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To anyone upset about this movie...

awesomeocalypse

Ensign
Red Shirt
Full disclosure: Until a few days ago I was not a Star Trek fan. I've seen maybe 30 episodes and 2 movies before this one in my entire life and didn't hate them but also didn't love them. I LOVED this movie though, and am rapidly doing everything I can to immerse myself.

I realize I don't exactly have nerd chops on this subject. I certainly can't claim to grasp the specific pain that those fans who disliked or even hated this film must feel. It must really, truly suck to know that, despite assurances that the old timeline is still going on somewhere, for the forseeable future their beloved franchise will be dominated by an incarnation they despise that has carte blanche to ignore whatever it likes from the canon they love. Not just on mainstream films (and possibly shows [/fingerscrossed]) but in fandom as well, where the vast majority who loved the movie will be supplemented by lots of new fans like me.

But if you're a lifelong, diehard fan (as my dad is), and extremely pissed off about this film (which my dad isn't), I'd like to offer up a lesson from another branch of geekdom that may offer a slight glimmer of hope:

As a young DC comics diehard, I was one of what felt like a vanishingly small minority (especially because this was pre-internet and i was a 13 year old kid in a small town) who felt lost and abandoned following the Crisis on Infinite Earths. For those who don't know, CoIE was a massive comics event (in a time when those didn't happen every other week) in which basically the entire DC Universe as it had been known for decades and decades was wiped out and rebooted anew (with some exceptions, which seemed minor at the time but became important later). There was a Superman, but he was certainly not my Superman. Moreover, the stories they said they wanted to tell with this new universe seemed less interesting to me, cheap and modern and shallow and a betrayal of a lot of what I used to love about DC.

Whats more, since comics at the time (unlike Star Trek) pretty much only existed in one medium (Superman movies aside), that meant the new continuity truly and utterly erased the old continuity. I had my old comics, but it seemed certain that apart from maybe the occasional one-shot I would not be getting any serious comic attention devoted to the characters I'd loved so dearly. They were dead and gone forever, confined to past issues, the way you look at home movies of a loved one who has moved on.

Now, in time I grew to accept and love many of these new characters. But there were many cases where I didn't, and many others where I still preferred the originals regardless of how much I liked the rebooted characters.

For years I kept up sporadically with comics, gritting my teeth through a bizarrely limited and infuriatingly indecisive superman, a one-dimensional psycho of a batman, and a green lantern who was not the green lantern i'd loved because the green lantern i'd loved went insane and committed murder on a Hitleresque scale.

But then a very interesting thing began to happen. Cracks started to appear in this new contuinity, and people began to remember what they liked about the old one.

At first in just manifested in the occaional ressurection of a forgotten classic character or a run on a book that rejected the "grim and gritty" status quo for brighter and more heroic and more unselfconsciously wondrous themes.

Then a character or two slipped through, explictly from that long-lost continuity. Not much, but a reminder that it was still alive.

Then crossovers occured, out of continuity one-shots and series that made explicit efforts to return to the past.

And then, finally, it all collapsed. All the old characters came rushing back, and there was another crisis (and another, and probably more and more for as long as DC can milk it, but I digress), and some lived and some died, and stuff changed, and changed again. And some of it was new, and some of it was old.

Now, a lot of this was crap. But some of it wasn't. Some of it was absolutely great, and exactly what fans like me, who'd felt so abandoned before, had been looking for. They even brought the old green lantern back and showed how awesome he was to begin with.

My point is, the past never really died. How could it? This stuff is made by nerds. When do nerds really ever let anything die?

Sooner or later, some diehard star trek fan is gonna get his hands on this franchise either in movie or show form. And maybe he likes the new version okay, but he also remembers that old version. That other timeline. And he'll think "Okay, maybe it was a little worn out back then...but its been a while, and I wonder what they've been up to. I kinda miss those guys...hey what if Kirk finds himself thrown into a distant alternate future, one where his father never died..." or he'll think, "well these whiz-bang adventure tales are fun, but i'd really like to create an in-depth political and philosophical show.."


And you'll fall in love like you did the first time.
 
Personally, I hope NuTrek will last a good long while. The cast is young, and we could get YEARS worth of stories about our original characters, or at least their counter-parts from a parallel universe. Give it some time and this whole "I hate it" thing will hopefully be forgotten.
 
The Arthurian Saga has be retold for centuries and I have seen all kind of modern retellings and alterations, some better than others. I liked this. Sure the cadet to Captain thing seemed a little much, and the red matter planet sucker thingie wasnt all that believable, but all in all, its good. I like it.

In some timelines Clark Kent and Lex Luther grew up together and were once close friends. These things happen. If you dont like the retellings..there will someday be new ones. You can even write your own.

Its all good.
 
But...
they blew up Vulcan!

To go with the DC comics comparison, it's as if they rebooted that universe with Gotham City being nuked.

Everything else about Star Trek was cool. The reshuffling of Kirk's history, Captain Pike, etc. But
they blew up Vulcan!
.

Every defense of Star Trek is fine. I loved the movie. But my response to all praise of the film always starts with
they blew up Vulcan!
.

It will be extremely hard for me to get over it.
 
Not a chance. They are selling too many tickets. Face it, Trek is Dead, and NuTrek is all that exists now.


Yup for better or worse, for those that liked the movie and those that didn't. This is what it is now. You either accept it or don't.
 
It will be interesting to see if they do eventually, even if it's only in novel form, do crossovers between the 2 universes.

Frankly, I'm not sure whether I'm more upset about the timeline changes or the fact that I just don't think it's a very good movie. I suspect I could probably tolerate one but not the other. Still, if Abrams & co. are able to put together a better sequel from this, I may still be interested.
 
Bear with me. I'm new.

The way I see it, this isn't so different from getting a new Star Trek show. Some of them you love, some of them you hate, but either way they are part of the franchise. You can either choose to enjoy them or choose not to. I think the DC comics reference is a good one. Let me add to it something maybe a bit more recent.

Any of you Harry Potter fans?

I enjoy the books so much. I've been to the midnight parties. I've lived and died by those books. And then the movies come out. And the whole message of these books that are so important to me is left out. Completely. But I go, and I enjoy them because they're still good movies. I try to think of them as two different entities. I love the books. I like the movies. They are not the same thing, they are not the same medium. So I don't compare them to each other.

NuTrek is not the original story. It's new actors, new stories, new time lines. Was the old one good? I don't know yet. I'm still working my way in. Was the movie good? Yes. Even if you're a die hard fan you have to be able to admit that it was well filmed, well directed, and in general a very fun to watch movie. Comparing the two will only lead to heartache in my opinion, so I, for one, am not going to do it. I liked the film. I liked Next Gen. I have a feeling I'm going to like TOS. But since none of them are the same thing, I don't feel the need to compare them.
 
Personaly I dont expect NuTrek to last too long. Give it some time and this whole reboot thing will hopefully be forgotten.

Not a chance. They are selling too many tickets. Face it, Trek is Dead, and NuTrek is all that exists now.

I disagree. Trek has been revived. She looks a little different, but her heart is still beating, whereas she was at death's door not a scant few weeks ago.

J.
 
But...
they blew up Vulcan!

To go with the DC comics comparison, it's as if they rebooted that universe with Gotham City being nuked.

Everything else about Star Trek was cool. The reshuffling of Kirk's history, Captain Pike, etc. But
they blew up Vulcan!
.

Every defense of Star Trek is fine. I loved the movie. But my response to all praise of the film always starts with
they blew up Vulcan!
.

It will be extremely hard for me to get over it.

You know, I know it's odd, but that I can accept a lot more easilly than something else that happened.

THEY DROPPED AMANDA OFF A CLIFF AND KILLED HER!!!!

Believe it or not, if they undid that I'd be a whole lot more settled than if they fixed the other.
 
Personaly I dont expect NuTrek to last too long. Give it some time and this whole reboot thing will hopefully be forgotten.

Not a chance. They are selling too many tickets. Face it, Trek is Dead, and NuTrek is all that exists now.

I disagree. Trek has been revived. She looks a little different, but her heart is still beating, whereas she was at death's door not a scant few weeks ago.

J.

Leibniz would disagree, but that is for another thread!
 
Personaly I dont expect NuTrek to last too long. Give it some time and this whole reboot thing will hopefully be forgotten.

Not a chance. They are selling too many tickets. Face it, Trek is Dead, and NuTrek is all that exists now.

I disagree. Trek has been revived. She looks a little different, but her heart is still beating, whereas she was at death's door not a scant few weeks ago.

J.

And that could have been accomplished without flushing everything that existed previously down the toilet. But that would have required innovative writing and a lot of hard work, so forget about that.
 
Not a chance. They are selling too many tickets. Face it, Trek is Dead, and NuTrek is all that exists now.

I disagree. Trek has been revived. She looks a little different, but her heart is still beating, whereas she was at death's door not a scant few weeks ago.

J.

And that could have been accomplished without flushing everything that existed previously down the toilet. But that would have required innovative writing and a lot of hard work, so forget about that.

They didn't flush canon at all. Your most prized canon is taking place at this very moment in it's own universe. We, however, are in a different universe. This movie has been innovative and they have worked hard. You may not like the movie, but they have worked hard on it. That, however, is your prerogative. I'm just glad to see real, genuine Star Trek back in theaters after the utter failure of the fan written, canon bound Nemesis.

J.
 
jamie h said:
And that could have been accomplished without flushing everything that existed previously down the toilet. But that would have required innovative writing and a lot of hard work, so forget about that.

I disagree. I think the writing WAS innovative and probably took masses of work. It's kind of intimidating coming into a medium where you know that no matter what you do, you're probably going to piss off a very large group of people. Would you really rather have seen the exact same thing you've already seen before, just with new actors? I'm glad there's a new time line. It means we have a lot of options for the future of the franchise ahead of us.
 
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