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Uhura's first name

I agree Espaco-Chica.

Throughout the entire series of episodes and movies she was referred to as simply Uhura. It wasn't until Star Trek 2009, a movie set in an alternate reality, that she was given the name Nyota on screen. Since it's open season for so many other things to have changed due to the new timeline there's the possibility her parents gave her a first name in the Abrams universe but not in the Roddenberry one.

It's not really that important. I'm never going to refer to her as Nyota anyway. A lot of stuff from the novels has made it to the screen such as Sulu's first name and I'm thankful for that because those details fill in the little gaps that bug me but I'm fine with a mononymous Uhura. The only version of her ever to be called Nyota on screen is virtually a brand new character who shares very few character traits of the Nichelle version anyway.
 
Except it's not really a legitimate Swahili name. It should be Uhuru, but Roddenberry stuck a totally incongruous Romance-language feminine suffix on it. And as far as I know, Swahili-speaking peoples generally use two names -- e.g. Uhuru Kenyatta, the current (male) president of Kenya. Calling her "Uhura," no other name, isn't really African, it's pseudo-Africana filtered through a white person's perceptions. "Uhura" as a surname makes no linguistic sense, but at least giving her a first and last name is more authentic.


Language changes over time. Perhaps by that century naming practices will have changed as well.
 
We really don't know how language works in Star Trek.

There's a universal translator, so everyone understands each other, unless they want to make up an alien language.

There are hundreds of languages and dialects in Earth, but everyone speaks English, although it's accented differently for some.

Uhura may not be her name but the Federation standard equivalent. Like Spock's name. It may be unpronounceable because there is no Federation standard to translate it into.

But I don't know. I'm just guessing.
I'm fine that her name is Uhura and nothing else.
NFN NMI Uhura, right?
 
Too bad his first name wasn't also pan-Asian.
Well, in a way it was. A Japanese-American with a name from a sea near The Philippines.

Throughout the entire series of episodes and movies she was referred to as simply Uhura.

Spock once called her Miss Uhura, IIRC.

BTW, didn't "Tiberius" as Kirk's middle name start out as a joke by David Gerrold at a convention because "I, Claudius" was running at the time? I forget exactly where I read that.

"I, Claudius" was 1976, long after he used it in "Bem". I think Christopher is correct, that it derived from a previous Roddenberry character in "The Lieutenant".

"I, Claudius" was broadcast in the United States as part of PBS's "Masterpiece Theatre". It won an Emmy in 1978.
 
It's interesting that the ethnic minority characters very broadly represented the regions they came from, while the Caucasian characters from the western hemisphere were given more specific origins. Instead of a "pan-European" character, we got Scotty and Chekov, who were stereotypically (sometimes comically so) Scottish and Russian, respectively. And McCoy had a regional accent and "southern gentleman" persona.

Does this mean that the western world stayed stagnant and maintained regional diversity for hundreds of years, while Asia and Africa moved toward greater homogeneity (while their personal naming conventions changed so much that people have names that can't possibly exist in the present day)?

No, it means that American audiences at the time saw other cultures like Asians and Africans as uniform "others," and Roddenberry was trying to address the perceptions of white American audiences and give them positive portrayals of those groups as a whole. But unfortunately, it ended up being rather racially problematical in itself, because of that selfsame homogenization, the choice to portray them as generic rather than authentic representatives of specific cultures. The same thing was done with Chakotay on Voyager -- instead of identifying him with a specific Native American people, they made him a "generic" Indian from an invented amalgam culture. I gather that real Native American viewers are not very happy with that.


Honestly, I wish McIntyre had chosen a different name. Hikaru was the nickname of the title character in the world's oldest novel, The Tale of Genji by the Lady Murasaki, and The Entropy Effect made it clear that Sulu was named in reference to the book's character. But Genji is a really, really awful human being. He's a rich, shallow, vapid, entitled noble with no worthwhile qualities beyond beauty and breeding, and he's a rapist and abuser of women in a culture where such behavior was normative. I read the book in college (well, an abridged, translated version), and I don't think I have ever loathed a fictional protagonist more intensely (not even Holden Caulfield). Sulu deserved a better namesake.

It sounds like McIntyre didn't read the book.

More likely she was just more willing to see the positives in it than I was. It was a product of the cultural assumptions of its time, after all, like any work is. I couldn't get past the sexism and entitlement and shallowness of Genji, but he was intended as a paragon of the traits that were admired in the Japanese nobility of the time, so maybe McIntyre was better able to look past the cognitive dissonance with our own values and appreciate it in the spirit in which it was written. I loathed the character myself, but I'm not going to assume another person lacks familiarity with the text just because she reacted to it differently than I did.


Sulu was supposed to be a pan-Asian character
Too bad his first name wasn't also pan-Asian.

Except that "Sulu" is not a "pan-Asian" name in any sense. It's a Filipino name. It's from the language of the Tausug people of the Philippines and is a variant of the Malay name of their home region. The only reason Roddenberry thought of it as "pan-Asian" was because he saw it as the name of a sea that abutted a few Asian countries (a very few in just one small region of Asia), but that was a really, really nonsensical and ignorant way of coming to that conclusion. It just underlines that Roddenberry knew very little about the cultures he was trying to represent positively. Good intentions but awful research skills.


Except it's not really a legitimate Swahili name. It should be Uhuru, but Roddenberry stuck a totally incongruous Romance-language feminine suffix on it. And as far as I know, Swahili-speaking peoples generally use two names -- e.g. Uhuru Kenyatta, the current (male) president of Kenya. Calling her "Uhura," no other name, isn't really African, it's pseudo-Africana filtered through a white person's perceptions. "Uhura" as a surname makes no linguistic sense, but at least giving her a first and last name is more authentic.


Language changes over time. Perhaps by that century naming practices will have changed as well.

Granted, many or most African cultures did not traditionally use surnames in the European sense. For instance, in some West African cultures, a person's second name is the name of their father rather than a family name. And while it was common to have more than one name, it apparently was not universal, and might not be even today. (By the way, in looking up information on African naming patterns, I found a PDF college thesis about it in the context of African-American names, and one of the examples given was the name of a person I think I went to college with, or perhaps a similarly-named relative of his. Small world.) If anything, many African cultures tend to give their children multiple names, and the choice of names can have a complex meaning and set of traditions behind it.

But if you're going to portray a cultural change, it should be based on research into the culture in question and plausibly extrapolated from its history and values. It shouldn't be making something up out of ignorance and then just arbitrarily asserting that the culture changed itself to fit your wild guesses. That's no better than stereotyping. It's portraying them as an exotic Other and assuming that it doesn't matter how they differ from familiar Eurocentric norms, so long as they fall into "Them" rather than "Us."

I mean, why should it be Africans who've arbitrarily changed their naming customs? Why not have a white character use only one name, or who has multiple names according to African or Arab convention? Or, heck, if you want a character who uses only one name, do the damn research and pick someone from a part of the world where people actually do use only one name, like Indonesia.

Roddenberry was trying to be inclusive, but he was coming at it from a deeply Eurocentric and uneducated perspective, and he settled for doing a minimum of research and making up crap that would sound plausible to ignorant white audiences who wouldn't know the difference, rather than doing the actual legwork to get it right. That is not something to be embraced.
 
Spock once called her Miss Uhura, IIRC.

That was in "The Man Trap" if I'm not mistaken. But that still doesn't mean she couldn't be a one-name person like Cher and Madonna. On Dallas (1978), everybody called Ellie Ewing "Miss Ellie." It's just good manners.

I like one-name Uhura better than Nyota Uhura.

I would vote for calling her "Penny Uhura" before Nyota. In fact, I think Penny is a great name for her, to show that she's a member of our culture and not just some culture from Africa.

I doubt if Penny's maiden name on TBBT will ever be revealed. It's too anti-climactic at this point, like getting to "Cosmo Kramer."
 
I like one-name Uhura better than Nyota Uhura.

Why? What's wrong with Nyota? Essentially her name means "Star of Freedom," which is pretty cool.


I would vote for calling her "Penny Uhura" before Nyota. In fact, I think Penny is a great name for her, to show that she's a member of our culture and not just some culture from Africa.

"Some culture from Africa?" That's very dismissive. Why in the world would it be better for her to be from "our culture" than another? The whole point of her and Sulu's existence as characters is multiculturalism, to show that "our culture" isn't the only one participating in Starfleet. Sure, Roddenberry was pretty hamfisted and ethnocentric in the way he handled it, but he at least tried to be multicultural. Uhura is meant to be a Swahili-speaking native of the United States of Africa. Not an African-American but a full African, representing an Africa that has become united and successful. That's an important statement, especially given how wartorn and impoverished Africa is now as a legacy of rapacious European colonialism. Showing that Africans themselves, not just African-Americans, have a bright future as part of the Federation is very inspirational. "Our culture" is not the only one that deserves to be represented. It's already vastly overrepresented in Star Trek, with the overwhelming majority of human characters in the show having British or Irish names. Why in the world would you want to take away one of the all-too-few Trek regulars who actually represent non-European cultures?
 
I like one-name Uhura better than Nyota Uhura.

Why? What's wrong with Nyota? Essentially her name means "Star of Freedom," which is pretty cool.


I would vote for calling her "Penny Uhura" before Nyota. In fact, I think Penny is a great name for her, to show that she's a member of our culture and not just some culture from Africa.
"Some culture from Africa?" That's very dismissive. Why in the world would it be better for her to be from "our culture" than another? The whole point of her and Sulu's existence as characters is multiculturalism, to show that "our culture" isn't the only one participating in Starfleet. Sure, Roddenberry was pretty hamfisted and ethnocentric in the way he handled it, but he at least tried to be multicultural. Uhura is meant to be a Swahili-speaking native of the United States of Africa. Not an African-American but a full African, representing an Africa that has become united and successful. That's an important statement, especially given how wartorn and impoverished Africa is now as a legacy of rapacious European colonialism. Showing that Africans themselves, not just African-Americans, have a bright future as part of the Federation is very inspirational. "Our culture" is not the only one that deserves to be represented. It's already vastly overrepresented in Star Trek, with the overwhelming majority of human characters in the show having British or Irish names. Why in the world would you want to take away one of the all-too-few Trek regulars who actually represent non-European cultures?

But, in-universe, would such identity labels be necessary in the time of TOS? I'm hoping that by that time we're past this -- at least that's what we were lead to believe, no?
 
But, in-universe, would such identity labels be necessary in the time of TOS? I'm hoping that by that time we're past this -- at least that's what we were lead to believe, no?

Being past conflict does not mean turning everything into a single homogeneous monoculture -- especially not assimilating everyone else on Earth into "our culture." That's exactly the opposite of what Roddenberry was trying (however clumsily) to portray -- a world where people celebrated each other's diversity, where they were from many different cultures that all got along and worked together. Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations. The core philosophy Roddenberry promoted was that different people and groups working together, letting their different strengths and attributes complement each other, worked better than a single uniform culture with no internal variations.
 
Well, agreed... but wouldn't it just be a fait accompli at the time of TOS, without the need to label it as such? I'm not saying that people won't value their history and culture, but I'm hoping that we don't still rely on hyphenated descriptions of ourselves in the future -- or maybe I'm just projecting my own hopes here.
 
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But, in-universe, would such identity labels be necessary in the time of TOS? I'm hoping that by that time we're past this -- at least that's what we were lead to believe, no?

But the show was made for 20th century audiences.

Arguments like the above always feel like subtle racism.
 
Well, agreed... but wouldn't it just be a fait accompli at the time of TOS, without the need to label it as such? I'm not saying that people won't value their history and culture, but I'm hoping that we don't still rely on hyphenated descriptions of ourselves in the future -- or maybe I'm just projecting my own hopes here.

That's just my point. Uhura isn't hyphenated. She's not African-American, not "Penny Uhura" -- she's fully African, her name is fully African (aside from that stupid damn feminine suffix), her native language is KiSwahili, etc. What the hell is wrong with that? "Ourselves" isn't just America. "Ourselves" includes everybody, including people who are born in Africa and speak KiSwahili and who only learn English as a second language. That's not "labeling," it's just a baseline identity every bit as much as your own is.

The problem with those "cultural identity doesn't matter" arguments is that the unspoken undercurrent is usually "Everyone should act like my culture rather than somebody else's." Would you be as quick to say cultural identity doesn't matter if you were the one expected to conform to someone else's cultural standards instead of your own? If it were a future where everyone spoke Chinese, say, instead of American English?
 
Espaço-chica said:
Too bad his first name wasn't also pan-Asian.

Well, as an Asian-American myself, I would say that a surname and a given name from two completely different parts of the Asia-Pacific region, put together in the same person's name, looks really unusual (to put it mildly). That speaks more to a broad cross-cultural and cross-border mixing of the type more common in Europe (e.g. Nicolas Sarkozy), but still extremely rare in Asia.

While naming conventions in the Philippines are apparently more diverse than in other parts of the region, "Sulu" seems to be a purely geographical name, and I don't know if it's anybody's surname in real life. But in three hundred years it might be.:shrug:

Christopher said:
No, it means that American audiences at the time saw other cultures like Asians and Africans as uniform "others," and Roddenberry was trying to address the perceptions of white American audiences and give them positive portrayals of those groups as a whole. But unfortunately, it ended up being rather racially problematical in itself, because of that selfsame homogenization, the choice to portray them as generic rather than authentic representatives of specific cultures.

True, that is of course the real-world reason. But I'm trying to think through in-universe explanations.

Kor
 
"Some culture from Africa?" That's very dismissive. Why in the world would it be better for her to be from "our culture" than another? The whole point of her and Sulu's existence as characters is multiculturalism, to show that "our culture" isn't the only one participating in Starfleet.


I love the way you put scare quotes around "our culture" to show your distaste for the very concept. :lol:

As to why it would be better for Uhura to come from Western civilization, my feelings arise from noting what sub-Saharan Africa really brought to the table.

Swahili_2_zps5ghygeih.jpg



We're talking about places that had no alphabet and no numerals, to say nothing of written language and math, until people from other civilizations (mostly Europeans) came along and gave it to them.

And that's okay. Everybody learned it from somewhere. But in 1966, when our guys were getting ready to land on the moon, I'm pretty sure these territories in Africa didn't have indoor plumbing or electricity except to the extent that Westerners brought it in.

They had slavery before the white man ever got there, and wars aplenty, but they just were not a group of cultures that achieved much advancement apart from what was imported from the outside.

So if, in the 23rd Century, the Swahili-speaking areas are highly advanced societies (and of course they will be, no question), they will have gotten there indirectly. And I'm just saying Uhura might as well be one of us, a direct participant in Western civilization, rather than coming from a place that's more a recipient of the West's intellectual exports.
 
As to why it would be better for Uhura to come from Western civilization, my feelings arise from noting what sub-Saharan Africa really brought to the table....

We're talking about places that had no alphabet and no numerals, to say nothing of written language and math, until people from other civilizations (mostly Europeans) came along and gave it to them.

Europe would never have had the Renaissance if not for the gold its merchants obtained from the wealthy sub-Saharan kingdoms of Mali and Songhay. The sub-Saharan city of Timbuktu was the site of the world's first modern university.

Not to mention that the Europeans had no concept of decimal numbers until they got it from India by way of the Middle East (which is why we call them "Arabic numerals"). Europeans also got much of their medical and scientific knowledge from Muslim scholars in the Mideast and North Africa, not to mention other Mideast and Asian innovations like stirrups, the magnetic compass, gunpowder, movable type, the moldboard plow, and the lateen sail.


And that's okay. Everybody learned it from somewhere. But in 1966, when our guys were getting ready to land on the moon, I'm pretty sure these territories in Africa didn't have indoor plumbing or electricity except to the extent that Westerners brought it in.

And a thousand years before that, Europeans were impoverished and ignorant compared to the wealthy, advanced civilizations of China, India, the Middle East, and, yes, sub-Saharan West Africa. By your argument, Europe's history makes it just as "backward" and the Federation should be dominated by people from China, India, and the Mideast. Your ethnocentrism is indefensible and is a betrayal of everything Star Trek is supposed to be about.
 
We're talking about places that had no alphabet and no numerals, to say nothing of written language and math, until people from other civilizations (mostly Europeans) came along and gave it to them.

And that's okay. Everybody learned it from somewhere. But in 1966, when our guys were getting ready to land on the moon, I'm pretty sure these territories in Africa didn't have indoor plumbing or electricity except to the extent that Westerners brought it in.

They had slavery before the white man ever got there, and wars aplenty, but they just were not a group of cultures that achieved much advancement apart from what was imported from the outside.

So if, in the 23rd Century, the Swahili-speaking areas are highly advanced societies (and of course they will be, no question), they will have gotten there indirectly. And I'm just saying Uhura might as well be one of us, a direct participant in Western civilization, rather than coming from a place that's more a recipient of the West's intellectual exports.

I would appreciate you supporting your post with factual information, because as it stands the post quoted above is a textbook example of bigotry, ignorance, and outright racism.
Perhaps some research into the topics you blithely skim over might help you readjust the flawed and ignorant comments made above.
 
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