TOS Enterprise Internals

[trynda1701]

Incidentally, here's a good screencap of that graphic:
https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net...ision/latest?cb=20190723091302&path-prefix=en

Interesting two points I noticed about that graphic.

1. Lists the ship as having eight phasers, which is different than the six mentioned in the Tech Manual and thus later game sources, which were probably based on the Tech Manual. But many fans know that the ship had aft phasers per background dialog, so that's sort of a combination of that and the Tech Manual data.

2. Look at the warp speeds. Warp 8 is listed as 512c, which matches the speed listed in "The Making of Star Trek" book (the classic 'c = warp factor cubed' formula), but Warp 6 is listed as either 384 or 394c! Odd that all the other data is correct, but that isnt.

 

[yotsuya]

One thing I have been waiting on to complete this is a viewing of the Remastered TOS. Remastered because I have never seen it before and what I am looking for is unchanged. I have realized as I watch it that so few of the episodes are not enjoyable to watch. Even Spock's Brain. I found The Cloud Minders to be particularly pertinent for 2020. I am just a couple episodes away and I have a list of sets to refine or draw. There really aren't any new sets in Season 3 other than the Herbarium/Rec Room, but there are a lot of variations and added details. I found three episodes where you can see the entire back wall of the Transporter room. Most of the rooms are pretty generic so there is not much too them. The Brig changes with every use. So I had a lot more to pull from Season 1 and so little to add from this. About the only two rooms that I really need to address are the environmental control room from Wink of an Eye which was basically unchanged for The Mark of Gideon other than adding a curved outer wall with the port. The other is a VIP room that served the Medusan Amassador and the setting for the dinner with Beal. The others I had addressed already. So not a lot of changes or additions. Just a lot to add to my cross section.

 

[yotsuya]

Interesting two points I noticed about that graphic.

1. Lists the ship as having eight phasers, which is different than the six mentioned in the Tech Manual and thus later game sources, which were probably based on the Tech Manual. But many fans know that the ship had aft phasers per background dialog, so that's sort of a combination of that and the Tech Manual data.

2. Look at the warp speeds. Warp 8 is listed as 512c, which matches the speed listed in "The Making of Star Trek" book (the classic 'c = warp factor cubed' formula), but Warp 6 is listed as either 384 or 394c! Odd that all the other data is correct, but that isnt.

Also, early in season 3 the ship was traveling at warp 9 to 9.5 in several episodes. Not under alien control. So it seems likely Scotty had tweaked the engines using things he learned from those alien incidents with extreme speeds. So it seems the warp 8 got modified.

 

[Henoch]

Also, early in season 3 the ship was traveling at warp 9 to 9.5 in several episodes. Not under alien control. So it seems likely Scotty had tweaked the engines using things he learned from those alien incidents with extreme speeds. So it seems the warp 8 got modified.

I agree. I head canon the key improvement to ship speed occurs due to the Kelvan mods. I also feel that the warp 10 in LTBYLBF was accomplished by the ship itself, and not due to any "extra" magic by Bele. Enterprise "natural" max speeds:

• Season One max speed = warp 8
• Season Two max speed = warp 8
• Kelvan Modifications end of Season Two.
• Season Three max speed = warp 10

 

[Mytran]

not due to any "extra" magic by Bele.

I'd be more than happy with that. Those two are way overpowered as it is

 

[publiusr]

A little off topic. I always thought his ship was invisible in more than one way, not just a mirror matter Kazon torpedo with a distinct shape, but a shapeless, almost area effect design made to dissolve once the occupant was displaced past the first bulkhead-a lot like the tiny sphere used in the Russian Solaris movie.

Bele might have helped guide that...conveyance that was closest to the warp nine coffin used by Worf’s ex.

 

[yotsuya]

I'm being pushed back into this by the Excelsior project that started it all. It is time to upgrade those to the same quality and detail level as I have done on the TOS and Phase II Enterprise designs. If I can regularly schedule a time to delve into this, I should have the cross section done in no time and then make the page frames, scales, and descriptive text to call it finished.

 

[MiKaTrek]

[...]

2. Look at the warp speeds. Warp 8 is listed as 512c, which matches the speed listed in "The Making of Star Trek" book (the classic 'c = warp factor cubed' formula), but Warp 6 is listed as either 384 or 394c! Odd that all the other data is correct, but that isnt.

So, maybe someone got the warp 8 = 512 c number and thought that warp speed has a linear growth. When I divide 512 c by 8 and multiply it by warp 6 I will get the 384 c.

 

[trynda1701]

So, maybe someone got the warp 8 = 512 c number and thought that warp speed has a linear growth. When I divide 512 c by 8 and multiply it by warp 6 I will get the 384 c.

Well spotted!

 

[publiusr]

Looking forward to your Excelsior work.

 

[Boris Skrbic]

Well spotted!

There is a nice touch in S2:E13 around time index -39:52: Number One hits a button labeled ENGAGE and Warp 6.25 is replaced by 244c.

 

[trynda1701]

There is a nice touch in S2:E13 around time index -39:52: Number One hits a button labeled ENGAGE and Warp 6.25 is replaced by 244c.

Nice touch indeed, and also well spotted!

 

[Mytran]

There is a nice touch in S2:E13 around time index -39:52: Number One hits a button labeled ENGAGE and Warp 6.25 is replaced by 244c.

Nice detail! At least the CGI artist who designed that heard of the classic WF^3 rule

 

[yotsuya]

As I get ready to star filling in the cross section, what rooms do you think should be obvious? for most of the ship I just have a general idea. Obviously several of the decks have crew quarters and I have good drawings of the sets for the crew quarters and the briefing room. I think between those the rooms would all follow that pattern in the saucer and flat walls in the secondary hull.

But such things as Aux Control. Should there be one or two? I think only one because I think the ship was designed for the saucer to be a lifeboat, but not the secondary hull and nacelle assembly. And if the need arose, a good engineer could rig something.

 

[Mytran]

As I get ready to star filling in the cross section, what rooms do you think should be obvious? for most of the ship I just have a general idea. Obviously several of the decks have crew quarters and I have good drawings of the sets for the crew quarters and the briefing room. I think between those the rooms would all follow that pattern in the saucer and flat walls in the secondary hull.

The secondary hull is an odd duck - on the one hand, you would expect it would be filled with engineering and cargo, yet it seems to have more windows than anywhere else on the vessel! Perhaps the primary hull is mainly science and crew quarters, but expansive recreation facilities are located on the perimeter of the secondary hull?

But such things as Aux Control. Should there be one or two? I think only one because I think the ship was designed for the saucer to be a lifeboat, but not the secondary hull and nacelle assembly. And if the need arose, a good engineer could rig something.

I would think that contingencies would be in place should the secondary hull have to operate as an independent vessel.
The episode Is There In Truth No Beauty show that the vessel's propulsion system could be controlled from the engine room, but what about sensors, communication and navigation?

 

[yotsuya]

So, what I'm struggling with at the moment is reconciling all these:

The premise I am going by is the the Phase II and TMP designs are the same ship so at the core not too many things can change. So the same basic deck layout. The TMP is the most canon one because we have a lot of internal to external links that we had never seen before. In TWOK we also get the photon torpedo launcher, but that is not pictured. The top one is just a fancy MSD rendering of Jefferies original. Jefferies had a different deck layout that did not agree with the deck descriptions in TMOST. So I'm going by the deck descriptions and the TMP cutaway because they are two sources that agree. But there are some flaws. The seondary hull is pretty easy. The decks that correspond to the TOS windwos fit nicely in the forward end around the shaft. The after part of the TMP refit has been gutted (that is where the warp core and main engineering used to be - note in The Day of the Dove, the creature left out of the secondary hull in a location that in the TMP refit is the cargo bay).

So the decks need to be close to the TMP decks. That was easy to do. But what to fill them with. I followed the TMP cutaway and found that it fit the TOS ship very nicely with the refit getting 1 extra ring of cabins on deck 6. I had to adjust deck 8 to align with the docking ports... so since that was the rec deck per TMOST, the higher deck in the forward part makes sense. Machinery on the deck below.

So far I have this:

 

[StarCruiser]

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[publiusr]

The top one is just a fancy MSD rendering of Jefferies original.

So far I have this:

Yours does square with the Kerr/11ft perfectly.

I like the top one as a larger ship than Enterprise. The more elegant secondary hull..the dual bevel on the saucer. One could have each layout be a separate Connie.

The Swans of Many Rivers...

 

[Spaceship Jo]

Pardon me if you've already answered this: why are you "struggling at the moment to reconcile all these"? By which I mean, these sources are not all of equal value (in terms of accuracy, but also in terms of creator intent, etc), so how are you deciding what you need to reconcile from each? I got the impression (possibly wrongly) that you were prioritizing BTS and or creator data ahead of any fan data, so why introduce more variables to try to match up?

 

[yotsuya]

Pardon me if you've already answered this: why are you "struggling at the moment to reconcile all these"? By which I mean, these sources are not all of equal value (in terms of accuracy, but also in terms of creator intent, etc), so how are you deciding what you need to reconcile from each? I got the impression (possibly wrongly) that you were prioritizing BTS and or creator data ahead of any fan data, so why introduce more variables to try to match up?

Because so much of the interior of the ship is unknown. The Making of Star Trek gives us somewhat of a breakdown of what is on each of the saucer decks and the general idea of what is in the secondary hull, but what goes where? We have the sets, but where do they go? And there are so many different ideas of where to put these things. While I am not using Jefferies deck placement (as it does not align with the TMOST descriptions or the TMP cutaway) I am taking his design ideas to heart. IT seems clear from the spaces he left and where he put the Phase II engine room that main engineering should be in the secondary hull and he lowered the bridge to keep it fitting the dome. There are just so many ideas and such different levels of detail that it is confusing to figure out which way I want to go.