The Infinite Vulcan

[erastus25]

I just watched The Infinite Vulcan for the first time in probably a decade and it strikes me as one of the most conflicted episodes in all of TOS/TAS.

What I mean is that some elements of the plot are GREAT and others are TERRIBLE. Not much in between. For instance, the idea of sentient plants adds a level of truly fantastic sci-fi that they could only do in TAS. And they manage to avoid being ridiculous like the infamous Lost in Space episode.

Keniclius and Agmar are also great characters. The moral ambiguity of having the enemy be people with noble goals who are so tunnel visioned that they fail to realize they've become villains in their attempts to reach their goals is a level of complexity than many TOS characters lacked. Further, the debate about whether or not the TOS universe is truly peaceful, despite conflicts with the Klingons/Romulans, was more interesting than many of the other message shows (i.e. Let that Be Your Last Battlefield). And the questions of "what do I do now?" when Keniclius found out that his entire life's work was for naught is the type of existential crisis that could fill a full episode. The episode introduces a ton of great themes and characters - it easily could have abandoned the clone subplot and STILL been a quality full hour.

That being said, it's all totally undermined by the cliched and completely unnecessary "evil clone" bit. And the giant Spock takes the clone plot from mildly annoying to completely detrimental. Ultimately all of the good potential of the episode is overshadowed by some truly terrible decisions.

To me, this might be the most disappointing episode of TAS because of all the great concepts that are ultimately wasted . Koenig is on record stating that Gene made him do wayyyy too many rewrites. I'd be interested to know how many of the superfluous "sci-fi" action elements were added at Gene's behest.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

I probably haven't seen that one since 1973. I recall the giant Spock, but not the thinking that went into creating him. Is there an a great advantage to being 32 feet tall? Because I can think of some problems with it.

 

[Redfern]

There's a brief moment when the landing party sees a tunnel, a constructed hallway, its walls lined with the bodies of the previous Phylosian generation, victims of a disease Keniclius unwittingly brought with him. Those corpses stood some 20 to 30 feet tall. The present generation, the one with whom Kirk and company interacted were effectively "stunted". Agmar mentions this.

While not explicitly stated, we can infer from these facts that the original Keniclius opted to make his clone as tall as those older Phylosians, probably for better social interaction. The successive three copies continued this practice even though the latest generations of plant beings were "short".

Yes, it barely passes as an excuse to showcase a giant Spock, a cartoon cliche to thrill the kids, but at least some thought was given to the situation and was not simply pulled out of the blue.

Sincerely,

Bill

 

[Commishsleer]

I'm probably the only one here who doesn't mind a 30ft clone in a science fiction cartoon.
But I like the explanation by Redfern which I hadn't heard of before

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I'm probably the only one here who doesn't mind a 30ft clone in a science fiction cartoon.
But I like the explanation by Redfern which I hadn't heard of before

I like Redfern's take on it too, but 30-foot-tall cloned Spock is 125 times moar awesome than regular-sized Spock. I like how they cloned his uniform too, super-sized.

 

[Warped9]

There's a brief moment when the landing party sees a tunnel, a constructed hallway, its walls lined with the bodies of the previous Phylosian generation, victims of a disease Keniclius unwittingly brought with him. Those corpses stood some 20 to 30 feet tall. The present generation, the one with whom Kirk and company interacted were effectively "stunted". Agmar mentions this.

While not explicitly stated, we can infer from these facts that the original Keniclius opted to make his clone as tall as those older Phylosians, probably for better social interaction. The successive three copies continued this practice even though the latest generations of plant beings were "short".

Yes, it barely passes as an excuse to showcase a giant Spock, a cartoon cliche to thrill the kids, but at least some thought was given to the situation and was not simply pulled out of the blue.

Sincerely,

Bill

Holy crap! After all these years I completely missed that. In that light the oversized clones start to have some rationalization behind it.

I have always liked this episode--as already mentioned one of TAS' stronger efforts-- but was disappointed with the giant clone. I still think it's nonsense, but at least now I can see some reasoning (albeit still flawed) behind it.

A thirty foot plant like alien might be feasible given that some plants as we know them can indeed grow to enormous size. But a humanoid life form is something completely different. It's the same logic behind why a giant ape such as King Kong could never exist or why insects cannot be very large. The skeletal structure and muscle mass to handle the incredible increase in body mass is simply too prohibitive.

 

[SchwEnt]

I like the elements introduced in this eps. A Eugenics War scientist that's still around, having cloned himself into the 23rd century. An alien race of intelligent plants is cool, a new idea not seen before in ST. Interesting stuff.

It's true, the previous generation of Phylosians seemed very tall, perhaps that was their norm. Keniclius, Spock, all the humans were much smaller in comparison. In that case, Spock-2 wasn't a giant, he was just created according to previous healthy Phylosian standards. That works for me.

At least Spock-2 kept his uniform. I guess we could have seen a giant stripped down Spock in loincloth (like Keniclius).

 

[CorporalCaptain]

One thing I've never attempted to do is evaluate this episode's mind meld in terms of Spock's katra that we learn about a decade or so later in TSFS.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

It's true, the previous generation of Phylosians seemed very tall, perhaps that was their norm. Keniclius, Spock, all the humans were much smaller in comparison. In that case, Spock-2 wasn't a giant, he was just created according to previous healthy Phylosian standards. That works for me.

Reasonable.

At least Spock-2 kept his uniform. I guess we could have seen a giant stripped down Spock in loincloth (like Keniclius).

After "Plato's Stepchildren", I would avoid Spock--even animated Spock--showing off his legs.

 

[erastus25]

There's a brief moment when the landing party sees a tunnel, a constructed hallway, its walls lined with the bodies of the previous Phylosian generation, victims of a disease Keniclius unwittingly brought with him. Those corpses stood some 20 to 30 feet tall. The present generation, the one with whom Kirk and company interacted were effectively "stunted". Agmar mentions this.

While not explicitly stated, we can infer from these facts that the original Keniclius opted to make his clone as tall as those older Phylosians, probably for better social interaction. The successive three copies continued this practice even though the latest generations of plant beings were "short".

Yes, it barely passes as an excuse to showcase a giant Spock, a cartoon cliche to thrill the kids, but at least some thought was given to the situation and was not simply pulled out of the blue.

Sincerely,

Bill

And, to their credit, that is a truly haunting scene. Kirk and crew looking at a dead species and eventually realized that it was the unwitting consequence of an ignorant human. That human then commits multiple lives to try and make up for that terrible error. And, to add insult to injury, the people that he has nearly destroyed have forgiven him and now work with him, adding to his guilt. Great stuff for an animated show!

 

[Nebusj]

Yes, it barely passes as an excuse to showcase a giant Spock, a cartoon cliche to thrill the kids, but at least some thought was given to the situation and was not simply pulled out of the blue.

You're right. I had taken the gigantism to be merely an effort to produce new rules for the galaxy that would be impressive to the majority of the public. But that he was built to match the healthy Phylosians of the far past is rather sound.

 

[plynch]

any screencap to illustrate large Phylosians?

 

[Redfern]

As seen from the POV of the landing party...

http://tas.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/1x07/theinfinitevulcan_045.JPG

And seen from an overhead reverse angle that illustrates their height...

http://tas.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/1x07/theinfinitevulcan_046.JPG

Sincerely,

Bill

 

[SchwEnt]

One thing I've never attempted to do is evaluate this episode's mind meld in terms of Spock's katra that we learn about a decade or so later in TSFS.

It's not called a "katra" but we do see Spock transfer his consciousness to Nurse Chapel in "Return to Tomorrow" amidst all the mind-globe hijinks in that eps. So there's a precedent.

 

[Warped9]

As seen from the POV of the landing party...

http://tas.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/1x07/theinfinitevulcan_045.JPG

And seen from an overhead reverse angle that illustrates their height...

http://tas.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/1x07/theinfinitevulcan_046.JPG

Sincerely,

Bill

A very cool design for an alien. If done as a one hour live-action story there might well have been a remark in reference to the aliens' size.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

One thing I've never attempted to do is evaluate this episode's mind meld in terms of Spock's katra that we learn about a decade or so later in TSFS.

It's not called a "katra" but we do see Spock transfer his consciousness to Nurse Chapel in "Return to Tomorrow" amidst all the mind-globe hijinks in that eps. So there's a precedent.

Right!

 

[PCz911]

I

. Koenig is on record stating that Gene made him do wayyyy too many rewrites. I'd be interested to know how many of the superfluous "sci-fi" action elements were added at Gene's behest.

This is interesting. Does anyone have any further insight into this?

 

[erastus25]

I

. Koenig is on record stating that Gene made him do wayyyy too many rewrites. I'd be interested to know how many of the superfluous "sci-fi" action elements were added at Gene's behest.

This is interesting. Does anyone have any further insight into this?

I looked into it and that's pretty much the whole story I could find. He's told it in a couple different interviews - most notably on the TAS DVDs, I believe.

I'm guessing there isn't anything else, but I'd love it if one of the posters here produced some of the drafts of the script, or another interview I missed. I swear, some of you guys are magic at finding some of this old crap. lol

 

[Commishsleer]

In "Who Mourns for Adonis", didn't Adonis make himself 30 ft tall or was that an illusion?

 

[CorporalCaptain]

In "Who Mourns for Adonis", didn't Adonis make himself 30 ft tall or was that an illusion?

My take is that he really did it.