The Classic Final Fantasy Games Thread

[Mr Silver]

I guess by the term "classic", we're talking anything before the recent Fabula Nova Crystallis series. The Final Fantasy series of games up until XI (not including the VII compilation which is awesome) are among my favourite games of all time. I'm particulary a massive fan of VII and VIII, which are often regarded as the best games in the series.

Anyway, I've been really disappointed with recent efforts, particulary XIII and all it's spin offs. It just isn't Final Fantasy in my opinion and Square-Enix has simply covered up it's shortfalls with cutting edge graphics, sound and lots of hype.

Now I think there are still stories left to tell with some of the earlier games. Sure, we've had a few spin offs from FFVII, but what about the stuff that hasn't been explored, like the distant past? We know that 2000 years before the date in the current game there was a crisis where Jenova landed on the planet and caused massive chaos amongst the Cetra. I'm pretty sure it's worth another game to tell the story of the Ancients and how they initially stopped Jenova.

Now VIII is pretty difficult to spin off because it involves a lot of time travel elements visiting the past and future throughout the game. Furthermore, the story ends pretty decisively, but that was more or less the same story where X was concerned and that got a sequel and it's even getting a remake! When I think of the things they could possibly cover in an VIII spin off...

First of all there is the Deep Sea Research facility and exactly what the scientists were experimenting with there. It's not worth a full game obviously, but it could be a major element in any spin off. I think we can all work out what eventually happened at the facility as it's hinted during exploration of the place in VIII. From what I can gather the scientists were experimenting with GF's as evidenced by Bahamut's distrust of humans and his apparent imprisonment in the blue forcefield. At some point the scientists excavated Ultima Weapon and ran for the hills, but not before sealing the creature at the bottom of the facility and releasing a ton of monsters to keep nosey visitors out. Still, this doesn't stop Squall and co!

There is also the matter of the Sorceress War, which we only saw the end of from Laguna's perspective. There's the matter of what exactly Esthar and Adel were doing in space and of course, why the Ragnarok spaceships were just abandoned.

Thoughts? And of course this is a discussion about any of the games so don't be dissuaded by my wishlist for spin offs!

 

[Kelthaz]

I only really like the SNES games and IX for some reason. The other PSX titles did nothing for me. Well, except for Final Fantasy Tactics which is close to the best game ever made.

 

[Angel4576]

X isn't getting a remake, just a remaster. SE clarified that yesterday;

Link

I think you're meaning to define the classic series as being I-XII rather than I-XI. XI was the online game that was absolute gash. For classic I'd imagine it either ends with X or XII dependent on whether or not you like XII.

Personally, whilst I loved VII, my favourite has always been VIII. The upnotch in graphics, the story, the characters, just preferred that to VII.

With regards to XIII and XIII-2 - I enjoyed XIII but not as a FF game. It was linear, which was fine, but again, not what I really expected from a FF game. As such I didn't really treat it as one, more of a game in its own right. Enjoyed it on that basis. XIII-2, would have been a return to 'classic' FF IMO, had they not watered down the core game to 25 hours and then hung a load of DLC off the back of it to flesh it out.

 

[P0sitr0nic]

Final Fantasy VI or nothing!!!

No seriously, in terms of story and fun value, the SNES ones are light years ahead of the later ones.

 

[Hound of UIster]

I think you can pinpoint the demise of Final Fantasy to around the time that Sakaguchi left Square and the company merged with Enix. Everything afterwards was just a slow spiral to FF14 as the business executives turned a unique and wonderful franchise into a typical cookiecuttter jrpg series that most people can't relate to.

 

[Robert Maxwell]

The original was good for its time. IV and VI are absolutely excellent. Probably worth noting that VI was the first game in the series to have all-new graphics, instead of upgraded NES graphics (as was the case for IV and V.) And it really shows in the level of detail in VI.

I never liked VII, but I love VIII. Couldn't really get into IX. I found X a lot of fun with a good story, but the dumbed-down mechanics kind of hurt it for me. But then they went totally nuts with XII!

The Tactics series was brilliant. Even the GBA/DS versions are pure gold.

Revenant Wings was kind of an interesting experiment--Final Fantasy does RTS.

I watched someone play XIII and it seemed to have hints of XII but the environment was definitely strange (for a FF game.)

I try not to be a snob about this series. None of the games have been really bad, it's just that the good ones are so good it's really noticeable when an entry doesn't live up.

 

[Mr Silver]

All of the SNES games were incredibly good and had so much more playability than many of the games being released at the time. I was still pretty young when the SNES was coming to an end and the trend still seemed to be for fast paced shooters and action games as opposed to RPG's.

I haven't played Tactics because it was impossible to get an import (fully translated too) copy over here in the UK when it was still being made. I'd imagine nowadays that a copy will set you back a small fortune! Still, the main thing about Tactics is my reluctance to give it a try because the concept of moving squares, or whatever it is scares me! One of the most important parts of Final Fantasy for me is the games not being too linear. I like the freedom to explore and do side quests from almost the start of the game.

 

[DigificWriter]

Anything other than XIII/XIII-2, huh? Okay. I've got to echo the love for VI and VIII (great games that, IMO, are incredibly under-appreciated), and toss in some love for IX and IV as well.

Admiral M, you should definitely give Tactics a try. It really is a great game, and is the game that introduced us to the world of Ivalice (the setting of the PS1 game Vagrant story, the Tactics Advance games, Final Fantasy XII, and Final Fantasy XII: Revenant Wings). The game was remade for the PSP and released under the name 'Final Fantasy Tactics: War of the Lions', so if you have that system, I'd suggest trying to find a copy.

 

[RyuRoots]

You'd be better off just playing the original FFT on your PSP (which you can get off PSN) if you want portable. The new translation is so stupidly flourishy that it's just as bad as if not worse than the original, sometimes flawed one.

I agree that FFT is an incredible game though, and would definitely recommend it if you haven't tried it. There's a LOT in the way of character/ability customization and if you ignore the ludicrously broken Orlandu the game can offer some fun challenge.

 

[Kelthaz]

Yeah, Orlandu is a game-breaker alright. You could probably solo the entire game with him very easily if you wanted to.

Also, once you find the game getting pretty easy you can always try some Straight Character Challenges (SCC) for fun. Essentially it means playing with your entire party as one class (and this means no abilities from outside that class). It's a very unique challenge to beat the entire game with nothing except for slow-ass knights or some Mediators or, god-forbid, Calculators.

 

[clint g]

I pretty much fall into the "everything after X is crap" camp. I had zero desire to play a Final Fantasy MMO, FFXII could have been decent if it wasn't for the shitty plot and forgettable characters and FFXIII was WAYYYYYYYYYY too linear. That being said, I've recently given FXIII another shot and I'm enjoying it more now than I did during the first go around. It still pales in comparison to FFX though (which was my personal favorite).

I watched someone play XIII and it seemed to have hints of XII but the environment was definitely strange (for a FF game.)

the environments (meaning the art design, not the linearity) was one of the things I liked the most about XIII. Sort of reminded me of FFX's Zanarkand on crack.

 

[CorporalClegg]

I love the SNES Final Fantasies--all three. I actually was lucky enough to get to play FFV back in the day. I never got very far or got much out of it thanks to the language barrier (and this was before translation FAQs were a dime a dozen), but I still enjoyed it.

The only PSX one I ever cared for was VIII (Unless you count Tactics). I know I'm in the total minority there, but I still think VII is way too overrated, and IX is just boring. Though I admit I would have loved it tons more if Beatrix had been fully playable.

X is actually one of my favorites, and I think, all around, is the best game in the series--at least the International version is.

And, I actually sort of liked XII too despite having never finished it.

Yeah, Orlandu is a game-breaker alright. You could probably solo the entire game with him very easily if you wanted to.

Also, once you find the game getting pretty easy you can always try some Straight Character Challenges (SCC) for fun. Essentially it means playing with your entire party as one class (and this means no abilities from outside that class). It's a very unique challenge to beat the entire game with nothing except for slow-ass knights or some Mediators or, god-forbid, Calculators.

There's also the FFT 1.3 patch which is worth a play through.

Though "insane difficulty" doesn't half cover it.

I've done several SCCs. (Like half the classes.) Once you learn the basic concepts, they start to get kind of easy. Calculators are the obvious exception, but I don't even know if it's possible to finish one without bending the rules a little.

 

[Robert Maxwell]

Hey, I also liked VIII the best out of the PSX titles! I think it puts some people off because it has a romantic focus, much more than other games in the series.

Well, that, and...

Spoiler: herpy derp spoilers

...the whole bit where the characters are all "Holy crap, we all grew up in the same orphanage and somehow forgot about it until our teen years! This makes sense, don't question it!"

Aside from that (and a materia system that's too easy to game), there's not much for me to complain about with VIII.

 

[CorporalClegg]

Hey, I also liked VIII the best out of the PSX titles! I think it puts some people off because it has a romantic focus, much more than other games in the series.

Well, that, and...

Spoiler: herpy derp spoilers

...the whole bit where the characters are all "Holy crap, we all grew up in the same orphanage and somehow forgot about it until our teen years! This makes sense, don't question it!"

Aside from that (and a materia system that's too easy to game), there's not much for me to complain about with VIII.

The love story is the part I liked the most. I always find it funny, though, that the people who rip FFVIII for being a love story are generally the same people who laud Xenogears. When you get right down to the meat and potatoes, XG was nothing but a boy meets girl, boy falls for girl, boy saves girl tale.

I also like how VIII was a bit more cerebral and much more thoroughly written. It didn't simply fall back on plot but tried to adhere to more "classic" literary concepts and ideals. The writers also didn't try to pigeonhole the typical fantasy tropes and archetypes into it.

 

[Kelthaz]

Yes, but Xenogears had lots of religious symbolism. As we all know cramming symbolism into a work, regardless of context, makes it true art.

 

[DigificWriter]

Like I already said, I firmly believe that VIII is a very underrated and under-appreciated game, and is actually my second-favorite game in the FF series, making up a Top 5 that looks like this:
1) FFX
2) FFVIII (as I just mentioned)
3) FFIX
4) FFVI and FFXIII (tie)
5) FFIV

My favorite aspects of VIII are the storyline and the 'draw' system, which I actually think worked much more organically in terms of the game's storyline than the Materia system in VII.

As an aside, I once tried to identify which job class each of the game's primary characters fell into and then play through the game by making sure each one adhered to said job class, which was a really fun way to play, and offered up a lot of different gaming challenges, especially in terms of the 'draw' system.

The thing that I enjoy the most about FFIX is its characters and the inordinate amount of homages that it contains to most, if not all, of the FF games that had been in existence at the time it was created. Another thing I really like about the game is that it could very well be considered a 'spiritual' sequel to the original Final Fantasy, if not a direct 'pseudo-sequel' (something that has enough references and similarities to something that it could be considered a direct sequel to said thing, but without actually ever being stated to be a direct sequel to said thing).

 

[Sephiroth]

I disliked 8's system. The way leveling worked was a real turn-off for me. 1,000xp per level with miniscule stat increases, and having your stats tied with the amount of magic you can stockpile. The best spells produce the best stat boosts, so its counterproductive to have a magic user. And the fact you are meant to simply turn the encounters off very early in the game is quite annoying.

There IS a work around for depending on junctions for (most) stats, but it's insane. You have to rush through the game until you get the magic lamp to summon Diablos. defeat Diablos and grind until you have the Encounter none ability. Don't do ANY leveling until you have free reign on the world map and either do the Pupu sidequest (you need to mod the Pupu card) or get the final summon, which gets you the Devour command. You also need to be creative with your summons to give them the stat boost on level up abilities. (which you have to equip :S ) Distribute these stat up abilities evenly among Squall and 2 characters you know you will use (prioritize the Speed+ and Luck+ abilities) and get to level 20. At level 20 equip the "devour" command and start eating the T-Rexaur enemies, which, after level 20 give you a Strength+1 stat per devour. At level 30 you can switch to devouring Adamantoise, Malboros, and Ruby Dragons, which give you Vitality+1, Spirit+1, and HP+10 respectively, and at level 40 Behemoths will give you Magic+1. To max out a 3 character party you would have to devour around 700 enemies per stat. Insane.

Throw in a hand full of obscure, incomplete side quests (some that required a special memory card that was never officially imported) and you have why 8 is the weakest of the playstation trilogy. That said, 8 has the strongest story and the best visuals of the trilogy, and the card game is one of the best mini games ever, so much so that they printed the cards in Japan and sold them with the regular ff8 trading cards and people still play it. (I have a hand-full of the cards myself and when I bring them along when I play Magic on the weekends people want to play Triple Triad instead.)

 

[Hound of UIster]

Hey, I also liked VIII the best out of the PSX titles! I think it puts some people off because it has a romantic focus, much more than other games in the series.

Well, that, and...

Spoiler: herpy derp spoilers

...the whole bit where the characters are all "Holy crap, we all grew up in the same orphanage and somehow forgot about it until our teen years! This makes sense, don't question it!"

Aside from that (and a materia system that's too easy to game), there's not much for me to complain about with VIII.

IX was still better.

VIII is the Twilight of Final Fantasy.

 

[clint g]

I disliked 8's system. The way leveling worked was a real turn-off for me. 1,000xp per level with miniscule stat increases, and having your stats tied with the amount of magic you can stockpile. The best spells produce the best stat boosts, so its counterproductive to have a magic user. And the fact you are meant to simply turn the encounters off very early in the game is quite annoying.

There IS a work around for depending on junctions for (most) stats, but it's insane. You have to rush through the game until you get the magic lamp to summon Diablos. defeat Diablos and grind until you have the Encounter none ability. Don't do ANY leveling until you have free reign on the world map and either do the Pupu sidequest (you need to mod the Pupu card) or get the final summon, which gets you the Devour command. You also need to be creative with your summons to give them the stat boost on level up abilities. (which you have to equip :S ) Distribute these stat up abilities evenly among Squall and 2 characters you know you will use (prioritize the Speed+ and Luck+ abilities) and get to level 20. At level 20 equip the "devour" command and start eating the T-Rexaur enemies, which, after level 20 give you a Strength+1 stat per devour. At level 30 you can switch to devouring Adamantoise, Malboros, and Ruby Dragons, which give you Vitality+1, Spirit+1, and HP+10 respectively, and at level 40 Behemoths will give you Magic+1. To max out a 3 character party you would have to devour around 700 enemies per stat. Insane.

Throw in a hand full of obscure, incomplete side quests (some that required a special memory card that was never officially imported) and you have why 8 is the weakest of the playstation trilogy. That said, 8 has the strongest story and the best visuals of the trilogy, and the card game is one of the best mini games ever, so much so that they printed the cards in Japan and sold them with the regular ff8 trading cards and people still play it. (I have a hand-full of the cards myself and when I bring them along when I play Magic on the weekends people want to play Triple Triad instead.)

Agreed a thousand percent. While i loved FFVIIIs story, I hated its gameplay. When I play final fantasy games, I very rarely use the steal command. When you get down to it, the draw system was just a glorified steal system. Also, instead of using magic for killing shit, you wind up hording it because you need it to buff your character...which is as lame as it gets.

 

[Mr Silver]

I'm replaying FFVIII at the moment, thanks to my discovery of the PSN store and the capabilities of the PSP!

It's an incredibly easy game and that is what lets it down. Sure, the Omega Weapon and Ultimecia's Castle battles can be challenging, but you are usually walking into battles at that stage of the game there with godlike powers!

In 4 hours total, I've managed to acquire pretty much every natural ability for the GF's and I did most of this on disc 2 thanks to Cactuar Island being registered at the edge of the Centra Desert. Squall is the highest level of the party and until I started leveling up, he was level 28 at maximum! Encounter None is a tool that allows you to control the game, but it can make the game incredibly boring at times.

Anyway, once you've got Ragnarok you just equip EN and head to the Islands Closest To Heaven and Hell and walk around tapping X as you draw all these high level spells. If you want to level up, just take Quistis to low HP and equip Initiative to her as you remove EN. Using Quistis on the islands takes the piss out of the game because her Degenerator limit break owns every creature the islands can throw at you! At lower levels you'll jump 4 or 5 levels each battle!

Once you've leveled up a bit so you can acquire better items through mugging and battles, simply junction Ultima to your attacking characters Str slot. I think I've got around 30 Ultimas on Squall and it's boosted his Str from 80 something (base) to 170 something! If you've done the CC quest, then you can refine cards constantly once you get to disc 4 allowing the possibility of gaining stat boost items to max out your stats.

I'm using the characters like so...

Squall: Warrior/Thief - Has Auto-Haste and Mug equipped to allow for the possibility of looting rare items and then escaping. Also has the highest Str stat at the moment and is the only one of the characters that will always get a hit on any enemy (Squall's Hit% is 255 by default and can't be tampered with)

Zell: Warrior - All you need to do with Zell is spam Punch Rush and Booya in battles with enemies who have a lot of HP. If you max Zell out, he becomes the most powerful character in the game, capable of doing around half a million HP damage with just one limit break (depending on how fast the player is). I have Counter on Zell and I've also junctioned Death to his ST/Atk so he can one hit kill 60% of enemies in teh game.

Irvine: Warrior - Don't bother with any ammo apart from Fast Ammo. If you get Irvine maxed out and you are fast enough, his Fast Shot limit break can do almost as much as Lionheart.

Quistis: Red Mage - I set her up as a healer, but I make sure to acquire her good limit breaks like Shockwave Pulsar (which can do 60k damage) and Degenerator (which makes a mockery of level 100 enemies!) so I can use her offensively as well.

Rinoa: Healer/White Mage - Angel Wing is good at times and Wishing Star can be useful, but she isn't that amazing offensively and many of her good abilities are more random than regular.

Selphie: Black Mage/Healer - I use her as a Black Mage early in the game because enemies have weak attacks and you can usually get to a powerful Slot cast before they manage to kill her. I beat XAT using Selphie and her ability to cast Thundaga and Ultima at any point in the game. The End is obviously the most powerful attack in the game, but it's extremely rare and you only want it in battles against the likes of Omega Weapon - in which you can't afford patience.

All GF's are terrible with the exception of Doomtrain (for it's status effects) and Eden (who can do 60k of damage) so I stop using them offensively once I get late into Disc 2. You only really need to upgrade weapons for your Warrior class characters (Squall, Zell and Irvine for me) and once you've got Lionheart and a powerful spell junctioned to Str, you're pretty much invincible anyway (you can get it on Disc 1 if you're patient and determined enough) so it renders a lot of character levelling a moot point, although you need everyone to be resonable during the Ultimecia battle.