Timo's Hobbyist's Guide to the UFP Starfleet
- Thread starter thesonofodin
- Start date
I am going to include anything that saw service either in the UESF or the UFP SF at some point - even if it's only a tiny part of that ship class seeing such service, with the rest serving other organizations altogether (say, I do this with some FASA ship designs that in theory are civilian-commercial). As long as those Andorian ships have that USS in front of their names, I'm going to give them a chance eventually. Some cool ENT-Vulcan stuff I have already been able to include in parts II and III - it's a damn shame they retired their big ships before there was UFP SF. 
I'll have to come up with a string of excuses for why only the saucer-hulled, cigar-engined ships ultimately survive, of course. The novels tell why Vulcan bows out of the game, but it's not as if the canon or fanon ships of the late 22nd century retain major ENT-Andorian influences, either.
Timo Saloniemi
I'll have to come up with a string of excuses for why only the saucer-hulled, cigar-engined ships ultimately survive, of course. The novels tell why Vulcan bows out of the game, but it's not as if the canon or fanon ships of the late 22nd century retain major ENT-Andorian influences, either.
Timo Saloniemi
Christopher did at least give them credit for one thing in RotF: bridge design. He noticed that in Enterprise what we saw of Andorian bridges was much more like the TOS-style bridge than the NX-class bridge was, so he went ahead and made bridge layout a descendent of Andorian design lineage as a way of at least adding in some non-human design inspiration.
There actually was a brief passage in RotF as well going over part of why Earth-style engines and ship designs would end up beat out Vulcan and Andorian, let me see if I can dig that up. Might be something you could use as a jumping-off point or inspiration?
Edit: Here we go.
There actually was a brief passage in RotF as well going over part of why Earth-style engines and ship designs would end up beat out Vulcan and Andorian, let me see if I can dig that up. Might be something you could use as a jumping-off point or inspiration?
Edit: Here we go.
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Okay, Andorian ships added. Never mind that there are only two canon designs for those - I still chose to disregard one, or at least the association Memory Beta makes between it and a light cruiser class described in Christopher's novels. Luckily, John Eaves made a couple of nice sketches I could make use of.
So, Sevajien light cruiser (name from novels, Eaves sketch, for STO actually), Kumari battle cruiser (canon, name from novels), Taholsin destroyer (FASA name, pending a design, there's a placeholder there) and Thofsin cruiser (FASA name, Star Fleet Battles design) in Part I. Tanathooef frigate (FASA) and Ilthirin courier (novels) in Part II (using the second canonical Andorian design, because sizewise it's a bit too small to be a light cruiser and has other attributes making for a nice courier or escort). And then Yravas fightercraft (novels, Eaves sketch) in Part III. Plus something of an ongoing story, where I try to indicate that the Imperial Guard is but a tiny faction of the broader Andorian armed forces, that the Andorians are relatively new to the space business, and that there is more to their relationship with Earth than meets the antenna.
Vulcans next, I guess. I hate it when novels try to establish that the name of an individual canon ship is the class name for that design, but I accepted it for Kumari already... There are plenty of Vulcan types in Parts II and III already, so it's the big cruisers I have to insert.
And then Tellarites. Only one canon ship out there, the minimally modified Arkonian one. That one's gonna be difficult.
Timo Saloniemi
So, Sevajien light cruiser (name from novels, Eaves sketch, for STO actually), Kumari battle cruiser (canon, name from novels), Taholsin destroyer (FASA name, pending a design, there's a placeholder there) and Thofsin cruiser (FASA name, Star Fleet Battles design) in Part I. Tanathooef frigate (FASA) and Ilthirin courier (novels) in Part II (using the second canonical Andorian design, because sizewise it's a bit too small to be a light cruiser and has other attributes making for a nice courier or escort). And then Yravas fightercraft (novels, Eaves sketch) in Part III. Plus something of an ongoing story, where I try to indicate that the Imperial Guard is but a tiny faction of the broader Andorian armed forces, that the Andorians are relatively new to the space business, and that there is more to their relationship with Earth than meets the antenna.
Vulcans next, I guess. I hate it when novels try to establish that the name of an individual canon ship is the class name for that design, but I accepted it for Kumari already... There are plenty of Vulcan types in Parts II and III already, so it's the big cruisers I have to insert.
And then Tellarites. Only one canon ship out there, the minimally modified Arkonian one. That one's gonna be difficult.
Timo Saloniemi
Hmm, odd. Will fix now. Updates upcoming at uncertain future date; there's a nice selection of Vulcan designs and ship class names available but I'm not yet quite decided on how to fit those together.
What I really want to do is yank out all the noncanon warp engine designations and work out a new system around the canon and established-fanon ones. And read up on the early-UFP-Starfleet events in recent novels to streamline that part of the timeline.
Timo Saloniemi
What I really want to do is yank out all the noncanon warp engine designations and work out a new system around the canon and established-fanon ones. And read up on the early-UFP-Starfleet events in recent novels to streamline that part of the timeline.
Timo Saloniemi
Weird. I can't make them not show up there, even if I empty my buffers and all. And I can't figure out why Ib ought to be special, as I reprinted all of them into pdfs today and reuploaded the whole trio. Perhaps the problem will go away if I go to sleep and wish real hard...?
I'll be back at it tomorrow.
Timo Saloniemi
I'll be back at it tomorrow.
Timo Saloniemi
Timo, here's a new specs page on USS Mughi, which you have turned into the Ural class (I think?)...found it on Facebook but I don't know if you're on FB or not, but imagine you would still be able to access it. Mughi is 318.5m long x 135.6m wide x 81.5m tall.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10208031140166200&set=gm.1295487227206344&type=3&theater
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10208031140166200&set=gm.1295487227206344&type=3&theater
I guess its that time of year again to ask the question: Timo, any updates ?
Moreover, how will the addition of the DSC era shake this oeuvre d'art to its core, if at all? 
Mark
Mark
'Tis the season to despair, verily. I have written an all-new treatise on how the Horizon class starts out as a frontline combat cruiser and then diversifies into a couple of shuttlecarrier designs until it becomes a has-been that is only good for spore drive experimentation. It starts out with a ship that has a cigarlike secondary hull that will plausibly evolve into the Constitution one, plus enough greeblies to launch the triangular secondary hull theme, based on this art from a familiar and trusted source:
Beyond that, I'm just dumping the Axanar registries and ships and trying to fit the DSC ones in instead, but I've not made much headway there. Not that I'd find them objectionable in any way, it's just a chore...
This is just about the first time in canon that I have to accept a single class spread out across different NCC ranges in the 23rd century. In the 24th, there's plenty of room to apply "batches" and "remakes" and whatnot, but not in the 23rd. Oh, well - I already did it once with the LUG cruiser registries, postulating a common design produced in alternating mission-customized batches, and I might try something like that here, too.
Let's see if the "holidays" provide enough free hours for some progress.
Timo Saloniemi
Beyond that, I'm just dumping the Axanar registries and ships and trying to fit the DSC ones in instead, but I've not made much headway there. Not that I'd find them objectionable in any way, it's just a chore...
This is just about the first time in canon that I have to accept a single class spread out across different NCC ranges in the 23rd century. In the 24th, there's plenty of room to apply "batches" and "remakes" and whatnot, but not in the 23rd. Oh, well - I already did it once with the LUG cruiser registries, postulating a common design produced in alternating mission-customized batches, and I might try something like that here, too.
Let's see if the "holidays" provide enough free hours for some progress.
Timo Saloniemi
Timo is there any chance that we'll see your takes on the JJverse ships at all, I'd be very interested in seeing your own view of them, much like Crazy Eddie's version (which I am fervently waiting for an update on, as much as this one in fact)
I've only seen the pilot episode of Discovery, but it seems to me like it should be taking place in some kind of alternate history like the Kelvinverse. Are you trying to shoehorn Discovery into the Hobbyist's Guide like it is a precursor to TOS, or keeping it an alternate timeline?
Also, have you taken the Onimaru and Phalanx ships from the Ships of The Line calendars and placed them in the Guide?
Finally, sent you a message containing something I thought you'd appreciate.
Also, have you taken the Onimaru and Phalanx ships from the Ships of The Line calendars and placed them in the Guide?
Finally, sent you a message containing something I thought you'd appreciate.
Whoops, a late reply, sorry...
I will very much try and shoehorn every single bit of DSC, including the usual obscure background details and irrelevant little sidekick starships, into the continuity, even if and when it means ousting some noncanon stuff (and as said, Axanar is the first to go).
But I already tried to make some of the JJVerse ships part of the broader context - the one looking like the Proxima battleship is the Proxima and won't go away even when I dump her Axanar alter ego, say. I'll make the effort to keep all these ships in the Guide because all of them were put on screen by TPTB; it's just the Axanar attempt at blending them in that I'll drop, with the now-conflicting registries and all.
Indeed, the new stuff from DSC makes it all the easier, because we now can see that there are plenty of ships that big in Starfleet in the 2250s, and can thus well assume that there were ships that big in the pre-2233 environment, too. I don't have to pretend Kirk's ship is the biggest one of her day, not when the season finale of DSC graphically shows that the ship when flown by Pike was indeed smaller than the current hero ship (and most the sidekick ships) but no less famous for that.
The Onimaru might yet make it into the Guide, even though it's a relatively modern ship and might go past my self-imposed time brackets of stopping at ST:Nemesis or thereabouts. The Phalanx looks older design-wise and is going to be included.
I like the idea of tactically paired starships (and the Diane Duane reference you slipped in!)... Perhaps the Guide could feature extra entries like that one. Much appreciated!
Timo Saloniemi
I will very much try and shoehorn every single bit of DSC, including the usual obscure background details and irrelevant little sidekick starships, into the continuity, even if and when it means ousting some noncanon stuff (and as said, Axanar is the first to go).
But I already tried to make some of the JJVerse ships part of the broader context - the one looking like the Proxima battleship is the Proxima and won't go away even when I dump her Axanar alter ego, say. I'll make the effort to keep all these ships in the Guide because all of them were put on screen by TPTB; it's just the Axanar attempt at blending them in that I'll drop, with the now-conflicting registries and all.
Indeed, the new stuff from DSC makes it all the easier, because we now can see that there are plenty of ships that big in Starfleet in the 2250s, and can thus well assume that there were ships that big in the pre-2233 environment, too. I don't have to pretend Kirk's ship is the biggest one of her day, not when the season finale of DSC graphically shows that the ship when flown by Pike was indeed smaller than the current hero ship (and most the sidekick ships) but no less famous for that.
The Onimaru might yet make it into the Guide, even though it's a relatively modern ship and might go past my self-imposed time brackets of stopping at ST:Nemesis or thereabouts. The Phalanx looks older design-wise and is going to be included.
I like the idea of tactically paired starships (and the Diane Duane reference you slipped in!)... Perhaps the Guide could feature extra entries like that one. Much appreciated!
Timo Saloniemi
As someone basically condemned to only be able to view this guide on Google Drive, I am unable to view images in these documents... if the images actually do exist. That pretty much leaves me unable to visualize some of the ships described. Is there a place to go to see those designs?
Hey Timo, I've been reading over these guides with great interest and I'm looking forward to what you have to say on the origins and fate of the Crossfield class. Will there be an update in the near future?
