I predict it will be replaced once we start physical interstellar exploration of solar systems, then it will be more important to know which planet is third from the sun instead of which planet was discovered third two centuries ago.
Trek Planet Names
- Thread starter Warrick
- Start date
Except it's Archer IV, and that somehow one of two planets named for him. The name indicates a minimum of 4 planets and a star named for him.
I take that to mean two inhabited planets were named for him. It's inevitable that most humans would pay less attention to the planets we can't live on and thus might omit mentions of them in non-technical writing.
The actual (though not strictly canonical, as it contains errors) biography text says "He’s the only human to have two planets named in his honor: Archer’s Planet in the Gamma Trianguli sector, and Archer IV, which orbits 61 Ursae Majoris. Archer IV was the first M-Class world charted by the famous explorer" (i.e. the planet from "Strange New World").
I tend to agree*. I suspect that the names don't change in part to keep exoplanet references from being confusing in the scientific literature. In the 55 Cancri example, b was discovered first, then c and d together, then e later on, and finally f.I predict it will be replaced once we start physical interstellar exploration of solar systems, then it will be more important to know which planet is third from the sun instead of which planet was discovered third two centuries ago.
If the IAU reordered upon each new finding, then b, c and d would have changed to c, d, and e upon the discovery of the fourth exoplanet (which would become b) and what was d (and became e) would become f at the finding of the fifth one, which would be called e.
*(However, if numbers replaced letters, then such a non-sequential ordering would adequately explain the confusion of the Reliant's crew over the location of Ceti Alpha 6.
)It is important to realize that the Star Trek planetary naming system - proper name or catalog description of the star followed by a Roman numeral denoting the order of the planet's distance from the star - not actually the Star Trek planetary naming system.
Instead it is the science fictional planetary naming system.
For example there is the short story:
"With Redfern on Capella XII" by Charles Satterfield (Frederick Pohl), Galaxy Science Fiction, November,1955. http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?190183
The science fiction planetary naming system is used for many planets in the book versions of E.E. Smith's Lensman series published from 1948 to 1954, and possibly in the original versions published from 1938 to 1948.
Instead it is the science fictional planetary naming system.
For example there is the short story:
"With Redfern on Capella XII" by Charles Satterfield (Frederick Pohl), Galaxy Science Fiction, November,1955. http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?190183
The science fiction planetary naming system is used for many planets in the book versions of E.E. Smith's Lensman series published from 1948 to 1954, and possibly in the original versions published from 1938 to 1948.
And it's based on the real-life 19th-century astronomical practice of referring to the moons of planets like Jupiter with Roman numerals in order outward from the planet -- Io was "Jupiter I," Europa was "Jupiter II," etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naming_of_moons
Of course, it might be that the galaxy has fifty-eight planets named Archer, but only two named after Jonathan Archer. (And Archer II certainly need not be one of those.)
What to make of the "Primes" of Trek? The innermost rock in the given system? Or the most important rock in the system? Or, rather, the most important rock in the political system, as is likely to be the case with Cardassia Prime at least?
Timo Saloniemi
What to make of the "Primes" of Trek? The innermost rock in the given system? Or the most important rock in the system? Or, rather, the most important rock in the political system, as is likely to be the case with Cardassia Prime at least?
Timo Saloniemi
IAU just announced a global contest for another round of that a month or three ago, I think...?
From August:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/canada-star-planet-naming-contest-1.5247981
https://iau.org/news/pressreleases/detail/iau1908/
So that's what saved us...
The comment I was responding to was that "Klingons, etc, named our star when it was just a light in their skies," a phrasing that, to me, implied naked-eye visibility in antiquity. So I was saying that they probably wouldn't have discovered our star until they invented telescopes, and therefore it would be less likely to have a proper name in Klingonese as opposed to just a catalog number or the like.
Also, in the Trek reality, exoplanets would probably be even more common than in ours. Just a few decades ago, astronomers would have assumed that a star harboring a potentially Earth-like planet would become an instant celebrity and possibly even be renamed with a bit more dignity than a dull catalog number. Now we have to hold popular polls to satisfy the need for names...
That Klingon astronomers (or warriors accidentally pointing their telescopic sights to the sky) would spot planets around Sol would not necessarily result in any interest, then. Heh, humans might send an expedition to a star that for some mysterious reason did not have a Class M planet in orbit; Klingons would just ignore Sol and its life-compatible planets unless something specific and exceptional made them attractive as a conquest.
OTOH, Trek is well entitled to having habitable planets around stars that burn brightly. Terraforming is a thing, and some cultures create planets out of whole cloth. Bright stars would in turn be prime real estate, for their high output; it would not matter that they are too short-lived to develop planets let alone life, as those would both be imported. Klingons might well pay special attention to these stars, as they would be likely to shine on rich planets originally erected by advanced folks with expensive tastes.
Timo Saloniemi
That Klingon astronomers (or warriors accidentally pointing their telescopic sights to the sky) would spot planets around Sol would not necessarily result in any interest, then. Heh, humans might send an expedition to a star that for some mysterious reason did not have a Class M planet in orbit; Klingons would just ignore Sol and its life-compatible planets unless something specific and exceptional made them attractive as a conquest.
OTOH, Trek is well entitled to having habitable planets around stars that burn brightly. Terraforming is a thing, and some cultures create planets out of whole cloth. Bright stars would in turn be prime real estate, for their high output; it would not matter that they are too short-lived to develop planets let alone life, as those would both be imported. Klingons might well pay special attention to these stars, as they would be likely to shine on rich planets originally erected by advanced folks with expensive tastes.
Timo Saloniemi
How far away is Sol from Qo'nos?At NYCC so no time to complete visual magnitude.
Broken Bow (and more things than this title are broken in this episode), said 80 hours, and I assume this is at Warp 5. IF your use the slow canon speeds, then NX-Enterprise would travel a Warp 5 is 125 c. One year equals 8760 hours, so 80 hours is .09 of one year. At 125 c, Enterprise would travel 125 x 0.09 = 11.4 light years distance. WTF? 
That calculated, they also say in route: T'POL: Rigel is a planetary system approximately fifteen light years from our present position. Its a small neighborhood.
<edit. math error, 80/8760 = .009, so, the correct distance is only 1.14 light years or about 1/4 the distance to Alpha Centauri. Double WTF?
That calculated, they also say in route: T'POL: Rigel is a planetary system approximately fifteen light years from our present position. Its a small neighborhood.
<edit. math error, 80/8760 = .009, so, the correct distance is only 1.14 light years or about 1/4 the distance to Alpha Centauri. Double WTF?
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The heroes are quite hesistant to push their ship to full warp 5 even fairly late in the game ("Fallen Hero" is the first time they actually do it).
OTOH, their warp 4.5 is defined as "Neptune and back in 6 minutes", which is pretty darn slow.
OTTH, that's inside the Sol system, and we all know how warp gets slow close to stars.
OTFH, their warp 4.4 well beyond Jupiter is then defined as "thirty million km/s", which is both more definite than the Neptune thing, and again pretty darn slow, just 100 c.
OTFH (okay, here this breaks down, because five hands is just plain silly), "beyond Jupiter" may still be in the slow-as-molasses zone.
Timo Saloniemi
OTOH, their warp 4.5 is defined as "Neptune and back in 6 minutes", which is pretty darn slow.
OTTH, that's inside the Sol system, and we all know how warp gets slow close to stars.
OTFH, their warp 4.4 well beyond Jupiter is then defined as "thirty million km/s", which is both more definite than the Neptune thing, and again pretty darn slow, just 100 c.
OTFH (okay, here this breaks down, because five hands is just plain silly), "beyond Jupiter" may still be in the slow-as-molasses zone.
Timo Saloniemi
Break out the spatially varying Cochrane factor?
It's the only saving grace to yet another stupid retcon.
It would appear that someone did do the math using the classic warp though.
499 * 29 * 2 / 60 / (4.5 ^3) = 5 min 17.6 sec
(where 499 is time in seconds light travels 1 AU, 29 is the average number of AUs between Earth's Orbit and Neptune's, 2 because it's a round trip, and 4.5 is cubed via WF^3)
Allow half a minute or so for turnaround time and you have about six minutes.
100c actually works out to be 4.6, classic warp. Still, close enough to suggest a back-of-the-napkin calculation.
Yup, and that's more or less the point: whenever the Makers whip out the cubic formula (and thankfully this is the only actual case, although Riker in "Bloodlines" comes close), it befalls upon us to somehow explain this away. After all, while the heroes may be satisfied with visiting Neptune in three minutes, this doesn't allow them to visit Rigel, fifteen lightyears away from their position, in plot time in the very same adventure.
Timo Saloniemi
Timo Saloniemi
