The Most Disliked Episode of STAR TREK - Final Round...

Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by Farscape One, Jul 18, 2019.

  1. Cutie McWhiskers

    Cutie McWhiskers Commodore Commodore

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    Scary, isn't it...

    And in another time and place, ATCSL wouldn't even be given a second thought. Will the same happen with current shows? I'm not sure. There were shows many of us never cared for 25 years ago that, upon an attempt to revisit to see if the storyline may have had potential, don't look any better at best. And the few where there's some glimmer of potential but I highly doubt many would say the same for "Joe Millionaire", or "Joe's Apartment" for that matter... most television is simply ephemeral as a de facto, rarely is anything made by design for such longevity or such a robust fanbase as such. "Babylon 5" and its season 4/5 fiasco sadly proves that and the story they wanted to tell had to be rushed and makeshift solution cobbled up after it was renewed after cancellation...
     
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  2. Cutie McWhiskers

    Cutie McWhiskers Commodore Commodore

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    No argument here! Not just because that gave the show enough episodes to be syndicated, which was when ratings standards changed and they found out the show already had been popular and they never really knew it. :o

    It's still sad they removed 2 episodes from season 3 (from 26 to 24) as there could have been 81 and even as some of season 3 has some awful stories, there is both nostalgia and gratitude of "Glad they got to make this many!" Heck, I might even try "The Alternative Factor" again and for all of season 3's episodes I can't really place any of those lower on the list. Maybe I'll be proven wrong in that rewatch...
     
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  3. Phaser Two

    Phaser Two Commodore Premium Member

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    ATCSL is not that bad of an episode for me. It's scary and unsettling. Take out the honks+unfortunate gestures and Shatner's two freakouts (or tone them down) and it probably becomes a good episode. Belli being bad is a trope I'd like to see retired, too. He was actually fairly effective. They did need another pass at his costume. Scotty threatening to kill Kirk and Spock bothered me too.

    If you removed the torture scenes from Plato it would be a good episode as well; the dialogue is mostly outstanding and Kirk's interactions with Alexander are excellent and moving.
     
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  4. Henoch

    Henoch Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    To me, Season 3 pushed the censorship standards more than in the previous two years, then again, I think most TV shows in the late 60's were doing the same. "Laugh-In" was a good example, which my parents (thus me) actually watched.
     
  5. Discofan

    Discofan Vice Admiral Commodore

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    ATCSL deserves to win the trophy of worse ep. in an ST series ever. It's even worse than the worst of ENT, and that's saying something.
     
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  6. Spock's Barber

    Spock's Barber Commodore Commodore

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    Just think, Fred Freiberger probably rejected some other stories because they were worse than ATCSL. :eek:
     
  7. Marsden

    Marsden Commodore Commodore

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    Threshold would like to speak to you.
     
  8. Farscape One

    Farscape One Commodore Commodore

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    "THESE ARE THE VOYAGES..."

    Worst. Ever.
     
  9. Phaser Two

    Phaser Two Commodore Premium Member

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    Seriously. ATCSL has so much strong content and good ideas that it just doesn't deserve the hyperbolic attacks that it receives. Oh, well.

    Also not good, and kind of sad. They were starting to figure things out in the last season.
     
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  10. Discofan

    Discofan Vice Admiral Commodore

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    ...Is still below the threshold of awfulness reached by ATCSL.
     
  11. Marsden

    Marsden Commodore Commodore

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    Well, there's no accounting for taste.

    But, I will give you this, ATCSL was a bad episode in a great show, Threshold was a terrible episode in a bad show, so there's that.
     
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  12. Admiral2

    Admiral2 Admiral Admiral

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    I was thinking something similar about "Catspaw"...
     
  13. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Commodore Commodore

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    I agree with you except about Belli. I used to wonder why I disliked this episode but realised it was because of Belli. When I found out he was not an actor it all made sense..Its like young Anakin in Star Wars 1. I just can't get over it.
     
  14. BigDaveX

    BigDaveX Captain Captain

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    The funny thing is, I think Belli actually could have given a decent performance if he'd had a bit more coaching for the role and if they'd written Gorgan as more of a hammy, over-the-top villain, as he actually doesn't do too bad of a job when he's ranting at Kirk and the kids towards the very end of the episode. Instead, they tried to play him as a creepy and understated villain, which really didn't work.
     
  15. Henoch

    Henoch Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    Remember, Gorgan was a ghostly special effect, which means Belli was never on set for any of the scenes to interact with the other actors. His segments were filmed at a different time on blue screen with no sets or other actors present. It was the director's job to set the scene for Belli to get the best out of him. I see equal "blame" for them, probably along with third season pressures at play.
     
  16. Phaser Two

    Phaser Two Commodore Premium Member

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    See . . . for me it did work. As a kid I found him quite scary and I still think he's unsettling. The echo effect they put over his voice helped with that, and his faceoff with Kirk was, I thought, pretty good. Also, his delivery - which isn't his fault, as he wasn't an actor by trade, and probably would have improved considerably over time, even just a few days - actually makes him seem more alien.
     
  17. johnnybear

    johnnybear Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Although it is not the best of episodes, I still do not see that ATCSL is SO bad!!! It does not make me cringe when I've watched it unlike another episode that i'm quoted on here as heavily disliking! :wtf: Is it the children actors that people dislike? I don't find them bad at all. Gorgon the marauder? No, he was not brilliant but satisfactory. It's only that later on we find out he was not really an actor but a highly paid lawyer, so theatrics were not out of his domain! The scenes where the kids see their parents dead were very sad and the only way Kirk could know Gorgon's name is for he to have read the information that Spock supplied about Epsilon Indi!
    JB
     
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  18. Henoch

    Henoch Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    This Epsilon Indi?
     
  19. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Commodore Commodore

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    The children actors were average at best but probably didn't have the best script or direction. I generally find child actors to be awful. The ones in Miri were good because in fact they were adults or almost.

    The kids in TNG weren't very good either (lets not talk about the adults). I didn't mind the child actors in VOY though.

    But Belli was the worst. I honestly could have acted better. He sounded like he was reading it off a queue card with no rehearsal. Its a wonder he ever won a case in court with acting like that. He's sp cringey that he takes me out of it .

    But is not just the guest stars for me, Its Kirk freaking out, the knives, the mirror, the racism, the ice cream.
     
  20. BigDaveX

    BigDaveX Captain Captain

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    Belli was on-set for at least some of his scenes. The major problem was that the combination of the sparkly effect that was superimposed over him, plus wearing an outfit that covered up just about his entire body, meant that Belli had to do all his acting with his face and voice. That's actually quite a hard thing to do even for a more experienced actor, so it's no surprise at all that a novice like Belli failed catastrophically.