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The Last Jedi - Actually Widely Hated?

The fact that most TLJ fans get, what is the word.... "triggered" at any criticism of it, tells you the kind of people most fans of it are, and hence the reasons why they are fans of it (clue it's not because it's a good movie)

Hehe

Your bullshit is getting thicker and thicker.
 
It's without doubt the Star Trek into Darkness of Star Wars films.

And just like ID, I enjoyed it, but do believe there are some faults to it. The biggest being: I believe that it would be better if Cumberbatch played a disillusioned Starfleet intelligence officer named John Harrison. Remove all the Khan stuff and it would have worked much better. And with TLJ, I believe there were missed opportunities, particularly finding something better for Finn and Rose to do. But overall, I think the film was well done, especially the Luke stuff. But, I also respect that there are those who disagree with me.
 
And many agree with me

This is not a correct statement.

It is a provable fact that the people who hate The Last Jedi are a very tiny sliver of the gigantic pie that is the Star Wars fandom as a collective entity.

That is not, by definition, "many".
 
This is not a correct statement.

It is a provable fact that the people who hate The Last Jedi are a very tiny sliver of the gigantic pie that is the Star Wars fandom as a collective entity.

That is not, by definition, "many".

Whatever makes you guys sleep at night
 
This is not a correct statement.

It is a provable fact that the people who hate The Last Jedi are a very tiny sliver of the gigantic pie that is the Star Wars fandom as a collective entity.

That is not, by definition, "many".

There is no provable fact about any fandom, beyond the fact that they exist.

(This is almost certainly in the Vulcan training program, but was deleted from the film to avoid War.)
 
And just like ID, I enjoyed it, but do believe there are some faults to it. The biggest being: I believe that it would be better if Cumberbatch played a disillusioned Starfleet intelligence officer named John Harrison. Remove all the Khan stuff and it would have worked much better. And with TLJ, I believe there were missed opportunities, particularly finding something better for Finn and Rose to do. But overall, I think the film was well done, especially the Luke stuff. But, I also respect that there are those who disagree with me.

This is "kind of" off-topic, but as I read your post I realized that maybe ID would have been better if Harrison was actually a disillusioned Starfleet Intelligence officer who was seeking the location of Botany Bay (found by Starfleet and secured, or otherwise) with the intention of awakening Khan and his followers in order to launch a war against the Klingons. Maybe he succeeds and we end up sorta where ID took us, maybe he doesn't because Our Heroes take him out of play, or even better convince him that the world they live in doesn't need Khan or a preemptive Klingon war.

I guess in a sense merge the Harrison/Marcus characters. But then, for a time Marcus and Khan were working together in any case.

This would necessitate massive changes to the second half of the film, but maybe that wouldn't be such a bad idea.
 
When you're led to believe that


This is "kind of" off-topic, but as I read your post I realized that maybe ID would have been better if Harrison was actually a disillusioned Starfleet Intelligence officer who was seeking the location of Botany Bay (found by Starfleet and secured, or otherwise) with the intention of awakening Khan and his followers in order to launch a war against the Klingons. Maybe he succeeds and we end up sorta where ID took us, maybe he doesn't because Our Heroes take him out of play, or even better convince him that the world they live in doesn't need Khan or a preemptive Klingon war.

I guess in a sense merge the Harrison/Marcus characters. But then, for a time Marcus and Khan were working together in any case.

This would necessitate massive changes to the second half of the film, but maybe that wouldn't be such a bad idea.

That’s an interesting take. Not quite what I had in mind but I think it might have worked. I like it!
 
And just like ID, I enjoyed it, but do believe there are some faults to it. The biggest being: I believe that it would be better if Cumberbatch played a disillusioned Starfleet intelligence officer named John Harrison. Remove all the Khan stuff and it would have worked much better. And with TLJ, I believe there were missed opportunities, particularly finding something better for Finn and Rose to do. But overall, I think the film was well done, especially the Luke stuff. But, I also respect that there are those who disagree with me.
This is my take as well. Could TLJ have been done better? Absolutely! Same with TFA.

Does this fact diminish my enjoyment of the films? Not in the slightest. The good outweighs the bad, in my opinion, and Luke tops the list for the good in TLJ.
 
That’s how long had passed?
Well, t seemed longer xD
It’s still a bit of a long time, to say the least.
Cutting the timescale down to month or so would feel better...its presumably that long to make sure it didn’t look like Luke pegged it in the middle of escalating tensions with the First Order.
Tbh, given how hard Ren was looking for the map to find Luke, it would have worked better if the First Order felt they were the true heirs to the rebellion and were looking to recruit Luke.
Like I say...motivations are a bit of a mess in the ST. You can get away with it in TFA, but by TLJ things need to be settling down a bit, as they were in Empire.



I am hoping there is. In episode 9.
And how many times?
You can only die trying once. It’s sort of it’s point.



But earlier he was hanging around Jakku. Where he picks up Rey in the Falcon after they run...which is where Ben Solo was at the exact same time.
It’s...messy. I am trying to give them more credit by suggesting Han was keeping tabs on Ben. Possibly. If you don’t me to, I am ok with that.



I just don’t get to see them trying in the movie, as you describe. There’s a lot you can sort of assume, or go to the novels (I just wont. I did my time with the old EU.) but there’s no feel for any of that onscreen.

I really should try multiquote again. It’s the way I read posts and reply. Sorry.

It’s just occurred to me that you can have virtually the same two movies with the tiniest tweak (and it’s one JJ has used before) to deal with some of the issues.

Have Luke exiled to the planet by the First Order and Kylo Ren. Snoke wants to turn him, or Ren just wants him to suffer feeling the Republics end through the force.

Have the map to find him be stolen from the First Order (a la the Death Star plans.)

Everything else would play out exactly the same, with a stronger reason for Luke being broken (he was defeated, couldn’t bring himself to strike down Kylo, and was captured) and missing, and why everyone is looking for either the map or Luke himself.

Again, I find myself wondering if they started with that in the mix, then threw it out for being too close to Death Star plans/rescue Princess Leia.
There’s stuff that can be tweaked with Han and Leia too, though frankly some tiny tweaks in motivation and exposition will do it. Maybe Leia can’t get republic backing to search for missing son and brother...maybe the republic will only search for Luke (suddenly justifying the existence of an elite military team behind enemy lines...aka the resistance.) but not Ben who is presumed dead. Maybe Han then says ‘sod it, I will do it myself’ and goes back to his shady life and it’s shady contacts (he’s smuggling for the First Order to find info). Hell, at that point have him walk out, take their daughter with him, and lose her and the Falcon...or so he thinks...dun dun dun.
All of this could still result in virtually the same two films, only with some better emotional stakes (Rey is reunited with her father, Han Solo, and is on the verge of him getting her brother back too...when it transpires Ben is Kylo Ren, strikes down their father and...well, we have seen the films. Incidentally this adds to the Leia stakes too, and makes the hug scene make so so much more sense. Literally the verge of a family reunion and boom.) all round.
Hell, you even get the bonus of a character drinking blue milk with their Uncle in TLJ.

@jaime - Consider this a pass, but please use the multi-quote or Edit features in the future. ;)
 
The fact that most TLJ fans get, what is the word.... "triggered" at any criticism of it, tells you the kind of people most fans of it are, and hence the reasons why they are fans of it (clue it's not because it's a good movie)

Hehe
@Infern0 - You are crossing a line wit this post, mocking a set of fans. Please do NOT do that in the future. ;)
 
This is not a correct statement.

It is a provable fact that the people who hate The Last Jedi are a very tiny sliver of the gigantic pie that is the Star Wars fandom as a collective entity.

That is not, by definition, "many".

How in the world is that a provable fact???
 
This is not a correct statement.

It is a provable fact that the people who hate The Last Jedi are a very tiny sliver of the gigantic pie that is the Star Wars fandom as a collective entity.

That is not, by definition, "many".

"Provable"? Probably not, I struggle to imagine a way of really measuring that objectively, or even delineating exactly what "the fandom" is.

"Likely", on the other hand, seems a very apt word.
 
Well, I started this thread because I loved the movie, so I checked the internet, where the negativity was overwhelming. So I talked to coworkers, and their view of the movie was even more negative! In fact I haven't seen a single person outside of this board that claims to have liked this movie. I have however met people who truly, not hyperbolically, think that tlj was the worst movie ever made.
 
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