The WB/DC Cinematic Universe Thread

[M.A.C.O.]

EIC Dan Diddio says Convergence is about closure and heroism.

http://www.newsarama.com/22883-dc-comics-dan-didio-youll-never-find-a-better-expression-of-heroism-than-convergence.html


Recall Post-Crisis DCU ended with Flashpoint and then New 52 was launched. I think it was the right decision given the decisions for the DC universe that started back in 2004 with Identity Crisis. Identity Crisis was the jumping off point for the DCU's turn from 2004-2011. With several storylines being spun out of it.


What happened in 2004, is the TPTB/TPTW decided to blend continuities. Post-COIE (1986-2004) would remain canon but the powers at DC wanted to make certain Silver Age + Bronze Age stories canon as well. This is a decision I think was more for the writers than it was for the readers. It added stories that were deemed non-canon back in to the fabric of the DCU and made this overly complicated and convoluted.


Just look at the event comics of DC starting n 2004
Identity Crisis
Through Identity Crisis, the JLA stories from the 1970's -1985 were all back in continuity.

The lead ups to Infinite Crisis:
Project OMAC
Villains United
Rann Thanagar War
Day of Vengeance
Infinite Crisis

Infinite Crisis retconned WW as a founding member of the JLA, since Post Crisis she wasn't. She didn't join the JLA till the 1996 after Justice League International fizzled out. Superman's history as a Superboy was restored. As were certain adventures he had with the LOSH. Although the 1994 and 2004 reboots of the Legion remained canon since both Superboy (Conner) and Supergirl had been members of each team at one time. The Multiverse was restored. Batman's history was changed slightly with regards to his parents murder.

It's just a big mess.


Post Infinite Crisis
52
Sinestro Corps War
Death of the New Gods
Countdown to Final Crisis
Final Crisis, Legion of 3 World
Black Night
Brightest Day
The New Krypton saga (Coming of Atlas, Brainaic, New Krypton 1-4, Last Stand of New Krypton, Codename Patriot, Supergirl's titles, Mon-el: Superman, War of the Supermen)
Batman RIP, Battle for the Cape and Cowl, New Batman and Robin
Flash Rebirth, Flashpoint


So DC had a lot of events going on in that time frame. I think their creative universe got so big, that it would've eventually collapsed under it's own weight.


Keep in mind individual titles for each character were running at the same time as all these big stories and retconning events.


If a person wanted to jump on board and read Teen Titans for example, would they know where to start? The 1996 JLA was the first time since COIE that the original members of the JLA (Supes, Bats, WW, MM, GL, Flash and Aquaman) were all back on the team togethr, BUT due to retcons the Silver Age JLA stories were also canon to the then current DCU. And the writers of the JL books post Identity Crisis would make reference to those old tales. Tales anyone not born or old enough to read at the time would never have read.


It's enough to confuse a person who doesn't keep up meticulously with comic book universes. DC starting over with New 52 was the smart thing to do. Since it allowed new readers to jump on the train and not have to worry about decades of continuity.

 

[theenglish]

EIC Dan Diddio says Convergence is about closure and heroism.

http://www.newsarama.com/22883-dc-c...r-expression-of-heroism-than-convergence.html


Recall Post-Crisis DCU ended with Flashpoint and then New 52 was launched. I think it was the right decision given the decisions for the DC universe that started back in 2004 with Identity Crisis. Identity Crisis was the jumping off point for the DCU's turn from 2004-2011. With several storylines being spun out of it.


What happened in 2004, is the TPTB/TPTW decided to blend continuities. Post-COIE (1986-2004) would remain canon but the powers at DC wanted to make certain Silver Age + Bronze Age stories canon as well. This is a decision I think was more for the writers than it was for the readers. It added stories that were deemed non-canon back in to the fabric of the DCU and made this overly complicated and convoluted.


Just look at the event comics of DC starting n 2004
Identity Crisis
Through Identity Crisis, the JLA stories from the 1970's -1985 were all back in continuity.

The lead ups to Infinite Crisis:
Project OMAC
Villains United
Rann Thanagar War
Day of Vengeance
Infinite Crisis

Infinite Crisis retconned WW as a founding member of the JLA, since Post Crisis she wasn't. She didn't join the JLA till the 1996 after Justice League International fizzled out. Superman's history as a Superboy was restored. As were certain adventures he had with the LOSH. Although the 1994 and 2004 reboots of the Legion remained canon since both Superboy (Conner) and Supergirl had been members of each team at one time. The Multiverse was restored. Batman's history was changed slightly with regards to his parents murder.

It's just a big mess.


Post Infinite Crisis
52
Sinestro Corps War
Death of the New Gods
Countdown to Final Crisis
Final Crisis, Legion of 3 World
Black Night
Brightest Day
The New Krypton saga (Coming of Atlas, Brainaic, New Krypton 1-4, Last Stand of New Krypton, Codename Patriot, Supergirl's titles, Mon-el: Superman, War of the Supermen)
Batman RIP, Battle for the Cape and Cowl, New Batman and Robin
Flash Rebirth, Flashpoint


So DC had a lot of events going on in that time frame. I think their creative universe got so big, that it would've eventually collapsed under it's own weight.


Keep in mind individual titles for each character were running at the same time as all these big stories and retconning events.


If a person wanted to jump on board and read Teen Titans for example, would they know where to start? The 1996 JLA was the first time since COIE that the original members of the JLA (Supes, Bats, WW, MM, GL, Flash and Aquaman) were all back on the team togethr, BUT due to retcons the Silver Age JLA stories were also canon to the then current DCU. And the writers of the JL books post Identity Crisis would make reference to those old tales. Tales anyone not born or old enough to read at the time would never have read.


It's enough to confuse a person who doesn't keep up meticulously with comic book universes. DC starting over with New 52 was the smart thing to do. Since it allowed new readers to jump on the train and not have to worry about decades of continuity.

That's an interesting post. I didn't think before how IC allowed Morrison to bring back all the old Batman stories and pave the way for Batman Inc.

 

[DWF]

Anyway, I'm pleased to hear that their candidates for Waller are rumored to include Oprah Winfrey and Viola Davis (whom I've thought of as a good candidate for Waller). They aren't anywhere near the character's original girth, but at least they aren't thinking in terms of the young, supermodel-skinny Waller of The New 52 and Arrow.

John Byrne had Neil Carter in mind when he first drew Waller, I expect the next Waller to be both younger and smaller that what was intended originally.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

Leto and Affleck
Joker/Batman

 

[Captaindemotion]

^ I so want a "like" button for that post.

 

[bychance]

Waller is "thin" in the new 52 because she was a super-agent.

More likely that they made her a super-agent because they wanted an excuse for her to be thin and sexy. They're getting a little better lately, but at the start, the New 52 was all about pandering to the male gaze.

But there's characters like Vixen for that though?

Its unfortunate that Waller is thin on Arrow, but the actress playing her is great.

Hm. I find her rather bland myself.

Well between her, Pam Grier and Angela Bassett, I find Cynthia Addai Robinson by far the best live action Amanda Waller. We'll see how the new Suicide Squad movie actor will do in time.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

Viola Davis is reportedly been cast as Amanda Waller. Looks like New 52 version of Waller has won out over Post Crisis version.

http://comicbook.com/2014/12/17/viola-davis-reportedly-cast-as-amanda-waller-in-suicide-squad/


New 52 Waller isn't all bad (ok she is "bad") though.

 

[Christopher]

Viola Davis is reportedly been cast as Amanda Waller. Looks like New 52 version of Waller has won out over Post Crisis version.

I wouldn't say that. Viola Davis may not be nearly as heavyset as the classic Waller, but she's certainly not the skinny supermodel type of the New 52/Arrow version of Waller. She's somewhere in between.

And she's a terrific choice for the role, very strong, tough, and commanding, more than capable of playing a Waller who can hold her own against CCH Pounder's performance in animation -- which is more than I can say for Pam Grier, Angela Bassett, or Cynthia Addai-Robinson. She's exactly who I wanted them to cast.

 

[Ovation]

Viola Davis is outstanding. Any project with her in the cast is automatically made better.

 

[Reverend]

Viola Davis is reportedly been cast as Amanda Waller. Looks like New 52 version of Waller has won out over Post Crisis version.

I wouldn't say that. Viola Davis may not be nearly as heavyset as the classic Waller, but she's certainly not the skinny supermodel type of the New 52/Arrow version of Waller. She's somewhere in between.

And she's a terrific choice for the role, very strong, tough, and commanding, more than capable of playing a Waller who can hold her own against CCH Pounder's performance in animation -- which is more than I can say for Pam Grier, Angela Bassett, or Cynthia Addai-Robinson. She's exactly who I wanted them to cast.

It's subjective, but personally I tend to think C.C.H. Pounder blows them all out of the water. Admittedly, a lot of that may have been as much to do with the writing as the performance.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

Viola Davis is reportedly been cast as Amanda Waller. Looks like New 52 version of Waller has won out over Post Crisis version.

http://comicbook.com/2014/12/17/viola-davis-reportedly-cast-as-amanda-waller-in-suicide-squad/


New 52 Waller isn't all bad (ok she is "bad") though.

that's a pretty violent scene !

 

[bychance]

Viola Davis is reportedly been cast as Amanda Waller. Looks like New 52 version of Waller has won out over Post Crisis version.

http://comicbook.com/2014/12/17/viola-davis-reportedly-cast-as-amanda-waller-in-suicide-squad/


New 52 Waller isn't all bad (ok she is "bad") though.

I wonder if they would do a scene like that on Arrow? I mean, actually showing the head blow off.

 

[CorporalClegg]

I wonder if they would do a scene like that on Arrow? I mean, actually showing the head blow off.

Not on broadcast television.

The best they could do is something similar to what The Blacklist did in the fall finale. And even that came dangerously close to the out of bounds.

 

[theenglish]

I wonder if they would do a scene like that on Arrow? I mean, actually showing the head blow off.

Not on broadcast television.

The best they could do is something similar to what The Blacklist did in the fall finale. And even that came dangerously close to the out of bounds.

There are plenty of decapitation scenes on Supernatural.

 

[Masiral]

I wonder if they would do a scene like that on Arrow? I mean, actually showing the head blow off.

Not on broadcast television.

The best they could do is something similar to what The Blacklist did in the fall finale. And even that came dangerously close to the out of bounds.

There are plenty of decapitation scenes on Supernatural.

I think Revolution had quite a few as well.

 

[theenglish]

Not on broadcast television.

The best they could do is something similar to what The Blacklist did in the fall finale. And even that came dangerously close to the out of bounds.

There are plenty of decapitation scenes on Supernatural.

I think Revolution had quite a few as well.

I'm not familiar with much of Revolution, but I think the producers could certainly show a beheading if they wished. It is more a matter of what kind of audience they wish to have. Even though there have been some intense fight scenes in the show it really does seem to be geared toward more of a PG-13 audience.

 

[Captaindemotion]

That last scene in the current season of Arrow was pretty grisly.

 

[theenglish]

That last scene in the current season of Arrow was pretty grisly.

Not really, by current standards though.

 

[Captaindemotion]

^ Maybe not compared to cable (Walking Dead etc) but I thought it was graphic enough for a network show.

 

[bychance]

I recall there was a decapitation in The Vampire Diaries, ironically (coincidentally?) to a character played by Addai-Robinson, but the special effects for it was so cartoonish it didn't seem that violent.