It's really simple: Bennett created something that was true to Star Trek. Berman and the latter-day Roddenberry did not.
The Legacy of Harve Bennett?
- Thread starter TiberiusK
- Start date
This is true. Berman's job was overseeing certain areas of TV development. He was put on to TNG as a producer in order to help actually get the show on the air on time and on budget.
Bennett was the producer of only one bomb in the franchise. Other than that, Treks 2 - 4 were very successful (profit based on box office vs budget - each of those Trek films made money).
Harve Bennett gets almost as much respect as Fred Frieberger. Bennett produced films which were faithful to the spirit of Trek. He's a smart guy and was rpectful to the material. True, these films didn;t continually break new ground, but they did satisfactorally give us new Star Trek when we wanted it most.
Roddenbery would have given anyone in Bennett's position grief.
Harve Bennett gets almost as much respect as Fred Frieberger. Bennett produced films which were faithful to the spirit of Trek. He's a smart guy and was rpectful to the material. True, these films didn;t continually break new ground, but they did satisfactorally give us new Star Trek when we wanted it most.
Roddenbery would have given anyone in Bennett's position grief.
I am going to focus on tis movies he produced, wrote i feel he did okey job nothing more. TWOK is one off the best Star Trek movie behind TMP. TVH was funny but not really Star Trek movie persay, TSFS and TFF were poor.
Only problem he was tv producer and his movies reflect that also i never liked Horatio Hornblower navy look that much but that is Nicolas Myer fault then his. So as i said okey job
Only problem he was tv producer and his movies reflect that also i never liked Horatio Hornblower navy look that much but that is Nicolas Myer fault then his. So as i said okey job
TheBrew said:
STII was true to Star Trek but TNG wasn't?
Yep, completely ridiculous.
Bennett turned Trek into schlock pulp sci fi - catered to the masses with every Trek and sci fi cliche he could think of. Roddenberry, as seen in TMP, wanted to take Trek in a different direction and make it serious sci fi. Did Bennett make money? Yea, catering to the lowest common denominator usually does. Did he keep Trek going? Probably, but I would have rather seen it die with the noble albeit flawed TMP rather then the comic book like pop culture joke it became.
Is something wrong with scifi being entertaining? These are movies. You eat popcorn. You don't need to bring your Feuerbach and Nietzsche for reference guides.
Don't get me wrong. I think episodic Trek is at its best when it grapples with serious issues, but the movies, for the most part, don't have to do that.
I don't see a very complex theme in TMP either, just the same rehashed Roddenberry script of something seeking its creator. Shelley's Frankenstein is more complex than TMP in that regard.
TheBrew said:
STII was true to Star Trek but TNG wasn't?
That's correct, at least by season 3, when they ran out of Phase II stuff to recycle.
Paramount blamed Roddenberry for going overbudget on STTMP even though they threw in the costs of the aborted Phase II series into the $ figure...a decision to go to the big screen instead of tv that was Paramount's not Roddenberry's.
ST fans turned out to watch STTMP over and over again. Harve
Bennett was brought in to make another movie with a tighter budget to see whether a better profit could be made. Harve had the foresight to screen all the episodes to bring himself up to speed on what made ST tick and keep the sfx in their proper place. He also made the wise decision to tempt Leonard Nimoy with a death scene in hopes of having his character's contribution to the film significant enough for Mr. Nimoy to want to play again. He also had the foresight to film the "Remember" scene in order to have an out for bringing Spock back if Nimoy wanted to go that route. ST 2 was a success, leading to 3 and finally 4 where the mainstream audience was finally brought into attending the movie. This made Trek popular enough to warrant trying another tv series in the form of TNG.
TNG gave Roddenberry the forum to make Trek his way again (at least for the 1st season). Not a bad legacy for Bennett.
ST fans turned out to watch STTMP over and over again. Harve
Bennett was brought in to make another movie with a tighter budget to see whether a better profit could be made. Harve had the foresight to screen all the episodes to bring himself up to speed on what made ST tick and keep the sfx in their proper place. He also made the wise decision to tempt Leonard Nimoy with a death scene in hopes of having his character's contribution to the film significant enough for Mr. Nimoy to want to play again. He also had the foresight to film the "Remember" scene in order to have an out for bringing Spock back if Nimoy wanted to go that route. ST 2 was a success, leading to 3 and finally 4 where the mainstream audience was finally brought into attending the movie. This made Trek popular enough to warrant trying another tv series in the form of TNG.
TNG gave Roddenberry the forum to make Trek his way again (at least for the 1st season). Not a bad legacy for Bennett.
KeepOnTrekking said:
Paramount blamed Roddenberry for going overbudget on STTMP even though they threw in the costs of the aborted Phase II series into the $ figure...a decision to go to the big screen instead of tv that was Paramount's not Roddenberry's.
ST fans turned out to watch STTMP over and over again. Harve
Bennett was brought in to make another movie with a tighter budget to see whether a better profit could be made. Harve had the foresight to screen all the episodes to bring himself up to speed on what made ST tick and keep the sfx in their proper place. He also made the wise decision to tempt Leonard Nimoy with a death scene in hopes of having his character's contribution to the film significant enough for Mr. Nimoy to want to play again. He also had the foresight to film the "Remember" scene in order to have an out for bringing Spock back if Nimoy wanted to go that route. ST 2 was a success, leading to 3 and finally 4 where the mainstream audience was finally brought into attending the movie. This made Trek popular enough to warrant trying another tv series in the form of TNG.
TNG gave Roddenberry the forum to make Trek his way again (at least for the 1st season). Not a bad legacy for Bennett.
Actually, although they filmed the remember sequence, Bennett was totally surprised by the last shot of Spock's torpedo coffin. He fought tooth and nail against implying that Spock could still be alive or return. But somebody (Was it Meyer?) inserted that coffin shot.
Good post btw.
I think its the other way around. Meyer was against "resurrections" not Bennett. Meyer wanted nothing to do with those outs.
Sharr
MeanJoePhaser
Admiral
Sounds like Bennett saved the franchise.
Though that Academy idea sounded awful.
So it's probably good his era ended when it did.
Though that Academy idea sounded awful.
So it's probably good his era ended when it did.
Related piece: Tracing the rise and fall of Harve Bennett's Academy script.
http://startrekdom.blogspot.com/2007/04/origin-of-starfleet-academy-rumor.html
http://startrekdom.blogspot.com/2007/04/origin-of-starfleet-academy-rumor.html
TheBrew said:
STII was true to Star Trek but TNG wasn't?
STII was fun to watch and a good movie, but what did it have to do with ideals of Star Trek?
The characters are more alive in Trek II than in TMP, where everyone walks around with a stick up their arse. I know the militaristic stuff in Trek II was layered on with a trowel, but Roddenberry conveniently forgets the action-adventure elements that made TOS what it was. Kirk got into fist-fights, he chased alien birds, he blew shit up.
He retconned the future by the time it got round to TNG, blurred the edges with his other failed TV pilots (Genesis II, Planet Earth), which pretty much flew in the face of most of TOS.
You could tell he was on drugs. He wanted to de-canon TOS
jon1701 said:
TheBrew said:
STII was true to Star Trek but TNG wasn't?
STII was fun to watch and a good movie, but what did it have to do with ideals of Star Trek?
The characters are more alive in Trek II than in TMP, where everyone walks around with a stick up their arse. I know the militaristic stuff in Trek II was layered on with a trowel, but Roddenberry conveniently forgets the action-adventure elements that made TOS what it was. Kirk got into fist-fights, he chased alien birds, he blew shit up.
He retconned the future by the time it got round to TNG, blurred the edges with his other failed TV pilots (Genesis II, Planet Earth), which pretty much flew in the face of most of TOS.
You could tell he was on drugs. He wanted to de-canon TOS
The characters in TMP are 10 times closer to the TOS originals then anything in any of the Bennett films. The Kirk of II thru VI bears no resemblance to the TOS or TMP Kirk; he is a completely different character (and a much weaker one). Hell, Braga and Moore's take on Kirk in Generations was closer to the TOS Kirk then anything Bennet did. Where's The God Thing when you need him?
siskokid888 said:
jon1701 said:
TheBrew said:
STII was true to Star Trek but TNG wasn't?
STII was fun to watch and a good movie, but what did it have to do with ideals of Star Trek?
The characters are more alive in Trek II than in TMP, where everyone walks around with a stick up their arse. I know the militaristic stuff in Trek II was layered on with a trowel, but Roddenberry conveniently forgets the action-adventure elements that made TOS what it was. Kirk got into fist-fights, he chased alien birds, he blew shit up.
He retconned the future by the time it got round to TNG, blurred the edges with his other failed TV pilots (Genesis II, Planet Earth), which pretty much flew in the face of most of TOS.
You could tell he was on drugs. He wanted to de-canon TOS
The characters in TMP are 10 times closer to the TOS originals then anything in any of the Bennett films. The Kirk of II thru VI bears no resemblance to the TOS or TMP Kirk; he is a completely different character (and a much weaker one). Hell, Braga and Moore's take on Kirk in Generations was closer to the TOS Kirk then anything Bennet did. Where's The God Thing when you need him?
There was once not to long past a whole thread dedicated to how much of a jerk and an idiot Kirk had become and behaved like in TMP and Spock wasn't a bit the way we last so him on the series if anything Spock had regressed rather then advanced.
Sharr
