Too many Starbucks after all?

[TheBrew]

I currently live in Arlington, VA and the Arlington rap gets it right (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4T1RMuoQnKo) -- There's a Starbucks in a Safeway right across from a Starbucks across the street.

Lee-Harrison? By the Harris-Teeter?

That rap video is so great. You know you're from Arlington when you can identify each Starbucks they show and where they are located, even though all they show is the Starbucks logo/sign.

Also, A-town! Represent!

What-up, daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwg?!

 

[Danoz]

I currently live in Arlington, VA and the Arlington rap gets it right (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4T1RMuoQnKo) -- There's a Starbucks in a Safeway right across from a Starbucks across the street.

Lee-Harrison? By the Harris-Teeter?

That rap video is so great. You know you're from Arlington when you can identify each Starbucks they show and where they are located, even though all they show is the Starbucks logo/sign.

Also, A-town! Represent!

What-up, daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwg?!

haha The Brew and Squiggy-- other A-Town reps.

 

[doubleohfive]

^
Oh I know. They got there just after I left! Still... one of these days when I make it back, there WILL BE AN EPIC MEETUP!

 

[auntiehill]

^ You do realize what the inspiration for this thread was, right?

Well, duh.

I figured Lewis should have the last word, since he wasn't quoted earlier.

 

[wamdue]

I know two costas coffees less than 100 metres from each other, one of them a Costa store, and across the road WHSmith has a Costa inside it.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

It could be the same for these across from one another Starbucks where two in that location are needed because the demand is too great for one store to handle.

If there's no room to expand the first store (i.e. if it's in a corner), then I suppose I can understand this bit. I still think, though, that in general it should be easier to just make one store bigger than to build a whole new store right next to it. Doesn't that make sense?

 

[Punky]

I'll tell you what is even MORE ridiculous about Starbucks. We went to a mall in a city near Virginia Beach and there was 2 Starbucks on every floor AS WELL AS 1 Starbucks on BOTH floors of the Barnes and Noble bookstore. This made a grand total of like 8 Starbucks in ONE mall!!!

 

[Captain Ice]

I haven't seen that kind of density of Starbucks, but then again, I don't really pay attention since I don't drink coffee. But there was a similar situation that made me scratch my head. At one exit off I-85 north of Atlanta, I stopped at a Shell station to get some gas. Now, I can understand them having another Shell station on the opposite side of the interstate since the crossing road was a busy one, but there was a *third* Shell station immediately next to the one I stopped at! Same side of the street and everything! I'm thinking maybe Shell bought out the other competitors and took over their locations, but still!

We've got a bit of this going on too. I can think of two intersections off the top of my head with Circle Ks across the street from each other here.

Oh, there is also one area with 3 Circle Ks on the same side of the same street within about 500 yards of each other. There is also a closed Circle K about 800 feet from one of those three in another direction.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ Strange things are afoot at the Circle K...

 

[Owain Taggart]

Almost looks like it could be photoshopped, honestly. But it does make a good point. While not Starbucks, we've recently had a Lowe's open right across the street from Home Depot. Conceivably, it sounds like it could be a good idea, however for a small town, it's a death knell. It simply isn't big enough to be able to support two of them like that, and we have a lot of lumber stores where I am as it is. Tim Hortons in Canada is practically on every street corner.

 

[emacs]

Wouldn't that be a waste of money and time and material and all that?

only if demand does not justify two locations in such close proximity to each other.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I guess I still don't get it though. Why would demand be better served by two separate Starbucks (right across from each other, as in my example) than one larger one? They say that people won't cross the street. Well, they will if they have to.

 

[Goliath]

I guess I still don't get it though. Why would demand be better served by two separate Starbucks (right across from each other, as in my example) than one larger one? They say that people won't cross the street. Well, they will if they have to.

If they're across the street from each other, it probably has to do with traffic flow.

Motorists are lazy. They're much more likely to turn right for a coffee than they are to turn left, across oncoming traffic.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Yeah, I admit I didn't think of the traffic part. That does make sense.

I'm just too used to going to Starbuckses where there is no (or very little) vehicle traffic.

 

[Timby]

Unlike McDonald's, which is really one of the biggest real estate traders in the world and has made a fucking fortune in that trade, companies like Starbucks generally don't own their spaces, but instead they rent them from the development corporations which own the buildings themselves.

While it's not too hard to build an addition onto a house, it can be and frequently is rather difficult -- logistically and financially speaking -- to acquire adjacent space, especially in a downtown environment in which there is generally an active tenant next door, and build it out to expand the current store (especially given the nightmares of "pardon our construction while we knock out a wall and expand to serve you better") ... and given the sometimes-limited revenue boost that expansion can give versus another location, there are situations in which it doesn't make sense to just make the store bigger. There are other situations in which you can't do it.

You said it yourself:

Why would demand be better served by two separate Starbucks

They say that people won't cross the street. Well, they will if they have to.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ Oops, I misspoke. They will cross the street if they have to, but would probably prefer not to.

In any case, I do accept that remodeling won't work if space is tight (which is frequently the case with Starbuckses).

And also, I realize that the word "Starbuckses" might not be grammatically correct, I just love to say it.

 

[FordSVT]

I live in Ontario. We have Starbucks, but really, this is Tim Horton's country.

The most remarkable example of saturation I've ever seen was in Hamilton, Ontario.

Imagine you are driving west on King Street. You come to the intersection of King & Dundurn. There is a Tim Horton's, on your right.

You turn left, and drive south down Dundurn Street to Main Street. Dundurn Mall is on your right. There is a Tim Horton's there.

You arrive at the intersection of Dundurn & Main. You turn left again, and proceed east, down Main Street. There is a Tim Horton's on your right.

They've got you coming, they've got you going--they've even got you stopping & shopping.

There are 20 Tim Horton's in Saint John including the drive-throughs, with a population of about 120,000 people. As a comparison, there are only 8 McDonald's, including the ones in Walmart and two gas stations. There are 3 Starbucks including one in a bookstore.

 

[Holdfast]

My question is: are they franchised? That can "almost" explain it.

That was going to be my guess too, but I found out that Starbucks doesn't franchise.

However, they do have licensing agreements for places they can't access normally (but Starbucks retains ownership of the licence). So the competition and convenience arguments others have mentioned above are probably more accurate, together with the fact that Starbucks have a large number of legacy outlets that they are actively trying to rationalise away in areas they don't need them (I recall reading something in the FT about this a couple of years ago).