Using Deepfake in Trek... Yes or no?

Discussion in 'Future of Trek' started by Roald, Jan 2, 2021.

  1. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Vice Admiral Admiral

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    What would be the point though? Why continually beat the nostalgia horse to death instead of actually doing something new and original?
     
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  2. jackoverfull

    jackoverfull Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Money, what other point could it be?
     
  3. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Deepfake in films is a mistake. It makes it look like actors performed something they didn't.

    This is Hollywood. Roles get recast. Suspension of disbelief is a useful thing.
     
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  4. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Um, money. People don't want new. They want safe and familiar.
     
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  5. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Oh God. Tell me about it. Slightly on a tangent but still related to this. At work today, I had to deal with someone who wouldn't shut up about stuff that came out in the '80s. Non-stop. "Hey, you remember this?" "Hey, you remember that?" Polite society didn't allow me to say "Will you please just STFU?" Then I had to put on an act, so he wouldn't notice I was getting frustrated with him.

    Afterwards, I go to the supermarket to pick up something, and -- of course -- I hear '80s music.

    Thanks society. You've killed what used to be my favorite decade. Not anymore.

    I'm worried about the same thing happening here. TNG was never my favorite Trek series, so no big deal there if someone says "Yeah, but TNG this! TNG that!" Business as usual. I'll rebut it like I normally do. But lately, whenever I see someone say "Yeah, but TOS this! TOS that!", it starts to drive me up the wall now.

    Eventually, there will be a serious backlash against mid-to-late-20th Century culture and nostalgia. It's coming.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2021
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  6. Daddy Todd

    Daddy Todd Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    From your lips to FSM's ear! I love early '80's music (I was in college watching a LOT of MTV at the time, and the Go-Go's are stuck in my head as securely as the Jefferson Airplane is stuck in the head of an ex-hippie boomer) but I'm sick to death of it! I'm ready for something new to engage me.

    Maybe that's why I adore "The Expanse" out of all proportion to it's excellence. Don't get me wrong; it's pretty damn good. But it's not, you know, the most amazing thing EVER. But it is a new and different flavor of space opera. Discovery feels tired and old-fashioned somehow, despite occasionally dropping an f-bomb.
     
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  7. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    See, I don't mind it because nothing that society does will impact my view. I have spent most of my life on the outside of what was considered cool or popular, even within my small circle of nerd friends. I always liked Adam West Batman over Burton, TOS over TNG, and never cared for popular music. I was told to stop liking things and eventually friends gave up and accepted me as just plain weird. Yup, I was the weird nerd ;)

    I do hope there is a push back against nostalgia but people have to be willing buy something new.
     
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  8. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Every new era is a reaction to the last one. Whatever's hot today will be completely rejected tomorrow. So pushback against nostalgia being so in vogue is what will probably separate the next era from this one.

    But beyond that, it also has to do with finding something that fills a desire. They'll be willing to buy something new when they're sick of what they already have and there's demand for something else that has nothing to do with it. Sometimes that leaves someone frustrated if they can't find any alternatives, but if someone doesn't look elsewhere at all, then their desire is to be unsatisfied. That last instance is the type of feeling that the Fandom Menace feeds off of and takes advantage of.
     
  9. Jayson1

    Jayson1 Admiral Admiral

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    With the success of
    Luke Skywalker
    on The Mandalorian I wonder. Maybe it would be a good idea to bring young Kirk to the Pike show. I mean their is already talks of Kirk showing up on the show at some point anyway and if done right you might even get the same positive reaction that the
    Luke Skywalker
    scene did. Granted you also still have right it well and make it emotional and have a good reason for Kirk to show up but I think it could work.


    Jason
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 15, 2021
  10. Yistaan

    Yistaan Commodore Commodore

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    I don't know if Shatner is as easygoing as other actors in allowing his young likeness to be used.

    Also, Shatner voicing young Kirk might sound odd because he's a lot older. I know there was some mention of that when the late Sean Connery voiced young James Bond in the From Russia with Love game over a decade ago. Even if you play the PC games Star Trek 25th anniversary and Judgment Rites, the characters sound off because their voices are far older than their TOS ages in the games.
     
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  11. dupersuper

    dupersuper Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    If it's MCU quality, I might be open to it. If it's Leia in Rogue One or you-know-who in the season finale of Mandalorian quality; no thanks.
     
  12. Beckerjr

    Beckerjr Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Yea by then someone will be able to just take a random book and have their equivalent of a personal computer CGI/Deepfake an entire movie for them in minutes.
     
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  13. Kor

    Kor Admiral Admiral

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    Not until they can get rid of the gag-inducing "uncanny valley" factor.
    (And I still see it in the latest stuff that gets posted on Youtube and that people think looks really great)

    Kor
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2021
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  14. somebuddyx

    somebuddyx Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I think mostly not, because Trek has recast several times for some people and proved it can get past the need to bring the original cast back to life. I especially liked the reboots bringing in Bruce Greenwood as Pike. Even if deepfaking is flawless, do you have to get an impressionist to dub over too? There's that "Star Trek: The First Generation" trailer with Shatner's face on Pine and Nimoy's face on Quinto but Quinto's voice coming out of Nimoy sounds weird and wrong. Karl Urban's Bones is all buff and tall but then you had DeForest Kelly who was 60s fit and looks weird pasted onto Urban. If "Strange New Worlds" did some time travel episode into its future and landed on the Enterprise under Kirk, I'd be far more interested in seeing some new kid play Kirk and what he does with the part rather than Billy Shatner's face pasted onto and some rando's impression dubbed over a stand-in. I totally understand the allure of trying the technology out though.
     
  15. Yistaan

    Yistaan Commodore Commodore

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    In my opinion it's hardly worse than the plastic Orions we just had running around a few weeks ago...
     
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  16. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Shatner sounds weird in the 1991 Judgement Rites game, where he's voicing TOS-era Kirk. His voice has changed a lot.
     
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  17. Yistaan

    Yistaan Commodore Commodore

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    The thing people are forgetting when talking about the, uh, Mandalorian cameo is that the actor involved is a very seasoned and widely acclaimed voice actor who can change his voice in a heartbeat. He has no problem sounding like his younger self, but other actors would likely have more difficulty achieving this effect.
     
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  18. JaxsBrokenHeart

    JaxsBrokenHeart Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    As far as voices, it is worth noting that AI simulations are making progress on that as well.



    Crude at the moment, but given its an early effort and being done by essentially a enthusiast with a likely small budget? Who knows where we'll be in 10-15 years with it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2021
  19. Yistaan

    Yistaan Commodore Commodore

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    Given how much Alec Guinness infamously disliked Star Wars, I'm going to guess that this bit was done without any permission from his estate. Oh well.
     
  20. valkyrie013

    valkyrie013 Commodore Commodore

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    Really depends if its just like a cameo, or a short bit like the De Age stuff in Marvel movies, but if there going to do more, ReCast and move on. People can accept new people in roles.