Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
There, I did it.
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Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)_
- Thread starter Dorian Thompson
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Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
About Floki...
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1yKxL6Ch6E[/yt]
About Floki...
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1yKxL6Ch6E[/yt]
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
That settled matters. I only wish the show could have had a half hour or more to fill out the story better. Great finale, just a bit rushed. On to season 3, time to sack Paris! http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/652...history-channel-show-renewed-filming-updates/
That settled matters. I only wish the show could have had a half hour or more to fill out the story better. Great finale, just a bit rushed. On to season 3, time to sack Paris! http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/652...history-channel-show-renewed-filming-updates/
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
Didn't the real life Rollo who lived in the 10th century sack Paris? Perhaps the fictional 9th century Rollo will lead the raiding party.
Okay, so I was wrong about Floki. I guess that conversation in Wessex about who was trustworthy was for Horik's benefit since he was present. Still, when did he and Ragnar concoct this plan? I agree that the finale was exciting, but too rushed. Siggy's motives were harder to determine. Was she Ragnar's inside woman all along? Her conversation with the seer was private so it wasn't a performance for anyone else's benefit. Did she only turn on Horik when he asked her to kill Ragnar's sons since her own sons were murdered? I couldn't decide. Lagertha and her men were ready to go, so it seems they were expecting this attack.
I found the scene between Ragnar and Athelstan quite profound. I'm wondering if Floki would have remained loyal had he seen Ragnar learning a prayer to the Christian God. The subtle and profound change in the dynamic between Ragnar and Athelstan struck me like a thunderous Odin. Ragnar hadn't said, "Amen" and was ready to stand--Athelstan gives him a look and Ragnar resumes the prayer. Athelstan was, in effect, calling the shots in that situation and Ragnar wordlessly deferred. That's a profound difference from four (now five since a child's been born during the season) years previous when Athelstan was kidnapped to Kattegut.
Didn't the real life Rollo who lived in the 10th century sack Paris? Perhaps the fictional 9th century Rollo will lead the raiding party.
Okay, so I was wrong about Floki. I guess that conversation in Wessex about who was trustworthy was for Horik's benefit since he was present. Still, when did he and Ragnar concoct this plan? I agree that the finale was exciting, but too rushed. Siggy's motives were harder to determine. Was she Ragnar's inside woman all along? Her conversation with the seer was private so it wasn't a performance for anyone else's benefit. Did she only turn on Horik when he asked her to kill Ragnar's sons since her own sons were murdered? I couldn't decide. Lagertha and her men were ready to go, so it seems they were expecting this attack.
I found the scene between Ragnar and Athelstan quite profound. I'm wondering if Floki would have remained loyal had he seen Ragnar learning a prayer to the Christian God. The subtle and profound change in the dynamic between Ragnar and Athelstan struck me like a thunderous Odin. Ragnar hadn't said, "Amen" and was ready to stand--Athelstan gives him a look and Ragnar resumes the prayer. Athelstan was, in effect, calling the shots in that situation and Ragnar wordlessly deferred. That's a profound difference from four (now five since a child's been born during the season) years previous when Athelstan was kidnapped to Kattegut.
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
I don't really like what they did to Horik. During the first season, he came across to me as a warm man that could be a good ally, a counterpoint to their villain. Second season turned him into a regular backstabber, which I felt quite disappointing. I was honestly not expecting that out of him. I thought he was smarter than that.
I don't really like what they did to Horik. During the first season, he came across to me as a warm man that could be a good ally, a counterpoint to their villain. Second season turned him into a regular backstabber, which I felt quite disappointing. I was honestly not expecting that out of him. I thought he was smarter than that.
Mister Fandango
Fleet Captain
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
Jealousy got the best of him. He saw how everyone was looking to Ragnar rather than to him for leadership, advice, and negotiations, and he became fearful of his position, just as he told his son in this very episode.
Jealousy got the best of him. He saw how everyone was looking to Ragnar rather than to him for leadership, advice, and negotiations, and he became fearful of his position, just as he told his son in this very episode.
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
Yes, you're right. The show is not using folks who are not contemporaneous to one another. Michael Hirst says they are going to sack Paris so we might see Rollo get Normandy.
Yes, you're right. The show is not using folks who are not contemporaneous to one another. Michael Hirst says they are going to sack Paris so we might see Rollo get Normandy.
Siggy is a hard one to see, she had to get past her anger and the speech with the seer sure made her look like she could be a traitor. But not long after Auslaug started courting Siggy's frienship as she had already figured out Siggy's anger on her own. Also, Horik's whoring her out to his creepy son didn't do him any favors in her books. I think Siggy realized Horik couldn't be trusted then. It's not long after that she wants to share some secrets with Floki at the feast for Jarl Borg. Siggy had earlier talked to Rollo about keeping his options open with both Ragnar and Horik until he knew which could benefit him most. I think that was just as true of her as well.
It was a great scene, and Ragnar not reciting the whole prayer goes along well with Athelstan not eating the Host at the Mass in Wessex which Athelwulf noticed. They, like Ecbert, are men looking for new ways forward in the era.
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
That much is obvious. I just wasn't too happy with why it was done. He seemed to me a reasonable man, someone who Ragnar was looking at as an equal. I would have been much more satisfied had his story not fallen to a trope. Had he stuck around as a supportive character, I think it would have made a much more powerful statement, especially given that in real life, he outlived Ragnar. Outlive Ragnar and he wouldn't have anything to fear and actually mourn the loss of a friend.
That much is obvious. I just wasn't too happy with why it was done. He seemed to me a reasonable man, someone who Ragnar was looking at as an equal. I would have been much more satisfied had his story not fallen to a trope. Had he stuck around as a supportive character, I think it would have made a much more powerful statement, especially given that in real life, he outlived Ragnar. Outlive Ragnar and he wouldn't have anything to fear and actually mourn the loss of a friend.
Mister Fandango
Fleet Captain
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
That's the point. Ragnar has modern sensibilities. He's willing to treat others as equals for the most part as doesn't have any aspirations to be the one and only king, but those of a higher station become terrified of his popularity, his intelligence, and his charisma and quickly see him as a threat. That's exactly what happened with Horrik. In fact, I dare say that was the entire point of his storyline.
That's the point. Ragnar has modern sensibilities. He's willing to treat others as equals for the most part as doesn't have any aspirations to be the one and only king, but those of a higher station become terrified of his popularity, his intelligence, and his charisma and quickly see him as a threat. That's exactly what happened with Horrik. In fact, I dare say that was the entire point of his storyline.
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
Horik was somebody who came off as a reasonable man, but used that as a façade for manipulation and betrayal. That much was set up fairly early when he made peace with Jarl Borg, then decided that he didn't want to raid with him and set it up so that Ragnar would look like the bad guy. Wasn't that late last season?
Horik was somebody who came off as a reasonable man, but used that as a façade for manipulation and betrayal. That much was set up fairly early when he made peace with Jarl Borg, then decided that he didn't want to raid with him and set it up so that Ragnar would look like the bad guy. Wasn't that late last season?
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
Also, fame is hugely important in their society, even more so than gold. Acclamation brings supporters and can even supplant rulers at that time in the Viking age. Titles didn't necessarily fall to children of the title holder or other blood successors of the titled individual. The aspirant to a title had to have the acclamation of the people. The was what Earl Haroldson feared from Ragnar's rapid rise and how Ragnar became earl the people had to accept him. Horik is worried that the like of Borg, and Ragnar will bring supporters to Ragnar from his own supporters. Especially so, as Ragnar is bringing them new lands as well as wealth.
Also, fame is hugely important in their society, even more so than gold. Acclamation brings supporters and can even supplant rulers at that time in the Viking age. Titles didn't necessarily fall to children of the title holder or other blood successors of the titled individual. The aspirant to a title had to have the acclamation of the people. The was what Earl Haroldson feared from Ragnar's rapid rise and how Ragnar became earl the people had to accept him. Horik is worried that the like of Borg, and Ragnar will bring supporters to Ragnar from his own supporters. Especially so, as Ragnar is bringing them new lands as well as wealth.
Re: Vikings season 2 episodes discussions (spoilers inside, of course)
Which demonstrates perfectly why Ragnar's so drawn to Athelstan. Even his own brother, whom he loves, became jealous of Ragnar and was willing to fight against him. Athelstan respects him without wanting his power. He can teach him new things about which he's curious. Ragnar doesn't have to worry about a knife in his back from the priest. Schmaltzy as it sounds, Athelstan likes Ragnar for being Ragnar, not for being Earl Lothbrok. Makes sense even in the sense of Floki and Rollo's hostility to Athelstan. They're jealous of his closeness with Ragnar.
Which demonstrates perfectly why Ragnar's so drawn to Athelstan. Even his own brother, whom he loves, became jealous of Ragnar and was willing to fight against him. Athelstan respects him without wanting his power. He can teach him new things about which he's curious. Ragnar doesn't have to worry about a knife in his back from the priest. Schmaltzy as it sounds, Athelstan likes Ragnar for being Ragnar, not for being Earl Lothbrok. Makes sense even in the sense of Floki and Rollo's hostility to Athelstan. They're jealous of his closeness with Ragnar.
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