The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station
- Thread starter JacksonArcher
- Start date
Well I, for one, am not so keen on original characters. Of course it all depends on the execution, so I have to reserve judgments till I see the movie. One reason I'm pessimistic is because the original character we've got in a major role so far (Rachel Dawes) was a weak link in both movies.
In the first movie, she was pretty much just a walking exposition device and in the second, she got a bit more meaningful dialog, but still felt like more of a plot device than a well-rounded, well-developed, three-dimensional character.
In general, I think it's smarter to use characters from the comics because they have so much history and their personalities and psychological natures have been explored in such depth having been written about in so many stories and interpretations over the years.
But, who knows? Nolan may have come up with some equally or even more interesting characters. I'm just skeptical because thus far in the Batman movies and his others, I think richness of character hasn't necessarily been his strong point.
He's got a hell of a visual sense, but I think his best characters so far have been ones that weren't his creation (i.e. The Joker).
In the first movie, she was pretty much just a walking exposition device and in the second, she got a bit more meaningful dialog, but still felt like more of a plot device than a well-rounded, well-developed, three-dimensional character.
In general, I think it's smarter to use characters from the comics because they have so much history and their personalities and psychological natures have been explored in such depth having been written about in so many stories and interpretations over the years.
But, who knows? Nolan may have come up with some equally or even more interesting characters. I'm just skeptical because thus far in the Batman movies and his others, I think richness of character hasn't necessarily been his strong point.
He's got a hell of a visual sense, but I think his best characters so far have been ones that weren't his creation (i.e. The Joker).
It completes the romantic triangle.
Bad girl and Good girl, who does Bruce favor more?
Are each somehow clued in due to his behavior that another woman may be in play and how does each woman respond?
But yeah I guess that would be the most likely plan.
"The Dark Knight" was an ensemble piece yes but I also look at it as a Batman character study. It's all about Bruce Wayne making choices as Batman and having to accept the consequences. He learns for the first team the burden of what being "The Dark Knight" is making Gordon's excellent monologue at the end of the film even more poignant in my mind. I think fans tend to look over Christian's performance in the movie because it is overshadowed considerably by Heath Ledger's Joker but it isn't a Joker movie. Sure he stole scenes but I personally believe that Chris Nolan meant "The Dark Knight" to be a Batman character study. I believe that he intends to fuse both of these character studies together in "The Dark Knight Rises" and have Bruce Wayne and Batman be in harmony thus the "Rises" part of the title. I don't believe as some fans do that he'll end the trilogy with Bruce quitting or his back broken. That wouldn't make sense or follow the themes he's been playing around with. I believe the core theme of Bruce Wayne is ultimately one of acceptance. Now I've rambled and no one will probably care what I've said or respond so please return back to your regularly scheduled Anticipation station thread 
I don't dispute that, but the article writer did say it was "surprising," and I took that to mean surprising that they were new characters rather than familiar ones. So at least some people -- not necessarily here on this BBS, but somewhere out there -- seem to have had that expectation.
Hmm. Despite what I said about original characters, if they were to include a character with that role in the story, I'd find it rather cool if it were Silver St. Cloud. Although I imagine a lot of people would have trouble getting past the name.
^ I'm a big Silver St. Cloud fan and thought she would have been a great addition to these films as a potential love interest after Rachel but I guess not. Kevin Smith recently has used her in his Batman: The Widening Gyre (I believe that's what it's called) story.
Gordon-Levitt looks exactly like Alberto Falcone, which makes it a touch disappointing that he wasn't given that role, but that's a minor point. Both independent side characters sound fine.
"The Dark Knight" was an ensemble piece yes but I also look at it as a Batman character study. It's all about Bruce Wayne making choices as Batman and having to accept the consequences. He learns for the first team the burden of what being "The Dark Knight" is making Gordon's excellent monologue at the end of the film even more poignant in my mind. I think fans tend to look over Christian's performance in the movie because it is overshadowed considerably by Heath Ledger's Joker but it isn't a Joker movie. Sure he stole scenes but I personally believe that Chris Nolan meant "The Dark Knight" to be a Batman character study. I believe that he intends to fuse both of these character studies together in "The Dark Knight Rises" and have Bruce Wayne and Batman be in harmony thus the "Rises" part of the title. I don't believe as some fans do that he'll end the trilogy with Bruce quitting or his back broken. That wouldn't make sense or follow the themes he's been playing around with. I believe the core theme of Bruce Wayne is ultimately one of acceptance. Now I've rambled and no one will probably care what I've said or respond so please return back to your regularly scheduled Anticipation station thread
I understand the point you are trying to make, even if I inherently disagree. Batman Begins definitely had more of a central focus on Bruce Wayne/Batman. The film was basically seen from Bruce Wayne's perspective. That's not saying Batman Begins didn't have a terrific ensemble cast - because it did- but The Dark Knight was less focused on telling things from Bruce Wayne's POV. It was really a story that told things from Harvey Dent, The Joker, Gordon and Batman's POV.
Begins starts and ends with Bruce Wayne/Batman and the story is really focused on him; The Dark Knight is a much more encompassing story and features a less solid thematic focus on Bruce Wayne/Batman. That's not saying Bruce Wayne/Batman didn't have good characterization in The Dark Knight - because he did- but we really didn't see things from his perspective in that film. I think there are a few scenes, like when Alfred consoles Bruce after the death of Rachel, where we get into his psyche a little bit and explore his thoughts and emotions on the situation, but Batman Begins provided a much more exhaustive and in-depth focus on what Bruce Wayne was really thinking and feeling throughout that film.
I kind of hope The Dark Knight Rises returns the focus primarily back onto Bruce Wayne/Batman. It can have an ensemble cast, since both films have had them, but I would like to really see the film from Bruce Wayne's perspective again. I think he's the most fascinating and interesting character in Batman's mythology, and I really enjoyed Batman Begins for being the first and to this point only live-action Batman film that's really been invested in exploring the psychology of Bruce Wayne.
I'm with you guys here. I really enjoyed the pyschological aspect of the movies, but not just Batman's, I thought they gave us some really interesting looks at other characters Gordon, and Dent and the Joker. It'll definitely be interesting to see what they do with the characters in the TDKR. As for how I think it'll end, I'm really thinking that it will end with Bruce finally accepting his role as Batman. I really think that that's the direction that the movies have been going in.
I'm not neglecting the other characters in "The Dark Knight". I just think that Bruce isn't totally as ignored as you guys seem to that's all.
Fair enough. Then again, you also have to look at it from the perspective of it being an adaptation, where one tends to automatically expect items such as characters to be adapted and come from the source material. Add that with the rising star factor of these two actors, it is a reasonable enough to think they are playing established characters as opposed to original ones. Not that there is anything wrong with original characters, but I can understand how the author was "surprised" by the announcement.
Haha...that's an awesome name! However, I see your point. Then again, this is a movie series where we've had characters named "Bane", "Ra's", "Joker", and "Batman". these are equally silly. I believe that if the character is written and preformed well, people will overlook a silly name.
I would have cast Silver with Rosamund Pike.
If all the casting rumors are true, and if the various threads of speculation have some merit, it seems like they have a lot to cover in this film: the Bane material, the Long Halloween/Dark Victory stuff, and the League of Shadows material. I have great faith in Nolan; if anyone can avoid the "trilogy curse" I think he can. But already this film seems destined to be overlong and has tons of characters.
So far the casting rumors have been proven false. No Talia, no Hugo Strange, no Alberto or Mario Falcone. As has been mentioned many times in this thread Nolan has demonstrated in both "The Dark Knight" and "Inception" that he can handle large ensemble casts. We don't know yet how all of these characters fit into the movie or how long their screen time will be. I think fans who have a concern about overuse of characters should wait until the plot is revealed and casting is finished. There were a lot of characters in "Batman Begins" and "The Dark Knight" both major and minor and he handled them fine.
AY, only the Hugo Strange, Falcone, and Black Mask rumors have been unequivocally proven to be false; the jury is still out on whether or not Miranda Tate is or is not an alias for Talia, and we more than likely won't know the answer to that one way or the other until the film comes out.
I personally find it very hard to believe that every single trade that reported on Talia being involved in TDKR were mistaken/mislead/wrong, but, as they say, 'only time will tell'.
I personally find it very hard to believe that every single trade that reported on Talia being involved in TDKR were mistaken/mislead/wrong, but, as they say, 'only time will tell'.
Miranda Tate could be an anagram for Talia' Al Ghul somehow lol. Yes, I acknowledge i'm reaching here!!
You've spent too much time in the Doctor Who trenches, my friend. If it were RTD making The Dark Knight Rises, you could be guaranteed a half-dozen anagrammed names.
Well, sure, some characters, but not all. Surely people remember that Rachel Dawes was not a comics character, nor was Mayor Garcia or the mob accountant Lau or the guy who threatened to expose Bruce's identity. And there have been prominent original characters in other superhero movies, such as Richard in Superman Returns, Mrs. Octavius and the Ditkovitch family in Spider-Man 2, Non and Ursa in Superman 2, and so on. So I fully expected that there would be at least some original characters in this movie.
Reasonable to think they'd be playing major characters, yes, but a major character isn't necessarily an established character, as the above examples show.
