Transporter Room

[Timo]

Assorted reasons for not beaming:

1) You want to bring your gear with you. Typically, it might be more than you can carry in a duffel bag.
2) You want to bring your shuttle with you. There's no telling whether you can beam down at the destination, after all.
3) You are part of a large group, meaning beaming is not faster than flying across the usual transporter range, since the "overhead" is the decisive bit of time management.
4) You don't want to clog the transporter. Since we so seldom see mass beamings, we have little idea of bandwidth problems, say. But we can easily see the corridors would quickly get clogged around the standard transporter set, whereas we have less evidence of such as regards shuttlebays or gangways.
5) You don't want to disrupt ship operations. Shuttles would do that if the ship were in motion, but not when she's stationary and can simply open her bay doors. Transporters might do that on every flight mode, considering their difficult relationship with shields and subspace.
6) You don't have the clearance. Those above your pay grade would be the ones aware of issues 1 through 5, and in the position to decide.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Timo]

Isn't the Enterprise crew only 430 people?

Since we never really get an official figure, speculation can certainly ensue. With just 430 people, we should never meet anybody on the corridors of this ginormous ship, yet our heroes do have to shove people out of the way when running to their next exciting action scene, in every adventure from the 2009 movie to ST:B. OTOH, when Kirk "rescues" his crew from Krall's camp in ST:B, it's logistically impossible for him to get more than about a hundred people out, so we might wish to argue that he only let 75% of his crew die, rather than 98%. But then again, the ship in ST:B might well be skeleton-crewed, as in contrast to the 2009 situation, Kirk now has trained veterans rather than raw recruits aboard, and knows in advance that he's sailing to danger (even if he again can't realize its full extent).

Timo Saloniemi

 

[F. King Daniel]

1,100 crew according to the old "experience the Enterprise" holographic promo site.

 

[fireproof78]

But then again, the ship in ST:B might well be skeleton-crewed

I believe that is stated, since Kirk wanted to give the crew leave.

 

[jackoverfull]

I believe that is stated, since Kirk wanted to give the crew leave.

a rewatched Beyond a few weeks ago and either it’s not stated or I missed it (which is of course very well possible).

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Adds some credence to Pegg's theory that the Kelvin-verse branched off long before the Kelvin event, going back maybe to the First Contact events. In Enterprise, the transporter was at first distrusted but by season 4 it was in pretty regular use. Conversely, in Beyond, the USS Franklin, which was refitted and still in use years after the Romulan War, still only had its transporter used for cargo. Scotty had to modify it to rescue the crew.

I always assumed that the ENT showrunners didn't actually want to use the transporter for anything but cargo, but it was forced on them by the bean counters higher up (as was the Temporal Cold War).

In any case, there's enough wiggle room regarding when the NX (Enterprise) and Freedom (Franklin) classes were in use, that any supposed inconsistencies can be ignored.

(in the interest of full disclosure, though, I admit I'm biased because I never once gave credence to Pegg's theory that the timelines branched off any earlier than 2233)

And even so, the two ships could simply have different mission profiles. One could have transporters suitable for human use, other for only cargo, and yet still be serving at roughly the same time.

 

[Timo]

a rewatched Beyond a few weeks ago and either it’s not stated or I missed it (which is of course very well possible).

It's not stated in dialogue, and we never hear of anybody who would have been left behind - but it's still quite possible that Kirk left a large number of personnel behind for some reason or another.

Then again, when we jump to the scene where the heroes are already braving the rubble field, and Kirk delivers the speech where we expect him to praise the new navigation systems and he instead praises the crew... Well, the point there would be the presence of the crew. And Kirk never quite seemed to agree that there would be high risk in the mission.

In practice, it's quite possible that Kirk lost a large percentage of his crew, and the hundred or so extras seen marched around by Krall were the only ones alive. We did see everything we need for assuming horrid casualties, after all. So the inability to beam more than 20 people at a time, or more than half a dozen times in the time allotted, isn't necessarily a mismatch with the remaining crew count, regardless of whether Kirk originally had 1,100 people, or 500, or perhaps 3,600. Certainly a big ship would seem to warrant a big crew...

And even so, the two ships could simply have different mission profiles. One could have transporters suitable for human use, other for only cargo, and yet still be serving at roughly the same time.

Or then both were built with cargo-only transporters, prior to "Broken Bow", and then Starfleet sent a memo stating that the transporters now were officially man-rated. Scotty would have every reason to worry about a system its builders didn't man-rate, just like Archer's folks did - but in neither case would the actual hardware require any modifications (which Scotty would be hard pressed to achieve anyway, lacking the most basic of spares or the time to go hunting for them with Jaylah).

Timo Saloniemi

 

[fireproof78]

the interest of full disclosure, though, I admit I'm biased because I never once gave credence to Pegg's theory that the timelines branched off any earlier than 2233)

Same here.

 

[Mudd]

where is the fun in that?

Trekkie hairsplitting is not "fun."

 

[jackoverfull]

Trekkie hairsplitting is not "fun."

speak for yourself!

 

[fireproof78]

Hairsplitting is not fun.

But it is highly common.

 

[drt]

Some thoughts:

ST09: looks like both shuttles and transporters were used. Spock apparently beamed up, since he was there when the cadets were leaving and then on Enterprise when they arrived, with enough time to change. Considering there seemed to be a lot of empty spots to park all of those shuttles, I think the assumption can be made that Starfleet thought they might be needed for the mission, so easy enough to kill two birds with one stone and ferry cadets up in them, while using the transporters for senior officers and other more essential personnel.

STB: the dialog gives both the impression that most of the crew survived the attack and everyone was rescued from Krall's camp. The issue arises that the visuals don't exactly match having a huge crew present (we see maybe a hundred crewmembers being marched into the camp, there isn't time to rescue more than that number from the camp, nor will hundreds of people really fit in the Franklin). I think the simplest explanation is they just took the crew necessary for what was anticipated to be a relatively easy rescue mission, while leaving the majority behind to continue shore leave.

 

[Timo]

OTOH, it's easy in ST:B to believe in massive casualties. The movie does go out of its way to show lots of people dying, after all!

The Ancient Drones slaughter many with their guns; the penetrator craft must kill a lot of people when ripping the starship to pieces, too. And then there are all those shuttles trying to evacuate, supposedly loaded to capacity since Kirk's crew is a disciplined lot and wouldn't panic and launch empty shuttles; every one of the shuttles is lost, it seems.

Basically the Drones capture alive just those people that fled in the escape pods, plus just possibly a few survivors from the saucer section once it soft-lands. But the latter doesn't appear all that likely, since Krall needs the extra incentive from his informant to even bother and send his goons to search the saucer for the Abornath fragment.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[diankra]

Isn't the Enterprise crew only 430 people? Wouldn't there already be a trained crew to work along side the cadets? Say 230 crew, 200 cadets. Say 3 transporter rooms, 6 people per beam. 6x11x3=198

With three transporter rooms, expecting 200 cadets, each transporter room would be performing 11 to 12 beam ups. Say 5 minutes per beam up. 5×12=60 You can beam up 200 people in one hour.

I'd rather beam up than go to the hassle of the shuttle.

In the 09 film they are scrambling new ships and crewing them with cadets to deal with an emergency.