Spoilers The Gifted - Season 2

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by jmc247, Sep 25, 2018.

  1. crookeddy

    crookeddy Commodore Commodore

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    Massive viewership jump for the gifted to 2.31 million, making this week's episode the second most watched of the season... Still looks to be well below Fox's expectations, as a show that is considered "struggling" Lethal Weapon just got 3.03 million for their last episode...

    Hoping that Fox considers moving this show to FX if they don't want it to continue on the big Fox. The budget really doesn't seem too high for cable these days.
     
  2. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Mutant Underground hasn't got the muscle to attack the Inner Circle's headquarters yet. Since it's not releveant now, they're not thinking about it. The show logic suggests that in the end they ally with Jace Turner.

    Reeva Payge seems to be operating a House of Cards plot, ensnaring some big shot as a path to power. That said, it's still true that politically committed people talk politics. The producers seem to think talking about politics is either boring or something that should be done by the right people, all others silent. Another thing about the mutant homeland is of course the place of family, especially children and friends, and the work involved in making a life. Even if the Inner Circle was content to simply follow Reeva's orders, they'd talk about these things. The Mutant Underground won't because they don't even think about the future.

    The Frost story reminds us that good or bad, there are reasons why people are the way they are, and it's not just choice. But at the same time, it doesn't admit this for Reeva or Rebecca.

    In the cold open, I wondered immediately why they took the collars off the young Frosts, instead of just turning them off.

    Andy's had several hairstyles now, switching in one day apparently to a middle part, then switching back. Reminds me of first season Janeway.

    I'm pretty sure the pancake breakfast was not meant to tell us Andy and Rebecca were post-night together, but foreshadowing how Rebecca makes Andy a monster. I'm not sure of the actress' age, but they seem to be leaving her very, very light on make up to make her look younger. My experience is that younger girls like makeup, to the point of trying out for Raccoon Girl. Looks off.

    The scenes about Reed's powers feel arbitrary because their return is so arbitrary. I wish they had Caitlin give him immunosupressants in a crisis to deliberately break down Otto's treatment.

    Marcos' comment about the Inner Circle's mess, the hospital raid, confirms that a hospital confining and abusing mutants was not an issue for the Mutant Underground, but right and proper, and changing it made a mess, instead of cleaning one up.

    Esme commenting on how their action has inspired mutants is paralleled by Officer Ted talking about Horst Wessel inspiring the Purifiers, which equates the Inner Circle and the Purifiers.

    When Caitlin and Lauren talk about getting Andy back, I have to wonder why Lauren wants him back. It's clear she's too perfect to be tempted by the power of Fenris, and she doesn't like him either. It is curious that she never says something simple like Andy's bleaching his hair, or Caitlin and Reed didn't tell her they saw him in the security cameras either. Struckers really do not talk, do they? If they did get him back, wouldn't Lauren want to leave the family as per normal life schedule anyhow?

    Speaking of graduating and going off to college, how many of these people finished high school? The Inner Circle seems in many ways to be the island of misfit toys, viewed with the normal understanding misfits are creepy and deserve what they get.

    Where do these people get their money? Lauren has jewelry again, which you'd think isn't high priority.

    Taylor referred to the tragedy at the hospital. Did she mean most of the mutants escaping, or did she mean the death of a jailer? If she left on principle, why did the hospital leave her with patient information, presumably including records of abuse?

    Skyler Samuels is signalling Phoebe with a hand on hip, I think. Any other identifiers for Esme and Sophie?

    Esme's second appeal preempted the brain fix Reeva approved.

    In Baltimore it's good to see old friends, however briefly. But that reminds me, what did they do with Graph? I'm imagining them chopping him up and dropping the pieces in dumpsters.

    The observation Jace is almost as good as John, his slapping down .50 cal Kyle, "the terrorists are in there," etc. are the continued Jace is good theme. Shatter kills first, so his death is just retribution, by the show's standards.

    Anger makes people show their ass. Lorna seems to think having a mere aunt to sing your mother's lullaby to you is just like being a guinea pig with torture. The notion there's just no excuse because it's all just weak will and badness is kind of reactionary, judgmental and morally obtuse.

    Lauren's decision to fight Andy should imply she'll squeeze his carotid artery to knock him out. Andy doesn't rip people up like Rebecca. People have never paid enough attention to Andy to notice, but the contrast with Rebecca really is hard to overlook. Reeva should know it means something about Andy. (And since Andy first manifested at fourteen, but repressed for another year does too.)

    Fenris and Frost are characters that are not really human on the inside, with feelings and experiences not really like people. In a way this is kind of intriguing, but the show doesn't want to do anything with it.

    The music video lyrics, High and Low by Eza, were remarkably apt to the story. Too on the nose?
     
  3. kitik

    kitik Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    So we finally learned what happened to the other 2 sisters. I was thinking they might need to be rescued in this upcoming operation, but obviously not. Those younger sisters looked like they might actually be triplets. Anyone know what the credits say, triplets or more camera tricks?

    Any thoughts at all on them choosing the name "Creed"? Seems pretty loaded.

    Shatter seemed somewhat murderous. Too bad he's gone as he made for a great visual design.
     
  4. The Scrooge Doctor

    The Scrooge Doctor Bah humbug! Premium Member

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    The credits doesn't say anything but IMDb says Saree McIntosh played "Young Frost Sisters."
     
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  5. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Saree Mcintosh is credited as "Young Frost Sisters." It was more split-screen work. If you looked closely, you could see the same tricks being used as with Skyler Samuels -- e.g. one FX shot with all three faces visible followed by a rear angle, followed by a closeup with only one face clearly visible, etc. They make you think you're seeing all three faces more often, when really they just give you a few such shots to put the image in your mind and then let your expectations fill in the rest.


    "Murderous" is not the right word. His power was lethal, but he used it in self-defense and defense of the others.
     
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  6. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Whoever killed that man at the hospital was acting in defense of others, but everyone else here thinks it was simply murder. By the way, on reflection, it's interesting the show never gave us a hint who did it? At any rate, Andy is a mass murderer for Atlanta HQ and the Frosts for Trask labs. (Campbell apparently never existed, so Polaris couldn't have murdered him and Senator Montez.) The Mutant Underground is an ongoing criminal enterprise dedicated to harboring fugitives from justice, theft, identity fraud, etc. It's hard to know what's still canon, but attacking a federal courthouse and a power plant do count as terrorist acts, legally. Personally, I don't think you can just look at the law, say terrorist and that's means evil, but that's a wildly eccentric and unpopular view, what people tend to call "trolling." So I don't see how you can get past Shatter killed first, despite the show's double standard for Inner Circle.

    As I understand it, there is almost never any self-defense justification for criminals in the act who threaten---or merely have the potential for---lethal force, as in having a gun. Mutants are potentially lethal in their own persons. A determined prosecutor could try to convict Jace for killing Shatter, on the grounds that the Purifiers were not authorized law enforcement. But telling criminals to come out of a building likely wouldn't be seen as much of a crime. And traditions about citizen's arrest would come into play. Jace killing Shatter was a righteous kill, because the show is determined that Jace is fundamentally good and it's just a few bad apples like .50 cal Kyle.
     
  7. Gaith

    Gaith Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Had a weird X-Men-related TV show dream this morning, may as well put it here...

    I awoke this morning thinking of a potential X-Men-lite broadcast network drama: what if the X-Men weren't mutants or superheroes, but... renegade 20-something doctors? High school STEM teachers by day, but by night/during emergencies, at the behest of psychiatrist billionaire Headmaster Xavier, they fly around in private jets, making the hard medical calls and unauthorized (by the insurance companies) surgeries others won't, all in the name of healing the sick and underprivileged. (And often in disguise, because Bureaucracy.)

    Of course, there'd be running gags about how the characters vaguely resemble the comics ones: Scott has a pronounced photosensitivity, requiring him to wear red-tinted glasses, Ororo is a total Weather Channel nerd who's always telling weather trivia stories and talking in weather metaphors, Hank is an oddball who dyes his hair blue... but mainly, primarily, they're all physicians. Hot 20-something physicians, particularly new-to-the-group bad boy Aussie doctor Logan. (Yeah, I know, but he'd be an Aussie in the show, because Sexy Accent.) In short, it'd be like House, MD crossed with AoS. Meanwhile, there'd be occasional hints of certain... powers developing, but the show'd get canceled in its second or third season, right as some Terrigenesis-type event happens, and it's finally on the verge of getting good.

    The whole idea strikes me as terrifying plausible, really. :p
     
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  8. The Scrooge Doctor

    The Scrooge Doctor Bah humbug! Premium Member

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    I gotta say...that actually sounds enjoyable and I'm surprised Fox hasn't already developed such a series. :lol:
     
  9. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    You had a Marvel dream last night, I had a DC/Arrowverse dream last night. I dreamed that The Flash's Joe West had somehow become the head of Legends of Tomorrow's Time Bureau and was trying to institute a new policy of deliberately altering history to bring back dead loved ones, including his first wife. The other characters in the dream, presumably Team Flash (I don't remember, except that there were no actual Legends in the dream), were trying to talk him out of it or stop him or something. It didn't get very far beyond that before I woke up.
     
  10. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Bump for seventh episode, No Mercy...

    Sharif Atkins, from The 4400, and in his glory days, ER.! Agam Darshi, from Sanctuary and Dirk Gently. Truly no actor is ever forgiven for doing genre, the stink never goes away.

    Phoebe puts a hand on hip; Sophie takes one arm by the other hand; Esme puts hands together at waist.

    The out of nowhereness of Reed's powers keeps making it all seem made up, no matter how much Stephen Moyer cowers. It's not even clear why it hurts, which seriously deprives the whole thing of any emotional impact for me.

    Everything Erg is tiresome, because nobody hiding in a sewer is being upfront about who they are. I think the show's political symbolism is read in and makes no dramatic sense. Erg is supposed to be the symbol of black nationalism, separate but equal, and it's not sewers but New Afrika or some such. So they show wants to have us believe Erg is proud and that's why someone would be attracted to his cause, but what they show refutes that. And I still think separate is never equal, even if the show thinks that's so much better than being a black revolutionary like Reeva. The title Morlocks suggests their real plan is to lay low then eat humanity after they've gotten strong enough.

    Reeva's real choice doesn't come until she has to decide what to do about Rebecca breaching discipline. That is not even shown which seems dramatically feeble. In the real world, revolutionary groups have on a few occasions done things like apologize for unintended collateral damage, but it seems unlikely the show knows this. Taylor claimed to have quit Lynwood because uncomfortable with abuse of prisoners, and because Rebecca was dangerous. This confusion about who she is continues, with her being both unjustly imprisoned and justly. It's the old nasty crazy=evil (and =demonic too?) Vilifying mental illness as both wicked and preternaturally threatening is unsavory.

    If I had been in that room, by the way, I'd have been telling that loudmouth to shut up till the scary mutants were gone.

    The new idea is boring so far.
     
  11. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    This episode would've been more effective if the show had introduced Sharif Atkins's character and Reeva's relationship with him earlier, rather than trying to backfill a whole emotional arc in one episode. It also would've been nice to see more time spent on Reed learning to cope with and control his power rather than just spending a whole episode on figuring out how to move him from one place to another. And they need to find something to do with Turner other than the same "I reject your hate/I'm reluctantly listening/Okay, I'm in" arc week after week.
     
  12. Ruaidhri

    Ruaidhri Commodore Commodore

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    What silly manufactured drama over having to move Reed. Why couldn't Blink just create a portal to the clinic?

    And what is the point of "reinforcing" the clinic when his ability just makes stuff crumble to bits?

    Do these writers not watch the show they are plotting for? I think this is the most irritated I've ever been with The Gifted.

    I agree with Christopher ... The Jace Turner merry-go-round is long since stale.
     
  13. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    As a delaying tactic -- and as ablative shielding. The more layers of expendable stuff they put between Reed and the walls of the building/ambulance, the more time they have before he burns through to something vital.
     
  14. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Nothing with Blink's powers ever really makes sense. But apparently the clinic is "across town" which may be beyond her range?

    I was quite curious to see what his power would do to water myself. And to be honest I would have tried rigging a cradle for his upper arms to keep his hands elevated while he slept, too. But I have a bad attitude, so there's that. I'm so vicious I would have tried to see if he could put his hands in his lap safely. Superpowers, superheroes are essentially metaphors for how you can be anything when you grow up, how the future might be different and better. That's why it seems kind of perverse for a fifty year old (er, 45 in the show?) to get powers. But also why he is horrified at change, which is simply destruction...just like the show, which is Fox after all.

    But Jace isn't on a merry-go-round, he's moving forward to ever greater power and responsibility. With Ryan, he's going national! In one sense it's taking back his position as Sentinel Services' would-be mass murderer in Atlanta, but nobody else minds so much of season one being ret-conned. So for him to be a major player he has to rise. They're showing that. The sense in which it is stale I think is because the show's insistence that Turner is fundamentally a good man (Red Stater) who's just sucked in (gone anti-American, Blue Stater,) that he's ambiguous, is nonsense. It's an expression of a political agenda. He's the same impulse that makes Twist crazy=evil just because, because some people are just evil for no reason except they enjoy it. Except that unlike Twist he is fundamentally good so he has to be shown resisting because that show's good intentions.

    I have to say I think the texts in previous episode were quite sufficient build up. The interesting emotions with Reeva and Quinn were her betraying him for the cause, and her sorrow at losing a relationship she personally valued. But then, I've liked Sharif Atkins since ER, which no doubt makes it more affecting.
     
  15. cylkoth

    cylkoth Commodore Commodore

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    What I kept wondering about was, why did Reeva even need to deceive Quinn in the first place? She's got a mutant triumvirate who can brainwash/compell anyone to do what they want. Why the (manufactered) drama over threatening him to do as she ordered?
     
  16. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Because the Cuckoos' power only works as long as they're physically present, and they needed Quinn to insert the program to disable the mutant detectors before they could enter the bank.
     
  17. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Christopher is sort of right and sort of wrong about why Quinn can't be mind-controlled. The dialogue has said the Frost's need to be close...but the show showed them telling Andy at Fairburn station the escape route. I suppose you could fanwank this as somehow they were actually really, really close, but that's pretty weak. Or you can fanwank it as a Strucker, being something like the Frosts is easier to contact. Except that the Frosts share one mind, where the Struckers share bodies instead, which is sort of the opposite. (No, this show is not going to ask any unseemly questions.) Showing not telling, they've show the Frosts are quite capable of reaching across moderate distances to someone out of sight.

    The best explanation is that Christopher is right and the writers forgot to watch the previous episodes when they were doing the Fairburn episode.

    PS Somebody messed up my brackets for name-bolding. When I find out who it was, I will sue, somehow.
     
  18. stj

    stj Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    No episode tonight, midseason finale last week I suppose. A bump for a thought on the season as a whole thus far may be okay?

    Most of the actual progress is Jace's return to power, presumably to culminate in another existential threat to somebody, MU or IC or maybe Morlocks? Starting to wonder if they got notes from the network they couldn't have a government law enforcement official be as pretend ambiguous/shamelessly evil as Jace Turner?

    As to the IC's plans, the withholding violates character. Political people talk politics. These people don't because the show doesn't dare, it seems to me. Even so, at this point there isn't the slightest reason to think they have a clue about how to win whatever it is they are supposed to want. The US as mutant homeland? The discovery there is a mutant detection system that can be mounted to scan people just walking around means both the IC and the MU are doomed. The only IC mutant who is a serious threat is Polaris, but even she needs to sleep. Also, ceramic bullets. (No, ear buds to drown out Reeva, or hiring deaf people with guns means she's not a serious threat. A single sentinel robot can take the Frosts. And Andy just shoves people.) About the only thing that might make the slightest sense would be a plan to seize nukes.

    The MU could go hide indefinitely. Lauren could fake a diploma and go to college in Europe or Australia or Canada. Marcos could work for the cartel. John could go back to fighting. What the MU can't do is be underground while hanging out a shingle for clients. That is guaranteed to fail. But as of this moment, the MU is actually all about killing the IC. I don't think the show has done a good job showing how this is wise much less good. Most of the MU stuff is really about Reed. I don't understand why powers all of a sudden. Nor do I understand what the problem is? The pain of repressing powers, the pain from not repressing powers? It's not the elephant in the room, because it's too vague and undefined to be an elephant in the room. At best, an elephant turd in the room?
     
  19. crookeddy

    crookeddy Commodore Commodore

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    Super important ratings news. The last episode was another series low, after a temporary bump the episode before. Not good for those of us who like our shows to have endings instead of cliffhanger cancellations.
     
  20. The Scrooge Doctor

    The Scrooge Doctor Bah humbug! Premium Member

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    There's a good way around that: Have better writing. :p