Spoilers TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic by McIntee Review Thread

[Christopher]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Starfleet clearly has "command track" and "non-command track" officers, but, other than specifically designated first and second officers, there's no evidence of having line officers in the traditional sense. Lacking line officer rules, LaForge and even Doctor Crusher (who eventually became a captain in the "All Good Things" timeline) may automatically be considered by Starfleet as experienced enough to become executive officers or even to command ships (under the right circumstances) based solely upon their ranks.

And note that Crusher was captain of a medical ship. It suggests that Starfleet would favor giving command of a specialized ship to someone whose training was in that specialty (like giving Scotty or Geordi or Gomez or al-Khalid command of an SCE ship), rather than going solely by whether someone is on "command track" or not. Which fits with Roddenberry's view of Starfleet as an only loosely military organization where rank was treated more as a part of one's job description than a component of a rigid hierarchical authority structure.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Spoiler: the captain of engineering rank

I,m not clear on the captian of engineering, scott old spot,does that mak him the head of the COE

If memory serves me correctly, Scotty was promoted to captain at the same time he was assigned to the Excelsior project in "Star Trek III" and he has held that rank since. His rank apparently isn't directly connected to his assignment at Starfleet.

He's told about being promoted to "Captain of Engineering" in TSFS, yep, in the same scene when they're told about the Enterprise being decommissioned. He's then addressed as "Captain Scott" in at least TVH and the episode Relics.

 

[Warp Coil]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Okay, I just finished. I am a little unsure how how to rate the book. I think that, in the broadest sense, it was a nice idea. Poor Geordi had been under-utilized and under-developed for far too long. This novel did a good job of finally putting him in the spotlight and also addressing a number of things that I think a lot of people have been waiting for. His lack of professional and personal development over so many years finally gets thrown in the character's face. Can Geordi really be happy as the chief engineer of the Enterprise for the rest of his life? He's been doing the job for so long... is there really nothing else for him? I definitely appreciated the fact that he was given the opportunity to stretch his wings.

However, I have to say that I was really disappointed in the plots and execution of the book. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I do not think it was necessary to bring in so many familiar characters. Maybe had it just been limited to Scotty and Leah, I would have been okay with it. I see absolutely no reason why so many others needed to be included. This is probably one of the worst examples of Small Universe Syndrome that I've read in recent memory. I also do not understand at all why the book was broken into two parts. What, exactly, was the point of including Rasmussen and Bok? That story element ultimately does not need to be in this book at all, and the way it just ends half-way through seems very odd. I really just felt like the story structure was a mess, and I wasn't terribly engrossed in what was going on.

 

[Christopher]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

I also do not understand at all why the book was broken into two parts.

I guess you haven't read the rest of the thread, then. As David has explained, he originally pitched it as two separate novels.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I do not think it was necessary to bring in so many familiar characters. Maybe had it just been limited to Scotty and Leah, I would have been okay with it. I see absolutely no reason why so many others needed to be included. This is probably one of the worst examples of Small Universe Syndrome that I've read in recent memory.

That's what CBS asked for - have to fulfil the brief. And I like the mix it ended up with.

I also do not understand at all why the book was broken into two parts.

Other way round - it was two books cut together into one.

What, exactly, was the point of including Rasmussen and Bok? That story element ultimately does not need to be in this book at all

That storyline was always going to be in book 1, though originally it would have probably been new characters in the place of those two, but doing the same thing.

 

[Stoek]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

I'm enjoying the story over all. Personally I found Geordi's "voice" to be fairly spot on. Also enjoyed seeing Reg (who I would imagine could be a hard character to write and find the right balance between competent officer and 24th century version of a Geek). I enjoyed the unexpected return of Rasmussen and the explanation of how he came to be in the 24th century (especially since the 22nd century wasn't quite the pit of barbarism that was supposed when the episode he debuted in first appeared. However I do have a couple of problems as regards him...

Spoiler: Talkin' about Berlinghoff Rasmussen.

First of all I was more than a little disappointed that there was really nothing more going on with him than what the lowest expectations of most of the characters thought was going on with him. Second of all I think that a detail got missed that while not story ruining really did go CLUNK for me. Namely that with no contact from the 22nd century ship, EVERYONE on Challenger just knew that Rasmussen was involved with the take over of the ship. Suspicions are one thing but the way everyone talked it was as if they had been told.

 

[JAG]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Voted Outstanding. It was a great fun read. I liked the characterizations and thought the new characters were well integrated with the people we already know. Loved seeing Nog.

 

[ice]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

There's a difference between fanfic and professional.

And indeed between fanfic and fanwank, which is surely the more accurate word!

I was meaning "screams of fan fiction" rather than "it IS fan fiction" so, yeah, "fanwank" is bang on...

oh, command track, remember Geordi was Riker's first officer in Redemption Part II as well, so he's presumably taken all the exams and stuff. Doesn't matter, though.

I'd totally forgotten about that. Great point. Much like Scott being in charge of the TOS Enterprise in certain situations, I don't have a problem with Geordi being a Captain; but "captain of the moment" has to be far different than "captain everyday."

It just needed some build up which to me wasn't present. Same goes for Sulu in STVI; several years had passed in between movies. Who knew what went on? Same again for Beverly in All Good Things...

You've liked other stuff I've written (surprised you mentioned Mission Impractical though - that's no classic, and a bit... would-be "wacky" even for me), and probably people who loved this would other stuff I've done.

Seriously, I loved Mission, it captured a Colin Baker DW story perfectly for me. It's probably my favourite 6th Dr BBC book. Speaking of other books, after enjoying Face of the Enemy so much, I'm now scouring ebay as we speak for a copy of The Dark Path...

 

[GalaxyClass1701]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Great book terrible ending why they couldn't leave the Challenger intact and Geordi as Captain is beyond me!!!!

 

[Christopher]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

...why they couldn't leave the Challenger intact and Geordi as Captain is beyond me!!!!

I figured it was because that's what everyone expected. What's the point of giving the readers an ending they already see coming?

 

[GalaxyClass1701]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

...why they couldn't leave the Challenger intact and Geordi as Captain is beyond me!!!!

I figured it was because that's what everyone expected. What's the point of giving the readers an ending they already see coming?

Because it makes sense and not stupid like what they wrote.

 

[JAG]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

...why they couldn't leave the Challenger intact and Geordi as Captain is beyond me!!!!

I figured it was because that's what everyone expected. What's the point of giving the readers an ending they already see coming?

It's not the destination, it's the journey. (At least for me.)

 

[GalaxyClass1701]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

...why they couldn't leave the Challenger intact and Geordi as Captain is beyond me!!!!

I figured it was because that's what everyone expected. What's the point of giving the readers an ending they already see coming?

It's not the destination, it's the journey. (At least for me.)

Again I really enjoyed the book but was very let down with the ending.

 

[JoeZhang]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Whatever the directives from CBS or what happens behind the scenes, the reader still has to deal with what's on the page as presented. First of all, I think it's well-written and the first few chapters are pretty good. However, I agree with the crit that it reads as a bit disjointed because of the way it is spilt into two sections.

Moreover, the author is never going to win when he puts in lots of established characters, half of the readers will love it, the other half will not - I'm in the half that didn't - it also read to me as fan wank, like the Star Trek universe should be full of people playing the banjo and marrying their cousins. Hitting over us the head with "see see this is how the last Star Trek timeline came about, see see" wasn't very good either - I'm avoiding DTI for that very reason as I expect more of the same, much more.

Still at least it's got the rare merit of being one of the few recent TNG-era books that doesn't present unpleasant or degraded versions of the characters we used to watch on the telly.

 

[Christopher]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

it also read to me as fan wank, like the Star Trek universe should be full of people playing the banjo and marrying their cousins.

Umm, is there a way you could've made that point without invoking a degrading ethnic stereotype of Appalachians?

Hitting over us the head with "see see this is how the last Star Trek timeline came about, see see" wasn't very good either - I'm avoiding DTI for that very reason as I expect more of the same, much more.

I'm not sure what you're referring to here, so I can't respond. What do you mean by "the last Star Trek timeline," and how did IFM dwell on how it came about?

 

[JoeZhang]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Sorry I meant "Last Star Trek Movie timeline" came out.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Great book terrible ending why they couldn't leave the Challenger intact and Geordi as Captain is beyond me!!!!

Because I very much doubt they'd let a newbie make such a change to the ongoing range, and create a new set...

 

[Christopher]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Sorry I meant "Last Star Trek Movie timeline" came out.

How does IFM make assertions about how the 2009 movie's timeline came about? We know how it came about -- we were told in the movie itself. And I don't remember anything in IFM that was tied into the '09 movie in any major way. There were moments when I thought it was setting up an explanation of Scotty's knowledge of transwarp beaming, but it didn't go that way after all.

And there's not much in DTI: Watching the Clock that pertains to the new movie's continuity either, since of course the book is set years before the 2387 supernova and the characters have no knowledge of it. There are maybe three subtle nods in the direction of concepts from the movie, but they're very indirect and implicit, since in the wake of Seek a Newer World's cancellation I was wary of including any overt references.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

Sorry I meant "Last Star Trek Movie timeline" came out.

Er, I'm not getting what you mean - IFM has nothing to do with the movie timeline. The movie tells us how that timeline came about...

I may be just not on top BBS form today though - my wife's father died yesterday morning and I've just spent 36 hours dealing with the practicalities of that situation.

So, if I fail to answer a query over the coming week (the funeral will be next Friday) that's why - cos I'm probably only going to be looking in online maybe once an evening, tops, and probably just a couple of times in the coming week.

But I'll try to look in and be accessible. Just can't promise.

 

[Christopher]

Re: Star Trek: TNG: Indistinguishable From Magic Review Thread

^My condolences, David.