The Unexplored Guinan/Q Backstory

[SantaTom]

When we first have Guinan and Q meet in "Q Who?," we get hints of an interesting backstory between them. They know each other and have some sort of history together, it is implied that Guinan has some method of defending herself against Q, and Q even suggests that she previously went by a different name.

However, pretty much all of that was never followed up on, and other writers/producers took the characters, particularly Guinan, in a different direction with regards to backstory.

Does anyone have any idea, though, what Maurice Hurley's original ideas were with regards to Guinan and her backstory with Q when he wrote that episode?

 

[Mott the barber]

It was never followed up on in TNG proper. There may have been some allusions to it in Picard S2 but to be honest I've pretty much blocked that entire season of that show out of my mind. It was pretty awful.

 

[AtheistAntony]

I suspect it was borne more of necessity than a back story.

When Whoopi joined the show they needed to find scenes for her. Melinda Snodgrass for example said she had Measure of a Man then needed to add a Whoopi scene.

I suspect they needed to add her in, and to get her into what would then be Borg bit it was a bridge between the two and allowed her to do the necessary exposition.

Then the lack of followup is kind of proof that there wasn't a strong will to tell that story.

That said with modern Trek trying to keep writing a bit of pen into the same bit of paper until it wears a hole and to link up everything... perhaps a bit of mystery is good in Trek lore.

 

[Mojochi]

I don't put much stock in the defensive posture of a being who's species was assimilated by the Borg, trapped in the Nexus, & can barely tell when they've been shifted to an altered timeline, to defend herself in any substantial way from Q powers. I think the gesture was merely to show she just had her dander up, like a spooked cat.

Q probably finds her troublesome more on a personal level, due to her extensive knowledge, history & familiarity with Q wrongdoings. She represents rather bad PR for him, especially given her more superhuman perceptual abilities.

If anyone Picard knows could give the clearest account of WTF the Q are all about, it's probably her. He objects to her, because she's too damn smart, not too powerful imho. She's an "imp" because her intelligence spoils his fun

 

[Yistaan]

I don't put much stock in the defensive posture of a being who's species was assimilated by the Borg, or can barely tell when they've been shifted to an altered timeline, to defend herself in any substantial way from Q powers. I think the gesture was merely to show she just had her dander up, like a spooked cat.

Q probably finds her troublesome more on a personal level, due to her extensive knowledge, history & familiarity with Q wrongdoings. She represents rather bad PR for him, especially given her more superhuman perceptual abilities.

If anyone Picard knows could give the clearest account of WTF the Q are all about, it's probably her. He objects to her, because she's too damn smart, not too powerful imho. She's an "imp" because her intelligence spoils his fun

The El-Aurians were assimilated by the Borg but apparently per Picard they were powerful enough to fight the Q to a truce. Yeah I know it doesn't make sense. Maybe the Q faked weakness knowing the El-Aurians would all be assimilated later anyway

 

[AtheistAntony]

The El-Aurians were assimilated by the Borg but apparently per Picard they were powerful enough to fight the Q to a truce. Yeah I know it doesn't make sense. Maybe the Q faked weakness knowing the El-Aurians would all be assimilated later anyway

I was thinking where on earth was this nonsense then I re-read your message. Picard. QED. (Nonsense as it a daft idea, not what you said).

 

[Mojochi]

per Picard

Guinan seems legitimately helpless about her state in Rascals, & seems to have barely survived Time's Arrow, but for Jean-Luc. I just don't read anything remotely equalling Q power there, unless she's the one hiding the totality of her nature, which, in a way, would make her suspicious.

Edit: oh yeah... And then there's Tolian Soran, needing to technologically destroy a star to course correct the nexus to a spot he can jump back in, just so he can have some VR good times with the dead fam.

Yeah... El-Aurian abilities are crap lol. Geez, even Wesley, with his traveler BS, has more going on for him

 

[Yistaan]

Guinan seems legitimately helpless about her state in Rascals, & seems to have barely survived Time's Arrow, but for Jean-Luc. I just don't read anything remotely equalling Q power there, unless she's the one hiding the totality of her nature, which, in a way, would make her suspicious.

Edit: oh yeah... And then there's Tolian Soran, needing to technologically destroy a star to course correct the nexus to a spot he can jump back in, just so he can have some VR good times with the dead fam.

Yeah... El-Aurian abilities are crap lol. Geez, even Wesley, with his traveler BS, has more going on for him

To be fair, the war was said to be a "cold war" and we also know the Q seemingly rarely go all "Kevin Uxbridge" on any person or species. If you take the entirety of Q's appearances in Trek as a cold war between the Continuum and humanity, then humanity could arguably have been said to have won, assuming that battling the Q is more akin to a battle of morals or battle of principles, rather than a straight up physical fight which again would just have the Q going "Kevin Uxbridge" on their opponents.

 

[drt]

Does anyone have any idea, though, what Maurice Hurley's original ideas were with regards to Guinan and her backstory with Q when he wrote that episode?

It doesn't matter how weak they made post "Q Who" Guinan, but it seems that initially the idea was she was supposed to be a much more powerful being, most likely like Kevin Uxbridge, slumming it as a regular human.

 

[Mojochi]

To be fair, the war was said to be a "cold war" and we also know the Q seemingly rarely go all "Kevin Uxbridge" on any person or species. If you take the entirety of Q's appearances in Trek as a cold war between the Continuum and humanity, then humanity could arguably have been said to have won, assuming that battling the Q is more akin to a battle of morals or battle of principles, rather than a straight up physical fight which again would just have the Q going "Kevin Uxbridge" on their opponents.

I guess a dispute that exists between any race & the Q, that's essentially ideological, like the one they seemed to have with humanity during TNG, could be worded as a cold war, but it's a real stretch of the term, if the idea of it ever turning hot just means the obliteration of whoever the unfortunate party happens to be, & not actual warring, or even an escalation that could imminently lead to it.

"Truce" seems an absurd euphemism of a term to apply to that, the Q relenting on their threat to "Uxbridge" your species lol. However, judging by Guinan & Q's interaction, about their past "dealings" (which is a much better word, because a deal might've been struck) this arrangement is hardly on the most solid of terms anyhow

Plus, in order to even reach such a deal, I have to imagine every case must involve some manner of the Q bestowing an amount of Q powers upon that disputed race, like they have done with Picard & Riker, with the ultimatum being that they prove themselves worthy of continued existence, or be eradicated, which in humanity's case, doesn't even come with the promise of forbearance from future interference, that a "truce" might carry.

I still don't feel like any of that is fair to call truces, as in armistices, or cessation of mutual hostilities... but if I'm being kind to the canon, it could be a way to explain it, that they used really janky language, meant to downplay the menace of their behavior.

 

[ananta]

The initial setup was far, far more interesting than anything they explored in retrospect. The same is true for quite a bit of TNG to the be fair. I wish Hurley had gotten to tell what was clearly the seed of a more interesting story. But I guess they didn’t want to make Guinan too important as Whoopi was just there to read the odd extra line a few times a season. There was never really going to be a proper episode about her was there?

As for Picard S2. Frankly, nothing in that season makes a whit of sense to me, so I disregard it all. To me, it’s a different universe much less series.

I think the basic contradiction will always be there. Ultimately, the writers just chickened out.