TMP-DE fully restored in 4K…it’s about time!
- Thread starter Warped9
- Start date
Hopefully she'll appreciate your happiness.
No way. The music was very obviously looped, and if anything it sounded worse than how they managed it for the ABC broadcast.
Maybe, that's not what I remember hearing at the time, and unfortunately, the board only goes back to 2007, so I can't find the old thread from 2002 to check. Either way, my point that the eventual DVD release was different from the initial version of the "director's edition" stands.
^<continues in Savik> How much damage have they done, and what is left to come? 
BIG Date Nite!
BIG Date Nite!
Transporter, and David walking on the bridge.
To the former, they hard-looped music during the exterior shot when showing Kirk and company climbing to the bridge. It worked. To the latter, the just dialed the music out for the added bits. Both edits were during Battle in the Mutara Nebula.
I can’t believe we’re getting the SLV in 4K and widescreen, that’s so awesome! I almost wish they hadn’t finished the airlock shot just to see how much more set scaffolding could be seen!.
The raw scene is in "Bonus Features".
Yesterday The Trek Files shared a memo from Roddenberry to Wise concerning possible revisions to TMP for foreign release prints. Some of these comments are in line with Wise's comments in the 1980 interview published in The Best of Starlog #5. I honestly wish the DE team had paid more mind to stuff like this if they were really trying to get back to original intent.
In the same scan there was the following letter:
Cc: Todd Ramsay
Jeff Katzenberg
TO: ROBERT WISE . . . . . . . . DATE: DEC. 26, 1979
FROM: GENE RODDENBERRY. . . . . . . .SUBJECT: POSSIBLE FILM REVISIONS
I am confining my comments to the suggestions which seem to me to offer ways of doing one or more of three things: (a) quickening the pace of our film; (b) help story clarity; (c) improve characterization of our characters, primarily the secondary regulars.
Klingon Battle. Very exciting but I think our film would be greatly helped by anything that improves the clarity of the situation, i.e. the Klingons are attacking something dangerous and huge which is passing through their territory. Todd Ramsay and I have discussed whether the Klingon tactical grid really sells the fact that the Klingon photon torpedoes are being neutralized by the mysterious invader. If we cannot do it here then we should at least consider the possibility of further clarification on our foreign language prints by taking advantage of the fact that our translators can have our people saying almost anything we want them to say.
Planet Vulcan. I am not unhappy about the Vulcan scene. If you should decide you want some slight trimming of the Vulcan sequence, I see two lines by the Female Master which might trim out: "Now receive from us this symbol of total logic." Also, "Our minds, one and together." These things are shown in the action and may not need words. I leave it to you whether the trimming of a couple of lines could help the sequence enough to be worth the trouble.
Travel Pod trip around Enterprise. Agree that a trim here is clearly needed. I agree with the direction Todd is taking. I do think there is one of the Travel Pod on its outside dry dock approach which interrupts the Kirk-Enterprise emotions and have suggested to Todd that he point it out to you for possible elimination. If there is any way he can handle it smoothly, I feel that his shortened version very much needs to include the last part of the wide quartering angle on the ship in which the Pod stops and begins to back up toward the airlock.
Secondary Characters. Wherever possible, we should further strengthen our secondary regular characters. In light of what seems a good audience reaction in their favor, it might pay to re-examine those dialogue lines of theirs which have been trimmed from the film and possibly replace some of them. Also, wherever practical, we might re-examine whether we have sufficient reaction shots on them. An example of this would be where Kirk first arrives at the bridge and the hubbub there dies away as his old crew members become aware that their former captain is standing there at the elevator. You, of course, know best whether we have the film to give these characters their short cut moment of introduction this way. It also seems to me that our optical effects trims should much more than cover any footage added in these ways.
Optical footage. I really can't compliment Trumbull, Dykstra and the others enough for the opticals created in such a short time. On the other hand, I think it is time now (as we would have done in preview showings) to look at them critically and make some hard decisions when they come off (1) unclear, or (2) too slow. I certainly wouldn't want to see us panic-trim them as they are generally good and merely need some calm analysis now from the perspective of the dominant audience reactions which we have now seen.
Ilia on Bridge. Suggest we re-examine the possibility of staying on the Bridge for a while after Kirk has left to beam up Dr. McCoy. Ilia's line "I would never take advantage of a sexually immature species. You can assure him that's true, can't you?" is really very key to suggesting why a chastity oath was necessary to her and why Decker aro she had problems on Delta in their past. Is there some way to use some of this in a way that doesn't slow our pace? I'm concerned because these are the only lines in the film which suggest anything about why Deltans are unusual and interesting.
Decker's computations. If we can do the above, suggest we lose Decker's line which opens Scene 122 and Ilia's following line: "Science officer's computations confirmed, sir," plus the look which passes between her and Decker at that moment. Both are a repeat of things we already know. Of course, if we cannot find a way to use the Deltan sex explanations in Scene 100, then we probably do need these lines and that look.
Decker and Ilia in corridor. The "sexually immature species" material would help clarify and hype this scene too.
Wormhole. Is it clear now that something (an asteroid) has been pulled into the wormhole directly ahead of us? Also, is it clear that destroying the asteroid is not the thing which got us out of the wormhole? Or maybe neither or these really matters since our pace and action are working so well for us here.
McCoy and Spock. McCoy has come off so well in the film that we should at least consider using his line: "Never look a gift Vulcan in the ears, Jim." It might be at least worth your having a look at it to see if it plays now.
Officer's Lounge. Do we need the final exchange between Kirk and McCoy in which they talk about whether or not Spock might betray them? It seems to me a slow end to the scene, although I prefer to go entirely on your judgment in this.
Entering Cloud. It seems to me that the slow pace of examining V'ger is set up and exaggerated by the fact that we begin with an even slower trip through the cloud. The inside cloud optical effects are our weakest. Our emphasis should be on our people as they wait tensely to discover what fearsome thing might be found at the heart of the cloud and the actual inside cloud shots can be trimmed drastically. Doing this also helps our characters to stand out much more strongly.
Seeing and examining V'ger. Todd and I have discussed this and I agree thoroughly with his points of view. Suggest we stay aware, however, that trimming the journey through the cloud may do more than we expect in preventing the examination of V'ger from seeming tedious and it may well be that we do not have to trim the V'ger examination as drastically as it may first have appeared. Also, I have suggested to Todd that you consider losing Sulu and Kirk's line about reducing magnification. It slows us and really does not sell the size of V'ger as we hoped it would.
V’ger's "Crew". Should we now consider using Uhura's line about "alien crew of tens of thousands" and McCoy's reply? It certainly helps make V'ger seem huge and helps keep alive the very dramatic possibility that our crew may find themselves dealing with an incredible vessel which may be filled with equally incredible aliens.
Enterprise entering V'ger. We need to clarify the fact that the Intruder's tractor beam is pulling us into their ship. A fairly common complaint has been the failure of the geography of what is happening. Are there some clarification lines from secondary characters which we have not used? Also, as discussed with Todd, there is dialogue from Decker which does clarify that V'ger is pulling us inside but the present cut has Decker saying this after they are inside. Suggest we strongly consider the possibility of pulling Decker's lines forward so that he says them as we are being pulled inside. My suggestion to Todd was that this line from Decker be used soon after Spock's line which says that we have been seized by a tractor beam.
Inside V'ger. Suggest we eliminate the business of Kirk using maneuvering thrusters once they are inside V'ger. We've already had enough maneuvering thruster business and it tends to seem slow and repetitive here. It really isn't clear that they are trying to get to a second compartment within V'ger, and so I think our action will play better and faster if we just assume our starship is trapped and we move our story briskly along to where they turn immediately to try to use their sensors to analyze this giant ship which has "swallowed" them.
General. It seems to me that any editorial revising we do should emphasize pace and character and de-emphasize opticals. Again, I suggest this not because our optical specialists have not done a fine job in the time allotted but rather because we may have been so worried about our opticals that we tended to be relieved when we did receive good optical footage and because of this we tended to use too much optical footage, and sometimes at the expense of small things which helped our characters and pace. I think this is the main thing a preview audience might have told us if we had had the opportunity to test our film in that manner.
GR [initials]
Gene Roddenberry
GR:SS
Jeff Katzenberg
PARAMOUNT
A
Gulf & Western
Company
INTER-COMMUNICATION
A
Gulf & Western
Company
INTER-COMMUNICATION
TO: ROBERT WISE . . . . . . . . DATE: DEC. 26, 1979
FROM: GENE RODDENBERRY. . . . . . . .SUBJECT: POSSIBLE FILM REVISIONS
I am confining my comments to the suggestions which seem to me to offer ways of doing one or more of three things: (a) quickening the pace of our film; (b) help story clarity; (c) improve characterization of our characters, primarily the secondary regulars.
Klingon Battle. Very exciting but I think our film would be greatly helped by anything that improves the clarity of the situation, i.e. the Klingons are attacking something dangerous and huge which is passing through their territory. Todd Ramsay and I have discussed whether the Klingon tactical grid really sells the fact that the Klingon photon torpedoes are being neutralized by the mysterious invader. If we cannot do it here then we should at least consider the possibility of further clarification on our foreign language prints by taking advantage of the fact that our translators can have our people saying almost anything we want them to say.
Planet Vulcan. I am not unhappy about the Vulcan scene. If you should decide you want some slight trimming of the Vulcan sequence, I see two lines by the Female Master which might trim out: "Now receive from us this symbol of total logic." Also, "Our minds, one and together." These things are shown in the action and may not need words. I leave it to you whether the trimming of a couple of lines could help the sequence enough to be worth the trouble.
Travel Pod trip around Enterprise. Agree that a trim here is clearly needed. I agree with the direction Todd is taking. I do think there is one of the Travel Pod on its outside dry dock approach which interrupts the Kirk-Enterprise emotions and have suggested to Todd that he point it out to you for possible elimination. If there is any way he can handle it smoothly, I feel that his shortened version very much needs to include the last part of the wide quartering angle on the ship in which the Pod stops and begins to back up toward the airlock.
Secondary Characters. Wherever possible, we should further strengthen our secondary regular characters. In light of what seems a good audience reaction in their favor, it might pay to re-examine those dialogue lines of theirs which have been trimmed from the film and possibly replace some of them. Also, wherever practical, we might re-examine whether we have sufficient reaction shots on them. An example of this would be where Kirk first arrives at the bridge and the hubbub there dies away as his old crew members become aware that their former captain is standing there at the elevator. You, of course, know best whether we have the film to give these characters their short cut moment of introduction this way. It also seems to me that our optical effects trims should much more than cover any footage added in these ways.
Optical footage. I really can't compliment Trumbull, Dykstra and the others enough for the opticals created in such a short time. On the other hand, I think it is time now (as we would have done in preview showings) to look at them critically and make some hard decisions when they come off (1) unclear, or (2) too slow. I certainly wouldn't want to see us panic-trim them as they are generally good and merely need some calm analysis now from the perspective of the dominant audience reactions which we have now seen.
Ilia on Bridge. Suggest we re-examine the possibility of staying on the Bridge for a while after Kirk has left to beam up Dr. McCoy. Ilia's line "I would never take advantage of a sexually immature species. You can assure him that's true, can't you?" is really very key to suggesting why a chastity oath was necessary to her and why Decker aro she had problems on Delta in their past. Is there some way to use some of this in a way that doesn't slow our pace? I'm concerned because these are the only lines in the film which suggest anything about why Deltans are unusual and interesting.
Decker's computations. If we can do the above, suggest we lose Decker's line which opens Scene 122 and Ilia's following line: "Science officer's computations confirmed, sir," plus the look which passes between her and Decker at that moment. Both are a repeat of things we already know. Of course, if we cannot find a way to use the Deltan sex explanations in Scene 100, then we probably do need these lines and that look.
Decker and Ilia in corridor. The "sexually immature species" material would help clarify and hype this scene too.
Wormhole. Is it clear now that something (an asteroid) has been pulled into the wormhole directly ahead of us? Also, is it clear that destroying the asteroid is not the thing which got us out of the wormhole? Or maybe neither or these really matters since our pace and action are working so well for us here.
McCoy and Spock. McCoy has come off so well in the film that we should at least consider using his line: "Never look a gift Vulcan in the ears, Jim." It might be at least worth your having a look at it to see if it plays now.
Officer's Lounge. Do we need the final exchange between Kirk and McCoy in which they talk about whether or not Spock might betray them? It seems to me a slow end to the scene, although I prefer to go entirely on your judgment in this.
Entering Cloud. It seems to me that the slow pace of examining V'ger is set up and exaggerated by the fact that we begin with an even slower trip through the cloud. The inside cloud optical effects are our weakest. Our emphasis should be on our people as they wait tensely to discover what fearsome thing might be found at the heart of the cloud and the actual inside cloud shots can be trimmed drastically. Doing this also helps our characters to stand out much more strongly.
Seeing and examining V'ger. Todd and I have discussed this and I agree thoroughly with his points of view. Suggest we stay aware, however, that trimming the journey through the cloud may do more than we expect in preventing the examination of V'ger from seeming tedious and it may well be that we do not have to trim the V'ger examination as drastically as it may first have appeared. Also, I have suggested to Todd that you consider losing Sulu and Kirk's line about reducing magnification. It slows us and really does not sell the size of V'ger as we hoped it would.
V’ger's "Crew". Should we now consider using Uhura's line about "alien crew of tens of thousands" and McCoy's reply? It certainly helps make V'ger seem huge and helps keep alive the very dramatic possibility that our crew may find themselves dealing with an incredible vessel which may be filled with equally incredible aliens.
Enterprise entering V'ger. We need to clarify the fact that the Intruder's tractor beam is pulling us into their ship. A fairly common complaint has been the failure of the geography of what is happening. Are there some clarification lines from secondary characters which we have not used? Also, as discussed with Todd, there is dialogue from Decker which does clarify that V'ger is pulling us inside but the present cut has Decker saying this after they are inside. Suggest we strongly consider the possibility of pulling Decker's lines forward so that he says them as we are being pulled inside. My suggestion to Todd was that this line from Decker be used soon after Spock's line which says that we have been seized by a tractor beam.
Inside V'ger. Suggest we eliminate the business of Kirk using maneuvering thrusters once they are inside V'ger. We've already had enough maneuvering thruster business and it tends to seem slow and repetitive here. It really isn't clear that they are trying to get to a second compartment within V'ger, and so I think our action will play better and faster if we just assume our starship is trapped and we move our story briskly along to where they turn immediately to try to use their sensors to analyze this giant ship which has "swallowed" them.
General. It seems to me that any editorial revising we do should emphasize pace and character and de-emphasize opticals. Again, I suggest this not because our optical specialists have not done a fine job in the time allotted but rather because we may have been so worried about our opticals that we tended to be relieved when we did receive good optical footage and because of this we tended to use too much optical footage, and sometimes at the expense of small things which helped our characters and pace. I think this is the main thing a preview audience might have told us if we had had the opportunity to test our film in that manner.
GR [initials]
Gene Roddenberry
GR:SS
In the same scan there was the following letter:
July 22, 1980
Mr. Brick Price President
Brick Price Movie Miniatures
5115 Douglas Fir Drive
Calabasas, CA 91302
Dear Brick:
This letter is to commend you for the fine job you did in building the props for STAR TREK - THE MOTION PICTURE. You designed and built many models and props, such as the tricorders, phasers, wrist communicators and belt buckles, and your contribution in this area was of great value to us.
I regret that your company was not credited in the film credits, as these were prepared hastily. I regret the oversight and will make every effort to include your firm's name should the credits be redone in any future re-editing.
Again, my personal thanks for your valuable contribution to our film.
Sincerely.
Gene Roddenberry [signature]
Gene Roddenberry Producer, STAR TREK - THE MOTION PICTURE
GR:SS
Paramount Pictures presents
Mr. Brick Price President
Brick Price Movie Miniatures
5115 Douglas Fir Drive
Calabasas, CA 91302
Dear Brick:
This letter is to commend you for the fine job you did in building the props for STAR TREK - THE MOTION PICTURE. You designed and built many models and props, such as the tricorders, phasers, wrist communicators and belt buckles, and your contribution in this area was of great value to us.
I regret that your company was not credited in the film credits, as these were prepared hastily. I regret the oversight and will make every effort to include your firm's name should the credits be redone in any future re-editing.
Again, my personal thanks for your valuable contribution to our film.
Sincerely.
Gene Roddenberry [signature]
Gene Roddenberry Producer, STAR TREK - THE MOTION PICTURE
GR:SS
Paramount Pictures presents
A Gene Roddenberry Production - A Robert Wise Film
PARAMOUNT PICTURES CORPORATION. 5451 MARATHON ST., HOLLYWOOD, CALIF 90038
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Wow. I think, on the whole, Roddenberry really had a handle on the film's problems.
He keeps coming back to pacing and length, which remains the biggest problem. And when he urges material be added (such as fleshing out the secondary characters), he keeps stressing that the added time would be balanced by cuts elsewhere.
He keeps coming back to pacing and length, which remains the biggest problem. And when he urges material be added (such as fleshing out the secondary characters), he keeps stressing that the added time would be balanced by cuts elsewhere.
That memo is consistent with the sorts of memos he wrote in the 60s. As the film's pacing was slammed from the get-go almost three weeks before this memo, his commenting on it is unsurprising, but he probably was of these opinions before the film's release.
That letter was a mix of some good, pertinent points (although I love the journey through the cloud, it’s trippy perfection, I wouldn’t want it cut), as well as some pedantic ones, and his distress and repeated grievance about Ilia’s cut line about “sexually immature species” was…well, pure Gene.
It's "The Director's Edition" not "The Producer's Edition."
Perhaps you missed the part where I wrote "Some of these comments are in line with Wise's comments in the 1980 interview published in The Best of Starlog #5."
Wouldn't be the first time.
https://www.amazon.com/McLintock-Producers-Cut-John-Wayne/dp/B0845M7F6D
And based on Gene's notes, this film could greatly benefit from it.
But he's not wrong. Without that line, the Oath of Celibacy is meaningless and with all of the horny Sulu reactions taken out, the only thing special about Deltans is that they're totally bald.
Shit, I'm totally bald all that says is I 'm totally bald.
It’s Chekov’s reaction that kills me when Ilia steps onto the bridge: this completely inappropriate, pervy grin where he’s practically salivating.
Chekov has some really odd moments in this film, from that shot to his drama queen moment when he gets burned, gets ups theatrically and SCREAMS his lungs out (most over the top reaction to an exploding console in Trek history?)… to my personal favourite: “tooorrpedos ……aaaaaaaaaAARRRrrrrrrmmmmmmmeeeed!”
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