Voyager's Uniforms

[Dylan Hoffman]

Chakotay is a 'Lieutenant Commander', but he's probably officially outranked by Harry Kim. And maybe even the EMH.

I'm pretty sure Chakotay was a commander, hence "Commander Chakotay". Also, judging by the fact that the EMH had no rank pips, he lacks a rank.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Lance was making a joke,

 

[Dylan Hoffman]

Lance was making a joke,

I know, but I thought Chakotay was commander, that's all.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Actually it's a wardrobe issue, Chakotay wore a Lieutenant Commander Provisional Rank Badge (almost?) the whole time if you can look carefully (not joking)... Rank badges have to sent out to be made, and probably cost at least a thousand for a speciality/custom construction gig... Studio prices are detached from reality ...While the property master alternatively has thousands of pips laying about the set, which is why Tuvok;s wardrobe malfunction only took SEVERAL months to remedy because his rank "talked about" did not reflect his neckline for all of season one.

Cavitt definitely was a Lieutenant Commander, who had the job before Chakotay, and since job dictates rank, then the XO for Voyager should always be a Lieutenant Commander and not a full Commander becuase of the ships capabilities, the amount of staff their is to manage, and the type of missions the ship is expected to embark upon, which clearly means that Cavitt's Voyager was a different animal from Chakotay's Voyager.

Field Commissions are real. they have to be ratiffied with command back home, but then all promotions have to be rubber stamped back home. They could have reinstated his old rank, but was Tom a lieutenant before he blew up his life?

 

[Dylan Hoffman]

Actually it's a wardrobe issue, Chakotay wore a Lieutenant Commander Provisional Rank Badge (almost?) the whole time if you can look carefully (not joking)... Rank badges have to sent out to be made, and probably cost at least a thousand for a speciality/custom construction gig... Studio prices are detached from reality ...While the property master alternatively has thousands of pips laying about the set, which is why Tuvok;s wardrobe malfunction only took SEVERAL months to remedy because his rank "talked about" did not reflect his neckline for all of season one.

Cavitt definitely was a Lieutenant Commander, who had the job before Chakotay, and since job dictates rank, then the XO for Voyager should always be a Lieutenant Commander and not a full Commander becuase of the ships capabilities, the amount of staff their is to manage, and the type of missions the ship is expected to embark upon, which clearly means that Cavitt's Voyager was a different animal from Chakotay's Voyager.

Field Commissions are real. they have to be ratiffied with command back home, but then all promotions have to be rubber stamped back home. They could have reinstated his old rank, but was Tom a lieutenant before he blew up his life?

Hmm, I must've never really looked at the Maquis provisional rank badges. I always assumed they were the same. I suppose I thought Chakotay was commander because that's what he was called in show and all, but Lieutenant Commander would've been a bit cumbersome to say. (ei. Lieutenant Commader Chakotay, report to the bridge.)

But then again, suppose some random person with the full rank of Commander, is assigned to Voyager as her First Officer. Would he have had to be reduced to the rank of Lt. Cmdr.? (If following what you said about the ships capabilities, crew management etc.) Or would he have not been assigned at all and another person with the rank of Lt. Cmdr. be assigned?

 

[Guy Gardener]

Decker received a field demotion when kirk took his ship.

Did Decker take a second field demotion in as many hours when Spock showed up?

His suicide at the end is starting to make a lot of sense.

(Oh, this is a cosplay home made dealio. Website says that he used real gold, or maybe gold leaf/plating. If the real badges were made (partially) from gold, then the thousand dollar estimate I gave to make more rank badges is low. Very low.)

That there is enlisted (one black stripe.), ensign (one gold Stripe), lieutenant junior grade (one gold stripe, one black stripe.), Full lieutenant (two gold stripes.), Lieutenant Commander (two gold, one black.).

Full Commander (three gold stripes) and Captain (Four gold stripes) it seems, were never made for the pilot, and room in the budget was never considered for the next 169ish episodes, other wise this bloke would have rendered duplicates of those as well, in theory.

(Google, google.)

The insigna for provisional commander follows the pattern of what would be a lieutenant commander, but the only character ever seen wearing this insignia--Chakotay--held a rank of provisional commander throughout the series. An insignia resembling that of a traditional commander rank insignia, logically consisting of three solid gold lines within the lozenge, was never seen on camera. In "Before and After", Chakotay is promoted to Captain and wears the standard Starfleet insignia of four pips. This may indicate that there is no provisional rank insignia for Captain. It should also be noted that Chakotay was a commissioned Starfleet Officer with a rank of Lt. Commander prior to his defecting to the Maquis, so gaining a Starfleet Captain's rank wouldn't be an issue.

 

[stardream]

They could have reinstated his old rank, but was Tom a lieutenant before he blew up his life?

For some reason, I thought he was. Maybe it was something I read in that Pathfinders book.

 

[Tracy Trek]

I know that Neelix was shown at ops in "Living Witness" wearing a gold uniform, but that was in a holographic simulation. When else did he wear a Starfleet uniform?

I think he was wearing one in the Before and After alternate reality wasn't he? But since it was an alternate reality perhaps it doesn't count.

 

[SPCTRE]

Cavitt definitely was a Lieutenant Commander

sometimes I like to imagine how the show would have been with him (and doctor Dickhead with his Vulcan nurse) - in my imagination, he's even more bland than Chuckles, and the doc, well, he's just a dick all the time

 

[Guy Gardener]

Seconds ago, I realized that Berman had to kill Dr. Fitzgerald and LtCmdr Cavitt, because of Paramount's 90s crusade to keep Star Trek straight.

They were totally Husbands.

 

[Lance]

I'm pretty sure Chakotay was a commander, hence "Commander Chakotay". Also, judging by the fact that the EMH had no rank pips, he lacks a rank.

To be fair, I agree with you. But Chakotay's rank has been something of a nebulous issue within the fandom for some years. His screen credit and dialogue certainly conform to his being a Commander; but this discussion was all about the rank pips, and for all seven seasons he wears Lieutenant Commander (provisional) pips. And as our esteemed Guy Gardener points out, his predecessor as Voyager's XO, the Officially Fully 100% Starfleet Commander Cavitt, also wore Lt Cmdr pips, so one wonders if the XO on a ship as small as Voyager is ever more than a Lieutenant Commander in rank, or whether the requirement for XO on smaller ships like the Intrepid Class is lower than for (say) a Galaxy or Sovereign. Certainly, Sisko was also a Lieutenant Commander where he was XO on the USS Saratoga, and it's implied that Riker was a Lieutenant Commander as XO of the USS Hood before TNG's first season, only being bumped up to full Commander when he got the Enterprise commission.

But I digress.

 

[Akiraprise]

It's pretty common among all of the series to refer to Lieutenant Commanders as just Commander in dialogue. Lt. Cdrs are also often the XO's of ships. Typically smaller ones.

 

[Guy Gardener]

1. Maybe Janeway didn't rut with Chakotay because he wasn't a full Commander?

2. Maybe Janeway made sure that Chuckles wasn't a full Lieutenant to stop herself form rutting with him?

3. Nothing weird ever happened whenever Commander Bartlet had command.

 

[LJones41]

Chakotay was given the provisional rank of (full) Commander by Janeway, despite whatever pips he was wearing. Either the person who handled the costumes for Voyager got it wrong, or else some viewers have been erroneously identifying the pips on some of the characters' uniforms. The only error I can recall centered around Tuvok, who wore the pips of a Lieutenant Commander for several episodes during the show's first season.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I think he was wearing one in the Before and After alternate reality wasn't he? But since it was an alternate reality perhaps it doesn't count.

Yes. Right, I don't think this one "counts," either, for that reason.

 

[Catarina]

maybe I'm only recalling Year of Hell and i know..it's a reset episode.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

maybe I'm only recalling Year of Hell and i know..it's a reset episode.

Yep, d'oh, Neelix wears gold in that one, too.

 

[Lance]

Chakotay was given the provisional rank of (full) Commander by Janeway, despite whatever pips he was wearing. Either the person who handled the costumes for Voyager got it wrong, or else some viewers have been erroneously identifying the pips on some of the characters' uniforms.

The confusion comes from a quirk in the nomenclature: in Star Trek, Lieutenant Commanders are often refered to as 'Commander' anyway (eg. Commander Data), so the fact that Chakotay is always called Commander Chakotay is inconclusive. Given his Lt Cmdr pips, and that Cavitt in "Caretaker" also wears Lt Cmdr pips in the .4 of a second he is Voyager's first officer, there's as much screen evidence for Chakotay being a Lt Cmdr as there is him being a full Commander.

The third option is as Guy has already alluded that the 'Provisional Commander' pips don't correlate to the regular 3 pips, despite every other provisional rank pip we see having a direct correlation to the number of pips on the official uniform.

If you type 'Chakotay Rank' into Google the first response states he's a "Field commissioned Lieutenant Commander". But the list goes on to be full of links of people debating the yays and nays of both sides.

 

[Guy Gardener]

At half way home, Janeway was going to promote every one (that deserved it) up one grade, but it would be silly to make Chakotay also the Captain.

Although, Chuckles definitely would have gotten Equinox if that ship had surivived those titular episodes. Kathryn owed him a ship.

 

[stardream]

At half way home, Janeway was going to promote every one (that deserved it) up one grade, but it would be silly to make Chakotay also the Captain.

Although, Chuckles definitely would have gotten Equinox if that ship had surivived those titular episodes. Kathryn owed him a ship.

I'm might have to put you on my ignore list. Not because your postings offend me but because you keep coming up with these ideas that would make for some interesting fanfiction and I don't have the time to work them out....but the J/C angsters would love that.