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TOS-Remastered: a waste of time

Well, perhaps if I can get my grubby hands on a TOS Blu-Ray disc, I can hijack an HD set at Sam's Club and see how the original effects shots look in HD.

Or, perhaps someone can chime in here..?
Pretty crappy, actually. And I'm a pretty big Star Trek purist.

Actually, it sort of depends on the shot. There are some scenes I find that look okay, but most of the Ent stock shots are overly grainy and make for a jarring viewing experience when seen side by side against the crystal clear principle photography. There is one original FX shot off the top of my head that I think looks much better than the new FX shot (from "Galileo Seven," when the shuttle launches; the old effect, sans wobbly starfield, looks much better to me than the new shot, which could be a scene from a Star Trek video game). Most of the matte shots hold up pretty well.
 
A TOS Miranda is in the (unfortunately utterly terrible) fan film "Blood and Fire". The story and acting are, sadly, horrific but the CG is great:
stp2_bafr_copernicus.jpg


(pic borrowed from Trekmovie.com)

And yet people at the discussion forums for Phase II want to bash the new movie to bits (don't get me wrong, I like the show and want to see what they come up with next, but...)
 
^ I also concur with the above..on HDTV s most of the old effects just scream out to be noticed..grain..artifacts on the composite show up...it's too jarring compared with the new effects at high resolution settings..

But as I have often pointed out..

A true purist "Who wants to see it in it's original resolution" needs to use an old electron tube TV and an old VCR to get the true Olde Tyme Star Trek viewing experience.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWqgQ4-uyN4&feature=related
 
And, for that matter, the new FX were not the point of remastering the series. The series was remastered to preserve the film.


I thought I just addressed this in another thread, but the film didn't need preserving. Properly stored, film is THE medium for long-term preservation. Digital storage needs to be shunted round to avoid signal decay, and actually costs more given the amount of hands-on to keep that decay from occurring. The outlay for proper storage on film is initially high, but is now practically a fire-and-forget, because unless you have a major trauma, the film is going to remain viable and not decay. (They no longer store stocks that turn from blue to pink in good conditions, like was the case in the JAWS era.)

Not disagreeing with what you say (mostly because you seem more on top of the technical stuff regarding film than I am), but sometimes the films do need to be re-transferred to keep them on good, current stock, but they also need refreshing from time to time to make new syndication master tapes. Not even considering overuse of physical tape copies, there's also leaps in transfer technology, and like it or not there are many people that will change the channel if a show is in black and white, or even if in color, is faded and overly grainy. That was likely a major reason for this project, and they happened to include the new FX as a way to help sell them into syndication. Let's face it, many of the FX were groundbreaking for their time, and were the product of hours and hours of blood, sweat and tears, but many of them were also victims of insufficient time and resources, and they can hurt the overall feel of the story. The quality of the writing can help people look past the day glo bridge sets and primary color uniform shirts, but when they cut to an exterior shot to show the enemy spaceship, and it looks like a kitbashed ERTL model, it just takes too many people out of the story.

Transferring to a 'current' stock would be unwise, since the stocks now have far greater latitude and would really mess up the look of TOS. The 'more advanced' stocks of the 1970s are the ones that decayed so fast that the water in JAWS turned pink before corrections were undertaken.

New tech, as usual, is not always better tech, but it is most often faster/easier tech.

The quality of the writing and performances and cutting and such is the main factor, I agree; but to me, the low-end production values of the live-action TOS shoots are a lot more disagreeable to the eye than most of the VFX shots (about half of which are totally watchable for me) ... on the other hand, the often cartoonish -R vfx have kept me from watching a full new ep in this incarnation, because it is like watching a movie rough cut with animatics in place of finals.
 
The quality of the writing and performances and cutting and such is the main factor, I agree; but to me, the low-end production values of the live-action TOS shoots are a lot more disagreeable to the eye than most of the VFX shots (about half of which are totally watchable for me) ... on the other hand, the often cartoonish -R vfx have kept me from watching a full new ep in this incarnation, because it is like watching a movie rough cut with animatics in place of finals.

I agree w/ what you've written about the VFX shots. However (and I seem to be in the minority based upon others' posting) I still don't see many glaring issues w/ the live-action shots.

The other day, I saw the first really obvious flaw. In Mirror, Mirror, when Scott and McCoy climb the ladder to the little upper-level engineering room, I could see the seam where two wall pieces were put together.

Otherwise (and I am looking for them), I don't see any issues.

Doug
 
^ I also concur with the above..on HDTV s most of the old effects just scream out to be noticed..grain..artifacts on the composite show up...it's too jarring compared with the new effects at high resolution settings..

But as I have often pointed out..

A true purist "Who wants to see it in it's original resolution" needs to use an old electron tube TV and an old VCR to get the true Olde Tyme Star Trek viewing experience.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWqgQ4-uyN4&feature=related

Note at least one of the links to the side are for clips with color tv's from the late 50's to early 60's. Those are the sets that Star Trek was made for, as well as the large number of black and white sets still in use. After all, not everyone had a brand new RCA Victor or Zenith (although Star Trek sold a lot of 'em); a lot of folks continued to get by with the old Dumont.
 
I've seen both versions, but I still like the original offering, visible "motion boxes" and non-digital displays and all :D
 
I'd like it if they could do a remastering that would keep the original effects, but clean up the stuff you shouldn't see, like the garbage mattes. Never saw 'em back in the day, so it was rather alarming when they suddenly became visible in later years.

And WHERE IS THAT AVATAR FROM!?!
 
I have season 1-2 on BR and i love the new effects, why, well because Star trek has in no way changed with these remastered version, the most important part of Star trek has always been the stories and the charactors and that has not changed in any way with the remastered version, all the stuff that i love about the original series remains intact, all they have done in update a part of Trek for me that was never i that important, they effects were there to help the story along but for me original Trek has always been about the stories and the characters.

And having TOS in HD has been like watching the show for the first time all over again, but i suppose anyhting that can draw me more into TOS is always a bonus.
 
Yeah but all the things I love about the original series includes the original effects and that big, beautiful, hand-crafted starship model.
 
The quality of the writing and performances and cutting and such is the main factor, I agree; but to me, the low-end production values of the live-action TOS shoots are a lot more disagreeable to the eye than most of the VFX shots (about half of which are totally watchable for me) ... on the other hand, the often cartoonish -R vfx have kept me from watching a full new ep in this incarnation, because it is like watching a movie rough cut with animatics in place of finals.

I agree w/ what you've written about the VFX shots. However (and I seem to be in the minority based upon others' posting) I still don't see many glaring issues w/ the live-action shots.

The other day, I saw the first really obvious flaw. In Mirror, Mirror, when Scott and McCoy climb the ladder to the little upper-level engineering room, I could see the seam where two wall pieces were put together.

Otherwise (and I am looking for them), I don't see any issues.

Doug

Pretty much every planet ground set on stage fails for me, (though most are better than early TNG like HIDE & Q) ... set materials and styling are not really period (60s-designed stuff looked cooler, which is why the chairs are the only real period thing in TOS), they reflect what was used -- wood.

I don't find any of these wholly objectionable, but I find all of them a lot higher up on the 'if you had to tamper with the original, touch me FIRST' than the visual effects, which are usually brief cuts that go right by (and I only find about a third or a quarter of them to be really flawed, some of the ship shots in TOS are really solid), and in their original form, don't have the low dynamic range flaws of the -r CG, which is what registers (to me) as cartoonish.
 
This thread is a waste of time, not the remaster Fx in the eps....tit for tat, people. Paramount is not worried about the uber anal retentive types that HATE everything
 
Yeah but all the things I love about the original series includes the original effects and that big, beautiful, hand-crafted starship model.

But that's not changed, the originals versions have been released on Video, DVD and now HD, so its not like the remastered version are replacing the originals, they are still there for anybody who wants them, i have them on the original CIC video release and the DVD release, but i found the HD remastered versions really added to my enjoyment of TOS immensely not only for the few remastered effects in each episode but seeing TOS in HD is just awesome.
 
Note at least one of the links to the side are for clips with color tv's from the late 50's to early 60's. Those are the sets that Star Trek was made for, as well as the large number of black and white sets still in use. After all, not everyone had a brand new RCA Victor or Zenith (although Star Trek sold a lot of 'em); a lot of folks continued to get by with the old Dumont.
exactly..though the "In Living Color" ads reached a fever pitch during the 60s when Color TV became much more affordable..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2S60N2W5xzk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlxkzgGdqcM&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-82zMVnL-co&feature=related
 
I own and have watched all of TOS- R. My verdict? Thumbs up. The new effects are just icing on the cake. The stories remain intact. I liked things such as the Romulan Bird of Prey in 'The Enterprise Incident' and the D-7 fleet in Errand of Mercy.

It just adds a bit of flavour, thats all. And you can always watch the original versions on Blu Ray if you don't like the new effects.
 
I,ve got season 1 and season 2 on blu ray and like the new cgi and added special effects. The story telling has not chaged and Wow the enterprise looks stunning and the planets look so real !!!

If you are still not happy with it check out the doomday machine episode its great .:bolian::drool::techman::techman:
 
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