Discussion in 'Doctor Who' started by The Nth Doctor, Feb 16, 2020.
Brilliant. Loved the butler’s rolly eyes! Made me lol everytime
I watched this episode... which was pretty good, btw... and I had an epiphany:
Chibnall's Doctor Who is like Star Trek: Voyager. Not that great, cringe-inducing in some places, nausea-inducing in others, but occasionally good and rarely outstanding. However, loyalty to the franchise is more of a motivator than anything else.
First part was very meh. Second part was great.
I'm somewhere between a 7 and 8 here. I really liked the beginning--very good atmosphere, really held my interest. The end gets a bit muddled, feels very rushed but we also have a whole part still to look forward to. I really liked that they got Jack's warning right away and how the Doctor took charge--a really solid episode. I just hope the conclusion doesn't disappoint.
I loved this episode. I really liked how the Doctor wants to keep the companions away from the Cyberman after what happened to Bill, it's nice to see the fate of a former companion still affecting the Doctor. Mary Shelly trying to appeal to the Cyberman was perfect, just really showed the lack of humanity in them and actually getting to see part of his human face was a nice touch and really added to the horror.
Strong 7 for me, I really liked the first half and the fabulous Valet.
Graham's ghosts were very creepy and I liked his terrible attempts at period speech.
I didn't enjoy the second half quite as much, can't quite say what bothered me about the cyberman, perhaps it was seeing his face and the voice. I didn't find him to be as menacing as previous cybermen.
This Cyberman was the more Borg than Cyberman. With the human face, electronic voice effect, arm attachment, mix of parts, rubber costume.
I don't know. It has a genuinely creepy vibe at the start, but this being Doctor Who we know the supposedly haunted house will not in fact be haunted. It got a bit tedious having the Cyberman teased out as long as it was, but granted I was spoiled beforehand about him, so maybe there's that. I did not know the reason for the house always sending everyone back to the room they started in though, and that was also dragged out a bit too long, IMO. The historical guest stars just felt like generic guest characters who just happen to have the names of real people. We don't really learn anything about the actual people they're based on.
Some of the story threads laid in the Judoon episode finally get picked up on. We meet the Lone Cyberman, and presumably the Cyberium or whatever is what Captain Jack was talking about when he said something's been sent back in time. And despite Jack's warning not to give the Cyberman what it wants, the Doctor goes and does just that anyway. Not really sure I buy the argument, the Doctor is generally pretty liberal about changing the timeline, though I guess this would mean changing real world history, which the show always shies away from.
I will say they did a much better job with the partially converted Cyberman in this episode than they did with that silly Cyberwoman on Torchwood. But I guess that's not hard, here they were trying to show how horrifying and brutal Cyber conversion can be, while on Torchwood it was just an excuse to show tits to the show's grown-up audience.
So, mostly a meh and underwhelming episode this week.
I appreciated that 13 didn't want her team in the way of harm b/c Bill - the pacing was a little convoluted but I enjoyed this more than the average haunted house thriller- I don't usually care for them. I WAS pleased Grahm's ghosts were unrelated- I like the randomness of messy loose ends.
I have worried about hoping for too much for 13 but it really feels like Jodie is hitting her stride. I hope she gets many more.
Loved her vest too- the striped T is nice but I do like it when she gussies up. They can't all wear Frock coats and Docs but if it were up to me they might.
A minor thing I will admit, certainly not important to the grand scheme of things, but I appreciated they gave the "Lone Cyberman" a "baleful, yellow eye" as Mary described in the novel.
That allows me to segue to a minor gripe about "Overly Sarcastic Productions" on YouTube and Red's Halloween discussion about the novel. She was, admittedly, on point with many aspects, but she described Victor as ridiculously superficial by claiming he abandoned his creation for simply having yellow eyes. Red pretty much claimed the "Monster" was quite handsome in all other respects. Uh, sorry but WRONG!!! Mary Shelley, through the character Victor described his creation as not having quite enough skin to adequately cover his muscle sinew and bone, what he did possess was eerily translucent and it was drawn so tight about the face as to make the creation look more disturbing than a mummy! Thankfully, several viewers pointed out these "omissions" and Red's misleading suggestion that Victor's experiment was a drop dead "Sexy". Yeah, I know Red draws most of her male characters as beautiful "Bishie" boys. That's not my complaint. I realize she does that for humorous effect. No, it were her spoken words that implied that.
I had to get that off my chest.
She could have mentioned Bill by name, which would then confuse her "fam" when they find out Bill was female (and the Doctor was male) making them wonder about everything
And let's not forget alt-universe Jackie Tyler being Cyberided.
A lot to enjoy in this one - creepy vibe, nice use of ghost story tropes and tricks, really unnerving Last Cyberman, handled the moral dilemma well - no right, no wrong, just a discussion, a choice, and a determination to deal with the consequences - and I certainly appreciated the detail of Graham's 'ghosts'.
If I were to nitpick, I'd agree with a poster above that the guest historical figures felt a little flat, and there was a moment, and I admit I could have blinked and missed something, where it jumped to the Doctor confronting the cyberman with no explanation of how they came together. I'd disagree that Dr Who avoids changing history, though; in this ep alone two people died who hadn't before, Mary Shelley found an entirely new inspiration for her iconic creation, and Clairmont ended her relationship with Byron early, thus likely ensuring their child is never born. Probably more accurate to say they rarely to never change anything major.
Regarding the overall series, so far, I do think the main arc has been handled in a slightly clunky fashion, not terribly well-paced. Big, dramatic two-part opener, then standalones that barely touch the arc, then a bigger, more dramatic arc ep, then two more eps that barely mention it, then finally a standalone turns into an arc ep, except dealing with a relatively lesser element, and ignoring the most dramatic reveal. Can't help being a little concerned about how all this will turn up, but hopefully it's unwarranted.
I can't rate this episode. The first half was just kind of there and then there are in a crazy haunted house thing and the commercials. I just wasn't feeling it, so while it was enjoyable and the little snappiness of The Doctor was nice at the end it was just there. So my grade was NA.
I will say I love the Doctors plan. 1. Give the Cyberman what he wants even though it will kill billions. 2. Undo what I just did in step one. Seems like the story of my life.
Fanbloodytastic........ A nice spooky story.
The latest episode was good and it really got me thinking and gave me ideas... What if Frankenstein as we know him was in fact Mary Shelley's telling of a Cyberman, well not in reality but it fits well with the Whoniverse. I like this idea and I think I'll stick with it.
I loved that and gave it a 9.
There were some creepy moments, and I loved seeing how creeped out the gang were getting. I also though it was funny how Graham's ghosts had nothing to do with anything.
The Cyberman reveal was a shock, though I think that we'll see if part two of the plan works or not.
"You appear courageous, but your vital signs betray a heightened sense of anxiety."
"Or as I like to call it, Tuesday."
I had a big Buffy throwback here with all of the troublesome Tuesdays she had. I loved the dialogue leading up to that moment as well with the Doc reflecting on Bill. Jodie really sold it.
Saw this one at Gallfrey One. We got to see it a bit early. By an hour or so. I gave it an 8. Probably Whitaker's best story so far. Either this one or Ghost Monument.
I enjoyed the creepy vibe, haunted house, with some intermixed humor.
I do feel like the historical figures where just characters with famous names. There wasn't much about them particularly. Sure, if you know a bit about them (such as Lord Byron and Claire), you could draw a little more out of the story. However, they were there mainly to force the dilemma about saving Byron at the expense of the future or the other way around. Quite a different take on the matter than Ecclestone's "there's nothing more important than the common man." (paraphrasing) Just an interesting note on that change of perspective.
I'm not too bothered about learning about historical figures in DW, so not a big deal.
Just a thought about the ghosts...
Only Graham saw them, right?
What if they were no ghosts at all and in fact hallucinations by him?
We never learned what type of cancer he has, right?
Brain tumors can cause hallucinations?so what if this wasn‘t just a funny unrelated side story?
What if they prepare to write him out of the series in a very Joyce Summers way?
Well that was more like it.
Whittaker's best episode so far, I thought it was great. Genuinely creepy and the lone Cyberman was a great villain. Lots of funny bits ('you had one job!') and I loved the Doctor's speech about always being the decision maker when things get difficult.
Where has this quality been all season?
^^That would be sad and I would also miss the representation of my demographic: old confused people who are pleased to still be included but also wondering what the heck is going on around me.
DW has no real canon so any events seen can be messed with by other events that happen either later on or in the past. I've been reading that Mary Shelly's husband was part of Faction Paradox for example.
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