It was an exciting finish but I’m not sure it lives up to scrutiny. Why did Devoe kidnap Barry? Was it to bide time to make the switch? I’m really enjoying this season so I’m giving this episode the benefit of the doubt.
Spoilers The Flash - Season 4
- Thread starter dahj
- Start date
Past episodes have told us how brilliant the Thinker and Team Flash have expressed doubts about beating him but this is the episode that really showcased how intelligent he really is and what a formidable foe he is. He masterfully manipulated Team Flash every step of the way.
I do worry for Caitlin. Looks like she is heading for another bad relationship if she starts liking this "Dominic", unaware that he is the Thinker. This is going to be the second time that she secretly dates the big villain (first being Zoom/fake Jay Garrick).
I do worry for Caitlin. Looks like she is heading for another bad relationship if she starts liking this "Dominic", unaware that he is the Thinker. This is going to be the second time that she secretly dates the big villain (first being Zoom/fake Jay Garrick).
That was in "I Know Who You Are" (appropriately), episode 20 of last season. Joe froze up when Cecile said "I love you," and was on the verge of breaking up with her because he didn't think he could tell her about Barry's secret. Then she was kidnapped by Killer Frost, and Joe felt guilty. At the end, after she'd been rescued, Joe told her everything with Barry's blessing.
I didn't get the sense it was weeks before, but it was before, so yes, that is unclear. Either the transfer didn't immediately kill DeVoe's body and he was residing in both brains for a while (sort of like how Spock was still able to fix the engines after transferring his katra to McCoy in The Wrath of Khan), or he (or Marlize) was remotely puppeteering his body to make it look like he was still in there.
In the comics, she's called Blacksmith and has the power "to reshape metal and merge it with flesh," as Wikipedia puts it. So it's more like metalbending from Avatar: the Last Airbender and The Legend of Korra than a magnetic power.
I didn't have the sense the body switch happened long before the party at all, nor that there was any mind sharing or puppeteering involved. As I understood it, Caitlin and Dominic escape, Amunet subequently gets the drop on Dominic again, delivers him to DeVoe, body switch happens, party happens.
No, I think it was pretty clear from the flashback that Amunet was working with DeVoe all along, and that her abduction of Caitlin was done specifically to get Dominic into Team Flash's confidence. As Ralph pointed out, it probably wasn't a coincidence that these two things happened at the same time.
^ Don't disagree, and don't see how that's inconsistent with what I said? I was just talking about the timing of events surrounding the body switch flashback.
No, I was saying that the mind transfer in the flashback happened before Caitlin was abducted, not after she rescued Dominic. But I went back and rewatched, and I think you were right that it was between the rescue and the party. In the flashback, I think I caught a glimpse of the bandage Dominic had behind his ear in the party scene, though it's hard to tell since it's a ridiculously small bandage to wear in the wake of what was supposedly delicate cranial surgery (but turned out to be as easy as pulling out a splinter). And Amunet said "I told you I had an important buyer," so the flashback wasn't their first meeting.
The Realist is correct about the timing:
Thinker hires Amunet
Amunet captures Dominic, injures him in the specific way the Thinker tells her
Barry and Caitlin are captured
Everybody escapes, as planned by the thinker
Amunet captures Dominic Again
Thinker does the body switch
Drops his dead body off at Barry's apartment
Christmas Party happens
Thinker hires Amunet
Amunet captures Dominic, injures him in the specific way the Thinker tells her
Barry and Caitlin are captured
Everybody escapes, as planned by the thinker
Amunet captures Dominic Again
Thinker does the body switch
Drops his dead body off at Barry's apartment
Christmas Party happens
That bothered me too. I figure that if anybody else had pulled it out he would have bled to death, but Caitlin was skilled enough to pull it out without doing any new damage, and the Thinker made sure the injury was such that that was possible.
Thanks. The article I've read states that Amunet Black's power is mechanokinesis - her body can fuse organic and inorganic matter. If that was the case, she should be able to manipulate not just metal but other objects too.
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Amunet_Black_(New_Earth)
A rather gruesome thought occurred to me. Did DeVoe's body die on its own from the effects of his condition and his wife stabbed a dead body to complete the ruse of framing Barry or did the wife actually stab Devoe to death after the mind transfer? I know she told Barry that she was willing to sacrifice for her marriage but if she actually stabbed her husband to death as part of the plan, yikes!!!!
I don't think that's where it's going.
For one thing, Barry already knows Dominic is DeVoe, why would he keep it a secret from the rest of the team?
How did DeVoe know Barry wasn't gonna run. What if he had gone home sooner to grab a bottle of wine or something..?
And one of those days, I'd like to see a pre-pubescent or octogenarian Meta. A kid speedester using speed to cheat at a spelling bee quiz or an old lady trying to win a bingo game or a slot machine....
And one of those days, I'd like to see a pre-pubescent or octogenarian Meta. A kid speedester using speed to cheat at a spelling bee quiz or an old lady trying to win a bingo game or a slot machine....
Devoe has said before that he has considered every possible outcome and in every one of them, he still wins. So presumably, he considered the possibility of Barry running and still deemed it a win for him. If Barry had run, he would be a fugitive, separated from his team. And, whether Barry runs and becomes a fugitive or goes to trial and gets locked up, the net result would still be the same: Team Flash would be weakened and it would be harder for them to fight Devoe.
Geez. I want that octogenarian speedster.
She'd be able to get all the pills she wants from the pharmacy without the nurse knowing, at the assisted living place...
"....to most people, I just shuffle around with my walker, but in my spare time, I use my powers to collect pills and sell them for money to pay for my cancer treatment. in doing so, I've enlisted one of my former idiot students...."
She'd be able to get all the pills she wants from the pharmacy without the nurse knowing, at the assisted living place...
"....to most people, I just shuffle around with my walker, but in my spare time, I use my powers to collect pills and sell them for money to pay for my cancer treatment. in doing so, I've enlisted one of my former idiot students...."
Here's a deleted scene from the episode:
(I posted a link to this already and only just realized it was in the LoT thread instead of the Flash thread. Lots of overlap lately...)
(I posted a link to this already and only just realized it was in the LoT thread instead of the Flash thread. Lots of overlap lately...)
There is one other possibility: Barry "runs" but instead of leaving Central City he becomes the Flash full time. He'd still get to be with Iris, but only at Star Labs. This would still take a mental toll on everyone, especially Barry, so still better for DeVoe than the status quo.
Similar threads
