nor STXI showed the entire city). Or perhaps three or four, if the city below the Sarek family's ancestral fighting grounds is not Shi'Kahr after all.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[F. King Daniel]

The deleted scenes and "Art of the Movie" book identify the Vulcan city from STXI as Shi'Kahr. Just like XI's San Fransisco, it's got a new look.

Similarly, Gotham City appears totally different between Batman Begins and The Dark Knight (and they had the same director!)

The STXI version of Vulcan was used in the (prime-universe) Countdown and Spock: Reflections comics. The novel Unspoken Truth, released post-STXI, features the version of Shi'Kahr seen in Enterprise on the cover.

 

[Timo]

Such noncanon sources could and perhaps should be ignored, though. What rationale would make the hometown of Spock the capital of Vulcan? Spock's home appeared to be a lazy little town at the very edge of a desert (Diane Duane paints it as a university town); the capital would probably have grown in a more hospitable and central location.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[F. King Daniel]

Well, in STXI, Sarek and Amanda's home was on the outskirts, a hoverbike ride from the city proper.

Really, if we can accept the Gorn as a fearsome lizard monster when he's obviously a guy in a silly rubber costume, and we can accept recast characters, why not a "recast" Shi'Kahr?

 

[Timo]

Even if the Capital looked identical to the TAS city, I'd still argue it's not Shi'Kahr, because there's no good reason to think it is. Why should Vulcan only have one city?

Then again, judging by the novels, Vulcan only has one month.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[F. King Daniel]

If STXI were just another episode or movie, I might agree. But it was a modern retelling of Spock's life story - and thus, the "Yesteryear" infuenced scenes are supposed to take place in the same city they did in TAS.

 

[Idran]

Then again, judging by the novels, Vulcan only has one month.

...Eh?

 

[Christopher]

Then again, judging by the novels, Vulcan only has one month.

No, Vulcan's Forge and Vulcan's Heart mentioned several, and Beneath the Raptor's Wing mentions several more, based on a fan calendar that I also referenced in Watching the Clock.

http://home.fuse.net/ChristopherLBennett/DTI Calendar Notes.html

 

[JD]

Well, in STXI, Sarek and Amanda's home was on the outskirts, a hoverbike ride from the city proper.

Really, if we can accept the Gorn as a fearsome lizard monster when he's obviously a guy in a silly rubber costume, and we can accept recast characters, why not a "recast" Shi'Kahr?

If STXI were just another episode or movie, I might agree. But it was a modern retelling of Spock's life story - and thus, the "Yesteryear" infuenced scenes are supposed to take place in the same city they did in TAS.

I'm with you on this one. I've watched enough TV shows and movies to realize that when they say that two characters or settings that look totally different are the same, I just accept it and move on. I know one said they were the same city in the movie, but it would probably make the most sense storywise for them to be. Although, I guess since Spock was born after the universe changed, there is a chance it could be different. Damn, I hate when I counter my own point, it kinda destroys my argument.

 

[Christopher]

Although, I guess since Spock was born after the universe changed, there is a chance it could be different. Damn, I hate when I counter my own point, it kinda destroys my argument.

Actually he wasn't. The Narada arrived in 2233. Depending on which source you consult (the Okudachron or Memory Alpha), Spock was born in either 2230 or 2232.

The film was originally going to open with Spock's birth, before the Kelvin/Narada scene. They deleted that scene for pacing, so it's not canonical, but it was filmed.

 

[Sci]

Didn't "Yesteryear" establish ShiKahr as the capital city of Vulcan?

 

[DrBashir]

Does Spock's hometown have to be the capital? It was even destroyed by the Borg. I think it works better if ShiKahr is more like a uiniversity town. It makes the other kids treatment of young Spock more understandable if they're in a smaller, more conservative town rather than the larger capital whre, presumably there would be more contact with aliens.

 

[Christopher]

Didn't "Yesteryear" establish ShiKahr as the capital city of Vulcan?

No, just as the city where Spock's family lived, nothing more. There's nothing in canon suggesting it's the capital, although the script for ENT: "The Forge" makes it the site of the Earth embassy. I believe it was Spock's World by Diane Duane that portrayed ShiKahr as the capital, although J. M. Dillard dissented and established a city called ShanaiKahr as the Vulcan capital. Jean Lorrah's The Vulcan Academy Murders made it the site of the Vulcan Science Academy, but I don't think it was said to be the capital there.

 

[Sci]

Didn't "Yesteryear" establish ShiKahr as the capital city of Vulcan?

No, just as the city where Spock's family lived, nothing more. There's nothing in canon suggesting it's the capital, although the script for ENT: "The Forge" makes it the site of the Earth embassy. I believe it was Spock's World by Diane Duane that portrayed ShiKahr as the capital, although J. M. Dillard dissented and established a city called ShanaiKahr as the Vulcan capital. Jean Lorrah's The Vulcan Academy Murders made it the site of the Vulcan Science Academy, but I don't think it was said to be the capital there.

Fair enough. And in the age of interplanetary states, there is of course no particular reason to assume that the embassies of foreign states must necessarily be located in the capital city, though that is the common practice amongst modern states.