Top 5 Over-rated Episodes

[Admiral Shran]

If the episode had only been about Picard refusing to take advantage of the Mintakans, I wouldn't have a problem with it. But that's not what the episode confines itself to. It flat out says that all religious/spiritual beliefs are superstitious, primitive nonsense.

I don't have a problem with Picard being a better man than the real life historical people who took advantage of native beliefs. In fact, I applaud him for that. But when you claim that all religion is worthless just because you don't believe it (which is what Picard did) then I have a problem.

 

[Supernuke]

For me, its:

1. Descent 1 + 2- terrible episodes in my opinion. The Borg changing again was annoying, and I hated evil Data.
2. Peak Performance- I don't know if this counts as overrated or not, but I hated this one.
3. Tapestry is another for me. It's okay, just not great.
4. Sins of the Father- another okay episode for the Klingon arc that Worf has, but not an amazing episode.
5. Parallels- it was an interesting concept, but it would have been better with someone other than Worf as the main character.

 

[Sybok]

4.) Who Watches the Watchers - So unsubtle in it's anti-religion message that it sickens me. If you're an atheist, hey more power to you. If you want to promote atheism, go right ahead and knock yourself out. But don't go and claim that all religion is backward superstition, that religious people are ignorant and that no good can come from it. If a believer tried to pull the exact same argument (that non-believers are stupid, that they don't deserve to be treated with equal respect and that atheism always produces immorality) I would be equally sickened; so why should I not be here?

completely agree

 

[Fang66]

If the episode had only been about Picard refusing to take advantage of the Mintakans, I wouldn't have a problem with it. But that's not what the episode confines itself to. It flat out says that all religious/spiritual beliefs are superstitious, primitive nonsense.

I don't have a problem with Picard being a better man than the real life historical people who took advantage of native beliefs. In fact, I applaud him for that. But when you claim that all religion is worthless just because you don't believe it (which is what Picard did) then I have a problem.

I just rewatched the episode and Picard makes no such claim for all religion being worthless. There is only one scene that could be construed as anti-religious rather than just portraying characters from a future that has left superstitious beliefs behind them in the dim past (as any sane person would hope we will). That scene is where Dr Barron recommends giving the Mintakens guide lines for what will inevitably become a religion and Picard says "Horrifying... Dr. Barron, your report describes how rational these people are. Millennia ago, they abandoned their belief in the supernatural. Now you are asking me to sabotage that achievement, to send them back into the dark ages of superstition and ignorance and fear? No!"

This seems like a perfectly natural reaction to being asked to pose as a god.

 

[Fang66]

4.) Who Watches the Watchers - So unsubtle in it's anti-religion message that it sickens me. If you're an atheist, hey more power to you. If you want to promote atheism, go right ahead and knock yourself out. But don't go and claim that all religion is backward superstition, that religious people are ignorant and that no good can come from it. If a believer tried to pull the exact same argument (that non-believers are stupid, that they don't deserve to be treated with equal respect and that atheism always produces immorality) I would be equally sickened; so why should I not be here?

completely agree

You would agree wouldn't you, so gullible, don't you remember that time that the malevolent entity tricked you into thinking Sha Ka Ree was at the galactic core?

 

[spooky spice]

4.) Who Watches the Watchers - So unsubtle in it's anti-religion message that it sickens me. If you're an atheist, hey more power to you. If you want to promote atheism, go right ahead and knock yourself out. But don't go and claim that all religion is backward superstition, that religious people are ignorant and that no good can come from it. If a believer tried to pull the exact same argument (that non-believers are stupid, that they don't deserve to be treated with equal respect and that atheism always produces immorality) I would be equally sickened; so why should I not be here?

Agreed, and shockingly I'm an atheist. If someone wants to believe in a deity who looks after them, then fair play to them, I don't mock them for it.

Have you SEEN how many threads have been made over the years about Captain Jellico and whether he was a dick or a good Captain, and how unprofessional the Enterprise crew acted and whether they were justified or not?

no, cos I've not been on here long enough, I thought Jellico had the right idea and that the crew were being unprofessional.

 

[mitchconner]

I really think people are missing the point. Tampering with people's religious beliefs is wrong, but tampering with their lack of belief would have been just as bad. The people there had, on their own, abandoned religious belief and reintroducing beliefs, at least in the greater context of that episode, would have been a bad thing. They found a secular system that worked for them, and as we saw in the episode, creating religious beliefs would have had negative consequences. Still, I think people are overreacting.

In the Star Trek universe, they've abandoned currency and basically created a socialist system, and my own brother (who's an ultra-conservative) despises the show because of it, calling it "Marxist propaganda". Personally, I think he's insane. It's just science fiction. It's an exploration of ideas and philosophy, and ultimately, an exploration of humanity. Just roll with it.

 

[Admiral Shran]

I just rewatched the episode and Picard makes no such claim for all religion being worthless. There is only one scene that could be construed as anti-religious rather than just portraying characters from a future that has left superstitious beliefs behind them in the dim past (as any sane person would hope we will). That scene is where Dr Barron recommends giving the Mintakens guide lines for what will inevitably become a religion and Picard says "Horrifying... Dr. Barron, your report describes how rational these people are. Millennia ago, they abandoned their belief in the supernatural. Now you are asking me to sabotage that achievement, to send them back into the dark ages of superstition and ignorance and fear? No!"

But what is he doing in that one scene? He's saying that religious people can't be rational, that religion is nothing more than superstition, that it is a worthwhile achievement to abandon it, that people who believe in it are ignorant and that it only promotes fear.

Sounds like an overstatement to me.

If he had instead said ---- "Horrifying... Dr. Barron, your report on these people describes how they gave up their spiritual beliefs millennia ago. Now you are asking me to undo that - to force them to believe in something which they have freely chosen not to. That is immoral and I will do it. No!" ---- then I would not have had a problem.

In the Star Trek universe, they've abandoned currency and basically created a socialist system, and my own brother (who's an ultra-conservative) despises the show because of it, calling it "Marxist propaganda". Personally, I think he's insane. It's just science fiction. It's an exploration of ideas and philosophy, and ultimately, an exploration of humanity. Just roll with it.

I have plenty of problems with the whole "abandoning currency" situation (even in a utopian society you still need some form of currency - what do they use? Barter?) But, even as a libertarian myself, I'm able to roll with it for dramatic purposes for one major reason - in the Trek universe, they've essentially gotten rid of scarcity by having limitless matter-to-energy conversion possible.

 

[Fang66]

But what is he doing in that one scene? He's saying that religious people can't be rational, that religion is nothing more than superstition, that it is a worthwhile achievement to abandon it, that people who believe in it are ignorant and that it only promotes fear.

Sounds like an overstatement to me.

But Picard isn't saying that religious people are ignorant or that it only promotes fear. He is condeming religion and stating that one of its effects is the promotion of fear and ignorance which of course is perfectly true religions do in fact promote fear and ignorance.

In the Star Trek universe it is entirely plausible that we have learned why people have religious feelings (there is already interesting research going on in that area) and that society has developed beyond the need for these supernatural beliefs. In that context it makes perfect sense for Picard to condem irrationality. And also in that context it would be a worthwhile achievement to abandon religion.

 

[Sybok]

You would agree wouldn't you, so gullible, don't you remember that time that the malevolent entity tricked you into thinking Sha Ka Ree was at the galactic core?

firstly i think you would be pretty convinced too, secondly looks like you have some anger issues, i can help you with that you know

 

[Fang66]

You would agree wouldn't you, so gullible, don't you remember that time that the malevolent entity tricked you into thinking Sha Ka Ree was at the galactic core?

firstly i think you would be pretty convinced too, secondly looks like you have some anger issues, i can help you with that you know

I need my pain damn it!

 

[Quinton O'Connor]

5. "Sins of the Father"

Good but not great. Worf's arc is handled better and more intriguingly throughout subsequent seasons and especially on DS9. There are certainly worse Worf episodes but I wouldn't classify them as overrated. Unless people actually happen to love "Birthright"?

4. "Encounter at Farpoint"

Just because it doesn't frequent top ten lists doesn't mean I can't find it overrated. When I came back to Trek last year my girlfriend and I found this pilot almost wholly uninteresting. Sure, Q is a welcome sight and Picard is well-acted from the get-go but this is far from either of their best performances. Of course it isn't, it's the pilot... yeah, I know. But it's still almost complete cheesy-as-all garbage as far as I'm concerned. Even a guest appearance by one of my favorite voice actors (Michael Bell, the leader of Farpoint, I think) couldn't save it.

3. "The Inner Light"

Pretty swell but not the best of Trek like some say. Just too schmaltzy as my comrade Shran has proclaimed.

2. "Best of Both Worlds, Part I"

Again, a great episode... but not that great. There's a lot to love here but as one of those rare scoundrels who vastly prefers the second part I can't get behind the rampant worship this hour receives. Riker's conflict with Shelby (that was her name, right?) didn't do it for me. That's a big blow.

1. "Yesterday's Enterprise"

Eh.

It's decent. It's a cool sci-fi premise and Yar's return is relatively welcomed. But... I don't know. I've just never felt the love for it. Some good performances and action sequences and that overarching sense of inevitability give it strength but the romantic sequences between Yar and what's-his-face were so corny and the whole thing just didn't come together more than a good-but-not-classic three-star episode would. This one takes the top spot because damn if it isn't talked-about often and damn, I don't get it.

 

[Quinton O'Connor]

Honorable Mention...

"Captain's Holiday"

Not an episode that gets talked-about too often but when it does I see a lot of praise. Picard's abrupt relationship with Vash is so nauseating and badly-executed. The whole thing feels like the very worst parts of Indiana Jones; as a bit of an amateur archaeologist myself I might have been swept away by the plot if it hadn't been so damned silly. And again, for emphasis, ugh at that relationship. I'd even go so far as to say "Q-Pid" handles it better.

 

[Judy Waxhorn]

Inner Light. Darmok. Tapestry.

Those are my "avoid" episodes.

 

[Saxman1]

Honorable Mention...

"Captain's Holiday"

Not an episode that gets talked-about too often but when it does I see a lot of praise. Picard's abrupt relationship with Vash is so nauseating and badly-executed. The whole thing feels like the very worst parts of Indiana Jones; as a bit of an amateur archaeologist myself I might have been swept away by the plot if it hadn't been so damned silly. And again, for emphasis, ugh at that relationship. I'd even go so far as to say "Q-Pid" handles it better.

This came out of Stewart complaining that the Riker character was getting all the girls, believe it or not. I can't see Picard with Vash, either. Yeah, opposites attract, but Picard falling for a narcissistic, amoral, con-woman/ sociopath is too much of a stretch, not to mention Stewart and Hettrick had zero on-screen chemistry....

 

[Quinton O'Connor]

Oh hey, come to think of it I remember reading that before. Totally forgot. Well, fair enough rationale on Stewart's part, I... guess, but man, that wasn't the way to go about it.

And I totally agree -- no chemistry whatsoever!

 

[TrekAlliance92]

Inner Light. Darmok. Tapestry.

Those are my "avoid" episodes.

Me too! I'm glad I'm not the only one!

 

[mitchconner]

In the Star Trek universe, they've abandoned currency and basically created a socialist system, and my own brother (who's an ultra-conservative) despises the show because of it, calling it "Marxist propaganda". Personally, I think he's insane. It's just science fiction. It's an exploration of ideas and philosophy, and ultimately, an exploration of humanity. Just roll with it.

I have plenty of problems with the whole "abandoning currency" situation (even in a utopian society you still need some form of currency - what do they use? Barter?) But, even as a libertarian myself, I'm able to roll with it for dramatic purposes for one major reason - in the Trek universe, they've essentially gotten rid of scarcity by having limitless matter-to-energy conversion possible.

Yeah, the currency-free earth concept never really made a lot of sense to me. I mean, anything can become currency in a sense, whether it's paper money or chickens. Then again, if I had a replicator and unlimited electricity, I wouldn't be too worried about money (and I'd have an even sweeter DVD/Blu-Ray collection...). But I think one of the big underlying points of Star Trek was exploring the potential of the human race. I would love nothing more than to live on a planet without violence, disease, famine, poverty and greed, and where, as you say, we have limitless matter-to-energy conversion, but that's not going to happen in our lifetime. Even though I'm nonreligious, I'm not offended by religion, but I think the idea of a religion-free Earth is just as interesting as the notion of a currency-free Earth. I'm not saying I think it's possible or right, but Star Trek (and any decent science fiction) is about the exploration of new ideas along with the exploration of our galaxy.

And I, too, am a registered libertarian -- and I did it before it was cool, back when most of my friends and family thought libertarians were crazy extremists who just wanted to legalize drugs and prostitutes (and then after Bush and Obama, they suddenly wanted to join the party...)

 

[Nightdiamond]

"Inner Light".

Just couldn't get into it. Never could understand what all the hoopla was about.

If they took some risks in the episode, like his wife cheating on him and then they reconciled, it may have more of an emotional impact.

This episode is almost always rated in the 'best top 5' in Trek.

Tapestry did the same thing, but did it better, IMO.

"Times Arrow 1 and 2". Except for the Mark Twain part, dull, full of techno-babble.

"Phantasms"- the one where Data is having the bizarre dreams. Boring and slow. This one is actually rated among the top 10 also.

 

[diankra]

Why is Spock so angry in these episodes? That's not the TOS Spock that I know and love.

I think the intention was to portray Spock as finally having fully accepted his human side over the course of time between TOS and Unification. He still maintains a calm and controlled personality but isn't afraid to be emotional if required (as Data points out, to which Spock replies "fascinating" nonchantly).

Even by TUC timeframe, Spock is in touch with his human side. He angrily voices disappoinment at Valeris' betrayal and knocks the phaser out of her hand. This is not to mention his clear display of joy in TVH, including fooling about in the water with Kirk and the others and laughing. I got the impression that Spock began to accept his human side in TMP and had fully accepted it by Unification.

Arguably, a major flaw of Unification is that Spock is the same Spock as in Undiscovered Country, as if he'd already reached the end of his 'emotional journey' (Horrible, horrible Pseud's Corner phrase, but it's appropriate here) and another 70 years of experiences and growth wouldn't have had effects on him.