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The all-inclusive "Sexiest Trek character" poll

Sexiest Trek characters?

  • Nyota Uhura (Nichelle Nichols) TOS

    Votes: 26 8.4%
  • Nyota Uhura (Zoe Saldana) STXI

    Votes: 32 10.3%
  • Janice Rand (Grace Lee Whitney) TOS

    Votes: 16 5.1%
  • Christine Chapel (Majel Barrett) TOS

    Votes: 3 1.0%
  • Number One (Majel Barrett) TOS

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Romulan Commander (Joanne Linville) TOS "The Enterprise Incident"

    Votes: 16 5.1%
  • Dr Helen Noel (Marianna Hill) TOS "Dagger of the Mind"

    Votes: 28 9.0%
  • Zarabeth (Mariette Hartley) TOS "All Our Yesterdays"

    Votes: 9 2.9%
  • T'Pring (Arlene Martel) TOS "Amok Time"

    Votes: 3 1.0%
  • Vina (Susan Oliver) TOS "The Cage"

    Votes: 11 3.5%
  • Reyna Kapec (Louise Sorel) TOS "Requiem for Methuselah"

    Votes: 3 1.0%
  • Edith Keeler (Joan Collins) TOS "The City on the Edge of Forever"

    Votes: 6 1.9%
  • Marta (Yvonne Craig) TOS "Whom Gods Destroy"

    Votes: 6 1.9%
  • Leila Kalomi (Jill Ireland) TOS "This Side of Paradise"

    Votes: 2 0.6%
  • Nona (Nancy Kovack) TOS "A Private Little War"

    Votes: 5 1.6%
  • Andrea (Sherry Jackson) TOS "What Are Little Girls Made Of"

    Votes: 24 7.7%
  • Marlena Moreau (Barbara Luna) TOS "Mirror Mirror"

    Votes: 15 4.8%
  • Ilia (Persis Khambatta) STI:TMP

    Votes: 12 3.9%
  • Saavik (Kirstey Alley) STII:TWOK

    Votes: 22 7.1%
  • Valeris (Kim Cattrall) STVI:TUC

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Deanna Troi (Marina Sirtis) TNG

    Votes: 31 10.0%
  • Dr Beverly Crusher (Gates McFadden) TNG

    Votes: 22 7.1%
  • Tasha Yar (Denise Crosby) TNG

    Votes: 12 3.9%
  • Ro Laren (Michelle Forbes) TNG

    Votes: 23 7.4%
  • K'Ehleyr (Suzie Plakson) TNG

    Votes: 12 3.9%
  • Selar (Suzie Plakson) TNG

    Votes: 10 3.2%
  • Vash (Jennifer Hatrick) TNG/DS9

    Votes: 13 4.2%
  • Robin Lefler (Ashley Judd) TNG

    Votes: 25 8.0%
  • Kamala (Famke Janssen) TNG "The Perfect Mate"

    Votes: 28 9.0%
  • Minuet (Carolyn McCormick) TNG

    Votes: 7 2.3%
  • Kira Nerys (Nana Visitor) DS9

    Votes: 47 15.1%
  • Jadzia Dax (Terry Farrell) DS9

    Votes: 58 18.6%
  • Ezri Dax (Nicole De Boer) DS9

    Votes: 54 17.4%
  • Leeta (Chase Masterson) DS9

    Votes: 34 10.9%
  • Tora Ziyal (Melanie Smith) DS9

    Votes: 5 1.6%
  • Sakonna (Bertila Damas) DS9 "The Maquis"

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Seven of Nine (Jeri Ryan) VOY

    Votes: 64 20.6%
  • Kathryn Janeway (Kate Mulgrew) VOY

    Votes: 11 3.5%
  • Kes (Jennifer Lien) VOY

    Votes: 24 7.7%
  • B'Elanna Torres (Roxann Dawson) VOY

    Votes: 24 7.7%
  • T'Pol (Jolene Blalock) ENT

    Votes: 57 18.3%
  • Hoshi Sato (Linda Park) ENT

    Votes: 34 10.9%
  • Gaila (Rachel Nichols) STXI

    Votes: 14 4.5%
  • James T. Kirk (William Shatner) TOS

    Votes: 22 7.1%
  • James T. Kirk (Chris Pine) STXI

    Votes: 25 8.0%
  • Spock (Leonard Nimoy) TOS

    Votes: 40 12.9%
  • Spock (Zachary Quinto) STXI

    Votes: 40 12.9%
  • Dr Leonard McCoy (DeForest Kelley) TOS

    Votes: 6 1.9%
  • Dr Leonard McCoy (Karl Urban) STXI

    Votes: 23 7.4%
  • Montgomery 'Scotty' Scott (James Doohan) TOS

    Votes: 1 0.3%
  • Montgomery 'Scotty' Scott (Simon Pegg) STXI

    Votes: 2 0.6%
  • Hikaru Sulu (George Takei) TOS

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Hikaru Sulu (John Cho) STXI

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Pavel Chekov (Walter Koenig) TOS

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Pavel Chekov (Anton Yelchin) STXI

    Votes: 6 1.9%
  • Christopher Pike (Jeffrey Hunter) TOS

    Votes: 8 2.6%
  • Christopher Pike (Bruce Greenwood) STXI

    Votes: 10 3.2%
  • Sarek (Mark Lenard) TOS

    Votes: 12 3.9%
  • Romulan Commander (Mark Lenard) TOS

    Votes: 7 2.3%
  • Sarek (Ben Cross) STXI

    Votes: 3 1.0%
  • Khan (Ricardo Montalban) TOS/STII:TWOK

    Votes: 5 1.6%
  • Jean-Luc Picard (Patrick Stewart) TNG

    Votes: 20 6.4%
  • William Riker (Jonathan Frakes) TNG

    Votes: 13 4.2%
  • Data (Brent Spiner) TNG

    Votes: 6 1.9%
  • Worf (Michael Dorn) TNG

    Votes: 8 2.6%
  • Geordie La Forge (LeVar Burton) TNG

    Votes: 1 0.3%
  • Wesley Crusher (Will Wheaton) TNG

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Q (John De Lancie) TNG/DS9/VOY

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Benjamin Sisko (Avery Brooks) DS9

    Votes: 8 2.6%
  • Dr Julian Bashir (Alexander Siddig) DS9

    Votes: 28 9.0%
  • Odo (Rene Auberjonois) DS9

    Votes: 2 0.6%
  • Miles O'Brien (Colm Meaney) TNG/DS9

    Votes: 1 0.3%
  • Jake Sisko (Cirroc Lofton) DS9

    Votes: 4 1.3%
  • Dukat (Marc Alaimo) DS9

    Votes: 9 2.9%
  • Elim Garak (Andrew J. Robinson) DS9

    Votes: 8 2.6%
  • Damar (Casey Biggs) DS9

    Votes: 11 3.5%
  • Weyoun (Jeffrey Combs) DS9

    Votes: 7 2.3%
  • Bareil Antos (Philip Anglim) DS9

    Votes: 7 2.3%
  • Quark (Armin Shimerman) DS9

    Votes: 2 0.6%
  • Chakotay (Robert Beltran) VOY

    Votes: 19 6.1%
  • Tom Paris (Robert Duncan McNeill) VOY

    Votes: 11 3.5%
  • Tuvok (Tim Russ) VOY

    Votes: 7 2.3%
  • Harry Kim (Gareth Wang) VOY

    Votes: 9 2.9%
  • EMH/The Doctor (Robert Picardo) VOY

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Jonathan Archer (Scott Bakula) ENT

    Votes: 16 5.1%
  • Charles "Trip" Tucker III (Connor Trineer) ENT

    Votes: 28 9.0%
  • Travis Mayweather (Anthony Montgomery) ENT

    Votes: 7 2.3%
  • Malcolm Reed (Dominic Keeting) ENT

    Votes: 6 1.9%
  • George Kirk (Chris Hemsworth) STXI

    Votes: 10 3.2%
  • Nero (Eric Bana) STXI

    Votes: 7 2.3%
  • other (male)

    Votes: 10 3.2%
  • other (female)

    Votes: 20 6.4%

  • Total voters
    311
People who prefer Seven to Ezri clearly only prefer her because of her curves, there's nothing else likable about Seven.

Oh, please. Intelligence, a weird sense of humor, and the vulnerable ex-borg kicked puppy look; sends my male protect-the-women gene all into overdrive.

There's no gene, my friend, only cultural conditioning. I certainly don't have the compulsion to "protect-the-women", and I'm every bit as male as you are. Saying men are hard-wired with the command "Protect women" is no different from saying women are hard-wired with the command "Obey men". :)
 
The only thing I ever liked about "Seven" was when she said to Chakotay, "I have changed the parameters of our relationship". What a hilariously cold way to tell someone you're breaking up with them, period, and you're not open to discussion about it. :lol:
 
I voted for both Ezri and Seven, however the guy is, well, wrong in being right.

What men are attracted to is the 6/7:10 - waist : hip ratio aka the hourglass figure. Why? Because women that have that hip ratio are more fertile, and more likely to produce viable offspring. And the closer a woman gets to that ideal ratio the more fertile she is.

Men instinctively know this, they instinctively look for women to procreate with, and so they consider women with that ratio sexier.

Of course, the rest of the body doesn't matter. She can have big breasts, small breasts, tall, a 100 pounds overweight, or small and petite, it's the waist : hip ratio that's indicator of fertility, and when men see that ratio, they're golden.

So, yes, the corset indeed helped a lot.
Oh my god. There are few things that annoy me as much as these 'evolutionary' theories of sexuality - that basically all human sexuality and relationships amount to procreation, and we're all basically just cavemen, either looking for spread their seeds and find a suitable womb, or walking wombs looking for healthy seed and a big strong protector and the best hunter. :brickwall: Just how ridiculous is it to believe that these are the things that motivate people's behavior in the 21st century?! I hoped we had moved on beyond the idea that the main - or even the only - purpose of sex is to have children. It makes no sense at all. If people were attracted to other people because they want to spread their seed or to be fertilized, how do you explain homosexuality? Why would anyone be attracted to people of the same sex? How do you explainpost-menopausal women still being interested in sex? (Or is that one of the reasons some people can't accept the fact that they are?) How do you explain sterile people being interested in sex? How do you explain the existence of oral sex, anal sex, BDSM and other forms of non-genital sex? Finally, how do you explain why so many people use birth control - if sex is about procreation, why are people having sex while trying hard not to conceive?

Yes, secondary sexual characteristics are a big part of the physical attractiveness. But is it that outrageous to suggest that usually this has absolutely nothing to do with finding a mother/father for our children? I do find a masculine shape of the body attractive, broad shoulders and narrow hips, reasonably developed muscles and lower fat percentage, deep voice... but I really do not believe that the reason I find men attractive is because I am subconsciously thinking "This guy looks like he has good genes! He could fertilize us me with his healthy sperm many times!" :rolleyes:

And if I actually find those secondary sexual characteristics attractive because they are sending some sort of message to my sucbonscious mind... well, what if the message is closer to something like: "This guy looks like he has a lot of testosterone, he looks like someone who'd be interested in sex - and um, capable of sex - very often?" How about that? If you ask me, when you find someone sexy, it's because you want to have sex with them. Not because you want to find a healthy womb or good genes for your children. :cardie:
 
I can't say I care for the "animal instinct" thing, either.

See...I guess I take a more philosophical attitude towards what folks finds sexy because of my interest in philosophy.

But again, "Tell me what a man/woman finds sexually attractive...and I will tell you his/her entire philosophy of life."

What one finds "sexy", frankly...is an indication of how one basically views one's life.
 
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I voted for both Ezri and Seven, however the guy is, well, wrong in being right.

What men are attracted to is the 6/7:10 - waist : hip ratio aka the hourglass figure. Why? Because women that have that hip ratio are more fertile, and more likely to produce viable offspring. And the closer a woman gets to that ideal ratio the more fertile she is.

Men instinctively know this, they instinctively look for women to procreate with, and so they consider women with that ratio sexier.

Of course, the rest of the body doesn't matter. She can have big breasts, small breasts, tall, a 100 pounds overweight, or small and petite, it's the waist : hip ratio that's indicator of fertility, and when men see that ratio, they're golden.

So, yes, the corset indeed helped a lot.
Oh my god. There are few things that annoy me as much as these 'evolutionary' theories of sexuality - that basically all human sexuality and relationships amount to procreation, and we're all basically just cavemen, either looking for spread their seeds and find a suitable womb, or walking wombs looking for healthy seed and a big strong protector and the best hunter. :brickwall:

It isn't theory, it's evidence and fact. You ask any man what the most attractive woman is in a line up, and each and every single one will pick the woman that has the figure closest to the 6/7:10 hip : waist ratio. And this is across cultural boundaries, and races.

It's even so much, that a man finds a woman that is ovulating more attractive than a woman who isn't. Subconsciously, through sent/pheromones and other cues he can pick up if a woman is ovulating and zeroes in on it. This happens consistently, again, again, and again in tests.

Just how ridiculous is it to believe that these are the things that motivate people's behavior in the 21st century?! I hoped we had moved on beyond the idea that the main - or even the only - purpose of sex is to have children. It makes no sense at all. If people were attracted to other people because they want to spread their seed or to be fertilized, how do you explain homosexuality? Why would anyone be attracted to people of the same sex?
A hormonal imbalance. More hormones of the opposite sex will make the brain grow more like that of the opposite sex. Enough like the opposite sex will produce sexual attraction of the opposite sex; thus attraction toward the same sex. Produce even more of the hormones, and the brain grows so much of the opposite sex, people will feel like they are the oppoiste sex trapped in the wrong body.

How do you explainpost-menopausal women still being interested in sex? (Or is that one of the reasons some people can't accept the fact that they are?)
Pleasure.

But also sex has evolved a secondary purpose beyond simply pleasure, it strengthens emotional bonds.

That does not however mean, that the mechanism for choosing mates is gone.

How do you explain sterile people being interested in sex?
Because whether or not the seed, or eggs are sterile, this has no impact on the brain.

How do you explain the existence of oral sex, anal sex, BDSM and other forms of non-genital sex?
Because this is pleasurable and strengthens bonds; however this has no impact on brain chemistry and underlying instincts.

Finally, how do you explain why so many people use birth control - if sex is about procreation, why are people having sex while trying hard not to conceive?
Because we have brains so evolved we can think and reason and override (some) instincts; that however does not mean those instincts are gone, or that we can override all of them. For one thing, we must first be aware these instincts exist, before we can recognize their influence and override them.

Yes, secondary sexual characteristics are a big part of the physical attractiveness. But is it that outrageous to suggest that usually this has absolutely nothing to do with finding a mother/father for our children? I do find a masculine shape of the body attractive, broad shoulders and narrow hips, reasonably developed muscles and lower fat percentage, deep voice... but I really do not believe that the reason I find men attractive is because I am subconsciously thinking "This guy looks like he has good genes! He could fertilize us me with his healthy sperm many times!" :rolleyes:
And yet tests show we do. Deep down, somewhere at the instinctual level, there is that consideration.

And if I actually find those secondary sexual characteristics attractive because they are sending some sort of message to my sucbonscious mind... well, what if the message is closer to something like: "This guy looks like he has a lot of testosterone, he looks like someone who'd be interested in sex - and um, capable of sex - very often?" How about that? If you ask me, when you find someone sexy, it's because you want to have sex with them. Not because you want to find a healthy womb or good genes for your children. :cardie:
And why does a person want to have sex with another person, beyond just pleasure, because deep down there's an instinct.

Your problem with these facts seem to be pride: "I'm not an animal." Sorry, but, you are, we all are, a incredibly intelligent and self-aware animal, but still just an animal.

An example of another instinct, this time in females, that on average a woman will wear sexier clothes when she is ovulating; she's in a sexier mood when she can get pregnant. You could override such an instinct if you're aware of them, and look out for when they influence you, but if you're not aware of them, they will influence you.

Another one; a woman is more likely to cheat on her partner while she's ovulating.

We find hairy bodies less attractive, because hair diminishes our cooling mechanism, full body sweating, that keeps our brains from overheating. Less body hair in our mates means offspring with less body hair, thus offspring that would be better and thus has better chances for surviving.

And we can go on and on. These things aren't theory, they're observed facts. Our instincts are a part of us even now.
 
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Your problem with these facts seem to be pride: "I'm not an animal." Sorry, but, you are, we all are, a incredibly intelligent and self-aware animal, but still just an animal.
Um, no. My problem with these "facts" :rolleyes: is common sense. I have no problem with the fact that I am an animal - what else would I be, a plant? :lol: But I sure am not looking for someone to fertilize me. In fact, I'd rather avoid it as long as possible. :rommie: I find it really silly that someone would go to such lengths to try to convince me that I am actually subconsiously yearning to get sperm in my ovum so I can get pregnant, even though I don't know it. :cardie:
 
What one finds "sexy", frankly...is an indication of how one basically lives one's life.

LOL! If that were the case, I'd be a huge slut. I'm not. I've been in a monogamous relationship for almost 20 years. I don't see how what somebody finds sexy tells you much of anything about their ethics, morals, or character, or how they go about living their lives. All it really tells you is who they'd like to have sex with if other factors were no consideration.
 
^Exactly. If no other factors were a consideration.

But...I do think I worded that last phrase awkwardly. I just re-wrote it.

See...it is a strong indicator of the subconcious mentality. A man views life a certain way, which expresses itself (in part) in what one finds "sexy".
 
See...it is a strong indicator of the subconcious mentality. A man views life a certain way, which expresses itself (in part) in what one finds "sexy".

I can agree with that phrasing. I think there is much more of a subconscious aspect to it than a conscious one. People usually don't decide to find somebody sexy. They either do or they don't. The view may change over time and become more conscious and even more of a decision, but the initial impression is a gut reaction quite divorced from choice or reason. It is also only partially based on viewpoint or beliefs. There is an instinctive component as well.
 
It isn't theory, it's evidence and fact. You ask any man what the most attractive woman is in a line up, and each and every single one will pick the woman that has the figure closest to the 6/7:10 hip : waist ratio. And this is across cultural boundaries, and races.

It's even so much, that a man finds a woman that is ovulating more attractive than a woman who isn't. Subconsciously, through sent/pheromones and other cues he can pick up if a woman is ovulating and zeroes in on it. This happens consistently, again, again, and again in tests.

A hormonal imbalance. More hormones of the opposite sex will make the brain grow more like that of the opposite sex. Enough like the opposite sex will produce sexual attraction of the opposite sex; thus attraction toward the same sex. Produce even more of the hormones, and the brain grows so much of the opposite sex, people will feel like they are the oppoiste sex trapped in the wrong body.

Pleasure.

But also sex has evolved a secondary purpose beyond simply pleasure, it strengthens emotional bonds.

That does not however mean, that the mechanism for choosing mates is gone.

Because whether or not the seed, or eggs are sterile, this has no impact on the brain.

Because this is pleasurable and strengthens bonds; however this has no impact on brain chemistry and underlying instincts.

Because we have brains so evolved we can think and reason and override (some) instincts; that however does not mean those instincts are gone, or that we can override all of them. For one thing, we must first be aware these instincts exist, before we can recognize their influence and override them.

<SNIP>
Your problem with these facts seem to be pride: "I'm not an animal." Sorry, but, you are, we all are, a incredibly intelligent and self-aware animal, but still just an animal.

An example of another instinct, this time in females, that on average a woman will wear sexier clothes when she is ovulating; she's in a sexier mood when she can get pregnant. You could override such an instinct if you're aware of them, and look out for when they influence you, but if you're not aware of them, they will influence you.

Another one; a woman is more likely to cheat on her partner while she's ovulating.

We find hairy bodies less attractive, because hair diminishes our cooling mechanism, full body sweating, that keeps our brains from overheating. Less body hair in our mates means offspring with less body hair, thus offspring that would be better and thus has better chances for surviving.

And we can go on and on. These things aren't theory, they're observed facts. Our instincts are a part of us even now.
You're tossing around the word "fact" quite a bit here.

What documentation do you have for these "facts"?
 
You're tossing around the word "fact" quite a bit here.

What documentation do you have for these "facts"?
I hadn't bothered to read his entire post the first time, but some of his so-called "facts" are not just dubious, but obviously wrong. Since he is not a woman, it is understandable that he is not aware of this, but the time of the month when a woman is actually in the physically "sexiest" or, if you will, horniest mood, is not ovulation, but pre-menstrual period and menstruation. And that's the time when a woman is least likely to get pregnant! I really would love to know how he explains that from the "it is all about reproduction" point of view?

This is really what all those so-called "facts" are like: men who postulated them claimed certain things - such as, that women are most sexually stimulated during ovulation - because they would support their thesis, not because of how much they are based on actual facts of life.

Or, he says "We find hairy bodies less attractive, because hair diminishes our cooling mechanism, full body sweating, that keeps our brains from overheating. Less body hair in our mates means offspring with less body hair, thus offspring that would be better and thus has better chances for surviving." Who is we? Men in general? Or people in general? As far as I am aware, there are quite a few women who love a certain degree of hairiness on a man. I think you'll find that female tastes vary in that respect. Some will tell you that hairy chest is "disgusting", other will tell you that it's masculine and sexy (and opinions will, again, be split on the acceptable level of hairiness). So how does that fit with those theories above? Unlike 3D Master, I will not speak for "everyone" or "we", but I will tell you that, while I am not into the Robin Williams-degree of hairiness :rommie: I prefer to see a somewhat hairy male body (in the normal boundaries) and that I am turned off by men who shave their bodies. So there, I have just disproved the theory. Why am I no turned on by a totally hairless male body? I should be looking for a mate with a better cooling mechanism? :rolleyes:
 
A hormonal imbalance. More hormones of the opposite sex will make the brain grow more like that of the opposite sex. Enough like the opposite sex will produce sexual attraction of the opposite sex; thus attraction toward the same sex. Produce even more of the hormones, and the brain grows so much of the opposite sex, people will feel like they are the oppoiste sex trapped in the wrong body.

OK, I've seen this, but it's not accurate. To quote the American Psychological Association:

"There is no consensus among scientists about the exact reasons that an individual develops a heterosexual, bisexual, gay, or lesbian orientation. Although much research has examined the possible genetic, hormonal, developmental, social, and cultural influences on sexual orientation, no findings have emerged that permit scientists to conclude that sexual orientation is determined by any particular factor or factors. Many think that nature and nurture both play complex roles;"

It isn't theory, it's evidence and fact. You ask any man what the most attractive woman is in a line up, and each and every single one will pick the woman that has the figure closest to the 6/7:10 hip : waist ratio. And this is across cultural boundaries, and races.
There is an established correlation between WHR and attractiveness, but you're deriving some pretty bold conclusions from that fact. Indeed, I'd say it's quite clear that not every man will give the same answer. WHR may be important, but it isn't some magic factor that overrides all other aspects of a woman's appearance.
 
You're tossing around the word "fact" quite a bit here.

What documentation do you have for these "facts"?

Go watch any documentary (series) on human sexuality, sex, and gender, like say "Brain Sex".

I hadn't bothered to read his entire post the first time, but some of his so-called "facts" are not just dubious, but obviously wrong. Since he is not a woman, it is understandable that he is not aware of this, but the time of the month when a woman is actually in the physically "sexiest" or, if you will, horniest mood, is not ovulation, but pre-menstrual period and menstruation. And that's the time when a woman is least likely to get pregnant! I really would love to know how he explains that from the "it is all about reproduction" point of view?

Most likely you're wrong, as it is a documented statistical fact that women dress sexier when they're ovulating, and are most likely to cheat when they are ovulation. That must be because they're not that sexually interested at all; it makes no sense.

This is really what all those so-called "facts" are like: men who postulated them claimed certain things - such as, that women are most sexually stimulated during ovulation - because they would support their thesis, not because of how much they are based on actual facts of life.
Nope, they keep propping up in research, not theory, but simple questionnaires and statistics.

Or, he says "We find hairy bodies less attractive, because hair diminishes our cooling mechanism, full body sweating, that keeps our brains from overheating. Less body hair in our mates means offspring with less body hair, thus offspring that would be better and thus has better chances for surviving." Who is we? Men in general? Or people in general? As far as I am aware, there are quite a few women who love a certain degree of hairiness on a man. I think you'll find that female tastes vary in that respect. Some will tell you that hairy chest is "disgusting", other will tell you that it's masculine and sexy (and opinions will, again, be split on the acceptable level of hairiness). So how does that fit with those theories above? Unlike 3D Master, I will not speak for "everyone" or "we", but I will tell you that, while I am not into the Robin Williams-degree of hairiness :rommie: I prefer to see a somewhat hairy male body (in the normal boundaries) and that I am turned off by men who shave their bodies. So there, I have just disproved the theory. Why am I no turned on by a totally hairless male body? I should be looking for a mate with a better cooling mechanism? :rolleyes:
BBC: Horizon - What's the Problem with Nudity? http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00j0hnm

A hormonal imbalance. More hormones of the opposite sex will make the brain grow more like that of the opposite sex. Enough like the opposite sex will produce sexual attraction of the opposite sex; thus attraction toward the same sex. Produce even more of the hormones, and the brain grows so much of the opposite sex, people will feel like they are the oppoiste sex trapped in the wrong body.

OK, I've seen this, but it's not accurate. To quote the American Psychological Association:

"There is no consensus among scientists about the exact reasons that an individual develops a heterosexual, bisexual, gay, or lesbian orientation. Although much research has examined the possible genetic, hormonal, developmental, social, and cultural influences on sexual orientation, no findings have emerged that permit scientists to conclude that sexual orientation is determined by any particular factor or factors. Many think that nature and nurture both play complex roles;"

You know what the problem is with psychologists?

They're not neurologists.

In other words; if they admit that homosexuality and other issues, especially things that are problematic, are neurological in nature and not psychological in nature - they're all but out of job.

You go however to those who actually deal with genetics, the hormones, the neurology, the brain structure; anyone that did actual tests with the actual physical brains, you'll find not one of them will say it's nurture. It's all the structure of the brain with them, nothing to do with nurture at all.

It isn't theory, it's evidence and fact. You ask any man what the most attractive woman is in a line up, and each and every single one will pick the woman that has the figure closest to the 6/7:10 hip : waist ratio. And this is across cultural boundaries, and races.
There is an established correlation between WHR and attractiveness, but you're deriving some pretty bold conclusions from that fact. Indeed, I'd say it's quite clear that not every man will give the same answer. WHR may be important, but it isn't some magic factor that overrides all other aspects of a woman's appearance.
Which doesn't matter. Other factors come from the higher brain functions, they are capable of overriding instinct. However, instinctively, it's always the 6/7:10 WHR. That's the first part that attracts us, the WHR is even one of the first parts of another person's body we check out and a major part of how we determine (especially from afar) whether we're dealing with a man or a woman.

See the above BBC Horizon documentary.
 
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You're tossing around the word "fact" quite a bit here.

What documentation do you have for these "facts"?

Go watch any documentary (series) on human sexuality, sex, and gender, like say "Brain Sex".
So your backup is "something I saw on TV"? That's not likely to win anyone over to your side of the discussion.

:rolleyes:

It isn't simply "something one saw on tv", it's a documentary series made by scientists and experts in the field. It's about as close as you can get to doing the research yourself.
 
I hadn't bothered to read his entire post the first time, but some of his so-called "facts" are not just dubious, but obviously wrong. Since he is not a woman, it is understandable that he is not aware of this, but the time of the month when a woman is actually in the physically "sexiest" or, if you will, horniest mood, is not ovulation, but pre-menstrual period and menstruation. And that's the time when a woman is least likely to get pregnant! I really would love to know how he explains that from the "it is all about reproduction" point of view?

Most likely you're wrong, as it is a documented statistical fact that women dress sexier when they're ovulating, and are most likely to cheat when they are ovulation. That must be because they're not that sexually interested at all; it makes no sense.
Um... I don't know when women are 'dressing sexier' (my guess is, when they are going out...) or 'more likely to cheat' (I would really love to know how that research was conducted!)... I am speaking of periods of higher physical arousal.Ovulation is one, but it is nowhere near, in my experience, to pre-menstrual/early menstrual period. I speak from experience, and OK, maybe I am some kind of aberation or freak of nature and no other woman in the world has similar hormonal cycles :rolleyes:, but at least I can speak from experience, since I am female, which can't be said of some other people here who are professing to be the experts on female sexuality. :vulcan:

BBC: Horizon - What's the Problem with Nudity? http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00j0hnm
And what about it?
 
Go watch any documentary (series) on human sexuality, sex, and gender, like say "Brain Sex".
So your backup is "something I saw on TV"? That's not likely to win anyone over to your side of the discussion.

:rolleyes:

It isn't simply "something one saw on tv", it's a documentary series made by scientists and experts in the field. It's about as close as you can get to doing the research yourself.
Yet you're quoting "facts" from memory and offering the reader nothing in the way of verification. You haven't done any research other than watching the show on TV, so your claims cannot be treated as fact. If you want to argue those items as opinion then that's very different and I will support your choice in doing so.
 
BBC: Horizon - What's the Problem with Nudity? http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00j0hnm
And what about it?

Maybe you should go watch it.

Yet you're quoting "facts" from memory and offering the reader nothing in the way of verification. You haven't done any research other than watching the show on TV, so your claims cannot be treated as fact. If you want to argue those items as opinion then that's very different and I will support your choice in doing so.

Everyone quotes facts from memory. And I've given plenty show as verification. Of course, that requires you to go watch the verification. And another thing, it is NOT a show. It's a documentary, and a scientific program. These things are not opinion; anyone who goes to watch those things, or look little around on human sexuality, will find the same things I'm saying.
 
You know what the problem is with psychologists?

They're not neurologists.

In other words; if they admit that homosexuality and other issues, especially things that are problematic, are neurological in nature and not psychological in nature - they're all but out of job.

You go however to those who actually deal with genetics, the hormones, the neurology, the brain structure; anyone that did actual tests with the actual physical brains, you'll find not one of them will say it's nurture. It's all the structure of the brain with them, nothing to do with nurture at all.

So not just the hormones? I really doubt that a respected professional body is misrepresenting the evidence. See also the American Academy of Pediatrics: http://aappolicy.aappublications.org/cgi/reprint/pediatrics;113/6/1827.pdf
There's plenty of interesting research, but there is not, as far as I can see, a conclusive, widely accepted answer to the question of what determines sexual orientation. The point I'm trying to make is that your explanation of a hormonal imbalance is an oversimplification. It may contain part of the truth, but it probably isn't the whole truth.

Lord knows why I'm posting this on a Star Trek message board :lol:
 
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