number6
Vice Admiral
Of course it does. Builds off Space Seed, which was an original Star Trek episode iirc...
TOS Purists of TrekBBS - Unite!
- Thread starter TOS Purist
- Start date
By those definitions, congratulations! You're a TOS purist.
I WOULD accept the other Treks as canon, except for the fact that starting from TWOK, they disregard TOS's canon and attempt to retcon a lot of things. And since TNG and the rest build off from stuff like TWOK and the rest, they are non-canon by association (by continuating and building off from the non-canon material).
you are aware tos had issues with its continuity?
those causing itself canon headaches.
Oy gevalt. 
For the record, the only onscreen Trek I reject completely is JJ's movie. TAS is TOS's fourth season, ST V I explain away as a drunken ghost story Kirk and McCoy are telling around the campfire (another ritual of "camping out" Spock was curious about), and since the bulk of ENT's continuity gaffes take place in the first three seasons, I figure they were all resolved once Archer hit the reset button on the Temporal Cold War and the timeline realigned itself, so they're not worth getting upset about at this stage in the game.
So, where do I rate on the purity scale?
For the record, the only onscreen Trek I reject completely is JJ's movie. TAS is TOS's fourth season, ST V I explain away as a drunken ghost story Kirk and McCoy are telling around the campfire (another ritual of "camping out" Spock was curious about), and since the bulk of ENT's continuity gaffes take place in the first three seasons, I figure they were all resolved once Archer hit the reset button on the Temporal Cold War and the timeline realigned itself, so they're not worth getting upset about at this stage in the game.
So, where do I rate on the purity scale?
I am a die-hard TOS fan (the only "true" Trek IMHO), but I have been known to watch an occasional episode of TNG and ENT.
QFT (I LOVE TOS and always will, but this type of fandom classification is just over the top)
Are you talking about "James R. Kirk" on the tombstone instead of "James T. Kirk?" That's a minor production gaffe, not a continuity error. It's nothing like having viewscreens on ships in an era where ship-to-ship visual communications wasn't supposed to be possible...
Really? I wasn't aware that TNG took place in a seperate continuity than the TOS movies...everyone tends to count it as the same canon. But that's very interesting...
Sure it borrows elements from a TOS episode, but TWOK is about as far from Star Trek (and TOS) as you can get...besides DS9, that is...
I'm going to be disobedient and post here too because as someone said, I think it would be an awfully short thread otherwise. I'm probably a purist in the sense that it's only TOS that makes me an obsessed fan. I fell in love at first sight with Spock and then by the end of the very first episode, with the other cast members and the ship. There's never been anything else remotely like it in my life as I was never one to have teen idols on my walls, and for that matter, never had any Trek memorabilia either, just an ongoing love for the show. And no, I never did think the follow-up movies or series came anywhere near capturing the same atmosphere.
However, I was a science fiction fan before Star Trek and have always tried to like the newer efforts, including the 2010 movie. I've met with varying degrees of success in the effort but nothing remotely like my fascination with the original. I would sometimes find myself dozing off before the ending of a first run episode of TNG et. al., but could still sit riveted at my 25th viewing of some TOS episode.
Although I didn't find the TOS movies nearly as compellling as the original series, I would have continued to watch them as long as they kept making them. If they were to do a series remake starring the original crew in 2010, with them just sitting around in wheelchairs schmoozing in some intragalactic retirement home, I'm pretty certain I would be riveted to that as well and find that to be "appointment" t.v. I can offer no rational excuse for my feelings about the show.
However, I was a science fiction fan before Star Trek and have always tried to like the newer efforts, including the 2010 movie. I've met with varying degrees of success in the effort but nothing remotely like my fascination with the original. I would sometimes find myself dozing off before the ending of a first run episode of TNG et. al., but could still sit riveted at my 25th viewing of some TOS episode.
Although I didn't find the TOS movies nearly as compellling as the original series, I would have continued to watch them as long as they kept making them. If they were to do a series remake starring the original crew in 2010, with them just sitting around in wheelchairs schmoozing in some intragalactic retirement home, I'm pretty certain I would be riveted to that as well and find that to be "appointment" t.v. I can offer no rational excuse for my feelings about the show.
Although I agree with you on this point, several ENT fans have demonstrated that Spock never actually stated that ship-to-ship visual communications weren't possible, only that there was no visual communication between Earth ships and Romulan ships.
I don't think he meant that literally; what I suspect he meant is that visually, the first season of TNG looks far more like TOS than it does the movies, even though TNG linearly takes place after the films (i.e. the return of red/yellow/blue uniforms; the return of red bussard collectors on nacelles, the Enterprise panning across a planet like in TOS, etc.).
That's funny, because while I agree that the TOS movies do look very different visually from the TOS they were based on, JJ Abrams's Star Trek '09 looks the most like TOS of any Trek film...that's Star Trek '09, the film that "TOS purists" want to vilify.
(Sorry, not trying to start an argument...I just find this amusing
)
I'm not a purist. I love TOS most, but like the other shows, especially DS9. I try not to get bent out-of-shape about inconsistencies, 'cause it was only a show made to sell crap to us.
It's amazing that Star Trek, in any form, has lasted as long as I did. If you had told me back in the early 1970s that I'd be 50 and new Trek of some fashion would *still* be coming out, I'd have thought you were nuts.
Sometimes I think that nitpicking the shows sucks some of the fun right out of them. It's hard to remember that when online sometimes.
It's amazing that Star Trek, in any form, has lasted as long as I did. If you had told me back in the early 1970s that I'd be 50 and new Trek of some fashion would *still* be coming out, I'd have thought you were nuts.
Sometimes I think that nitpicking the shows sucks some of the fun right out of them. It's hard to remember that when online sometimes.
The error is would be "James T. Kirk" since "R" was in the pilot. Was the "T" part of Kirk's background prior to "WNMHGB"? I think Gene said they forgot "R" had been used when they gave him "T" as a middle initial. And its hardly the only error. Things changed pretty fast in the first season. A lot of stuff was abandoned, changed or ignored.
How did Styles' ancestor see the bird of prey painted on the Romulan ship if not on a viewscreen? Did he look out a window? No Ship to ship visual communication doesnt automatically equal no viewscreens.
Of course its the same canon, it was made by Paramount. And we're talking about Gene's vision for TNG not "continuity". He set TNG hundred years after TOS for a reason. What makes you think he cared or was overly concerned with what Bennett and his crew was doing in the film franchise? ( especially after he was given the boot following TMP. He still cashed the checks , though.
Thats what continuity is, referring to elements from a previous instalment in a current one.
Being a movie and not a TV series episode, TWOK would have to be different that TOS, so was TMP. Though I do find the battle between the Reliant and the Enterprise to be reminiscent of the battle with the Romulan ship in "Balance of Terror." Bad guy has super weapon that threatens the Enterprisre. People on both sides die. Kirk stops him. I think TOS has done that.
Well, there's a worse canon twist in TOS; supported by multiple instances - not just one episode like Balance of Terror.
What about Where No Man Has Gone Before? The S.S. Valiant at the edge of the Galaxy 200 years before the 1701 gets there. (ie we had high-speed Warp Drive that allowed us to send a ship to the Galaxy's edge in the mid 2000's?) Kida blows the TOS takes place in the 23rd century idea.
Then Squire of Gothos - where the 1701 crew is on a planet 900 light years from Earth; with an alien talking about Napoleon (ie early 1800's); and Spock commenting "It's like he's looking at Earth through a telescope, but failing to account for the time differental. End result: TOS takes place circa the 28th century!
Then Tomorrow Is Yesterday where Kirk is arrested by a 20th century Air Force Major who states in the late 1960ies: "Mister! I'm gonna lock you away for 200 years!"
Kirk's reply: "That oughta be just about right."
Places TOS in the 2166 - 2169 (based on the exchange: Kirk: "That was in the late 1960ies"
Spock: Apparently Captain, so are we.")
Then, Space Seed where Khan is dated leaving Earth in 1996. When revived, he asks, "How long?"
Kirk "Two centuries, we estimate"
So now, TOS is at the end of the 22nd century/23rd century....
Yet (since earlier you conceeded ST:TMP FOLLOWS TOS cannon - and ST:TMP begins with "In the 23rd Century"); in 3 out of 4 STATED cases TOS doesn't really occur in the 23rd century AT ALL! (2196 is 4 years away, but ST:TMP is 10 years later.)
He never specified it was only between Earth ships and Romulan ships, either. ENT fans have created that excuse out of thin air...and it's ridiculous to think that although both Earth people and Romulans have visual ship-to-ship communications technology, that it wouldn't have been possible.
No, Spock was not specific, he was speaking very generally...about an entire time period.
Regarding Noname's post about what time period TOS took place in...that doesn't count as a continuity error. Hell, even in everyone's beloved TWOK, Khan says "two hundred years ago, I was a prince," when it he should have said THREE hundred.
Damn, this is why I hardly post here anymore...believe it or not, I don't like arguing or quabbling over this stuff with other people. All I did was start a nice, friendly general thread to help me find all my fellow TOS purist fans on the forum and other people just barge in and start arguing about stuff, even spewing out personal attacks.
WTF.
Well, a lot of forums are heavily moderated, and people have to be cordial - well, to the least extent, mature and behaving like proper adults.
Looks like I'm going back into Lurker mode...could someone close this thread? I guess I'll never know how many other people like me there are on this forum.
Looks like I'm going back into Lurker mode...could someone close this thread? I guess I'll never know how many other people like me there are on this forum.
Is this why you're in such a bad mood in that other thread?Well, a lot of forums are heavily moderated, and people have to be cordial - well, to the least extent, mature and behaving like proper adults.
Looks like I'm going back into Lurker mode...could someone close this thread? I guess I'll never know how many other people like me there are on this forum.
C'mon, you know anytime you start a thread saying TOS (or TNG or VOY or DS9 or etc.) is the only true Trek that you're gonna attract a little flack.
At least most of your detractors are offering reasoned arguments for discussion. Isn't that what a forum is for? I think I only saw one post, early on, that was an out-and-out rude and crude dismissal.
To paraphrase what TOS characters said on this very subject in their own movie:
Uhura: Would you look at that!
Kirk: My friends, the great experiment: Star Trek XI. Ready for trial runs.
Sulu: She's supposed to have a lot of lens flare..... and have a brewery for an engine room.....
Scotty: Aye, and if my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon!
Kirk: Come, come, Mr. Scott. Young minds, fresh ideas. Be tolerant!......
Uhura: Would you look at that!
Kirk: My friends, the great experiment: Star Trek XI. Ready for trial runs.
Sulu: She's supposed to have a lot of lens flare..... and have a brewery for an engine room.....
Scotty: Aye, and if my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon!
Kirk: Come, come, Mr. Scott. Young minds, fresh ideas. Be tolerant!......
That's NOT what I started the thread for, though...I thought I made it clear in my first post. It was just a place where I could gather all the other purists like me in one place, that's all...lol.
People read stuff into things too much, sometimes! And dammit, I said I was going back into lurker mode..."every time I try to get out, it just drags me back in again!"
Your really cant lay down "ground rules" for threads. They go where they go like a river. Sometimes a moderator will try to get them back on topic. That depends on the mod though.
That's NOT what I started the thread for, though...I thought I made it clear in my first post. It was just a place where I could gather all the other purists like me in one place, that's all...lol.
People read stuff into things too much, sometimes! And dammit, I said I was going back into lurker mode..."every time I try to get out, it just drags me back in again!"
And like the Skipper said, starting a X only thread is going to attract attention. No rule that I'm aware to keep the "wrong sorts" out.
We Trekkies are a bit like an Andorian-Tellerite hybrid,passionate and argumentative.
