Tell E.T. skeptics where to stick it

[Itisnotlogical]

It doesn't matter if they live for 2000 years and can spend another 2000 in suspended animation; the chances of anyone stumbling on our little rock are infinitessimal.

Who knows- maybe their home planet is a star like the sun, and the concept of planets made of things like soil and rock is infinitely fascinating to them. Who knows what the hell an alien would do? The other application for the word "alien" is for something foreign and unfamiliar. I hate to use a sci-fi show to prove my point, but it is a Star Trek forum. Despite McCoy's and Spock's insistance that something like a silicon-based life form absolutely cannot exist in "The Devil in The dark", they found one anyway.

 

[Nardpuncher]

People project moral and philosophical values into the whole question of alien intelligence - among other things we get the "deserving/significant/insignificant" stuff which underscores the fact that when people conjure up alien beings (especially for fictional purposes but even in scientific discussions) they're looking for affirmations of one kind or another about human beings and our putative "place in the Universe."

I know that. I just wanted to hear Nardpuncher explain it to us.

I mean people trying to act wise by ridiculing the actual size of our planet.
You can argue about the worthiness of the human race with someone till you're blue in the face.

 

[Deckerd]

The actual size of our planet is small. That's not ridicule. It's a fact. Small is beautiful.

 

[Nardpuncher]

The actual size of our planet is small. That's not ridicule. It's a fact. Small is beautiful.

Aw jeez man...people were comparing it to what aliens may think...we don't know what size their home planet is.

 

[Deckerd]

I'm not comparing it to aliens. I'm comparing it to everything else in the galaxy.

 

[TheGodBen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1w8hKTJ2Co

Earth is really quite small.

 

[Nardpuncher]

I'm not comparing it to aliens. I'm comparing it to everything else in the galaxy.

Oh man where's that facepalm Picard pic when you need it?

 

[Deckerd]

Facepalm? You're the one suggesting that anyone disagreeing with you is insulting the Earth. You're the one applying your own sense of reward to a topic which is completely divorced from human values.

 

[Nardpuncher]

Facepalm? You're the one suggesting that anyone disagreeing with you is insulting the Earth. You're the one applying your own sense of reward to a topic which is completely divorced from human values.

OK, just breathe and take a look back at the posts again and read carefully.
I'm sorry if my not believing in UFOs made you angry.

 

[Zachary Smith]

Facepalm? You're the one suggesting that anyone disagreeing with you is insulting the Earth. You're the one applying your own sense of reward to a topic which is completely divorced from human values.

OK, just breathe and take a look back at the posts again and read carefully.
I'm sorry if my not believing in UFOs made you angry.

THEY believe in YOU. I know. I've asked them . . .

 

[Nardpuncher]

Facepalm? You're the one suggesting that anyone disagreeing with you is insulting the Earth. You're the one applying your own sense of reward to a topic which is completely divorced from human values.

OK, just breathe and take a look back at the posts again and read carefully.
I'm sorry if my not believing in UFOs made you angry.

THEY believe in YOU. I know. I've asked them . . .

That's more like it!

 

[FordSVT]

Why wouldn't they be interested in us?

"Why shouldn't I believe in fairies?" That's the wrong way of thinking about things like this, the correct question is "Why should I believe in fairies?" and by extension "Why would aliens be interested in us?"

Intellectual curiosity is a reasonable explanation, but if they have the technology which would allow them to travel across the galaxy in a relatively brief period then we'd probably just be one of thousands of species they'd have the potential to study. I see no reason why they'd choose to spend the time studying us rather than the Glarnax species from Hulbar 5, or the Terran trout.

However, I'm not going to deprecate my entire species in order to reinforce a belief that aliens not only can't visit us, according to physics (which is at least a valid reason to argue against the chances of ET coming here), but wouldn't bother even if they could.

I'm not depreciating our species, I just see no reason to inflate it. It's a huge galaxy and the Milky Way is a tiny part of this universe, so why would we be considered unique enough to warrant study?

I'm not arguing for the existence of ET visitation, I'm arguing against the dismissal of the idea based on some of the human-based variables sceptics such as yourself seem to have come up with. Argue all you want with facts, but don't argue alien psychology with me.

Why are we studying a single steam vent on the bottom of the ocean floor for bacteria? Ocean's a huge place, full of stuff to look at... Gotta study something... if not us, what?

 

[Deckerd]

For the record, I've never thought that if anyone stumbled on us, we would not be the prize of the galaxy. We ARE the prize of the galaxy. All I'm saying is the chances of anyone finding us are too small to be significant.

 

[FordSVT]

Von Neumann probes might significantly increase the chances of someone finding us accidentally.

There's also the (extremely low yes) probability that we're actually surrounded by a galaxy teeming with intelligent life, in which case someone making contact with us would in turn be given a higher probability.

We just don't know. I certainly don't have proof that aliens exist, I wish I did!

 

[TheGodBen]

I'm not arguing for the existence of ET visitation, I'm arguing against the dismissal of the idea based on some of the human-based variables sceptics such as yourself seem to have come up with. Argue all you want with facts, but don't argue alien psychology with me.

I'm not arguing alien psychology, I'm arguing statistics. You don't understand how big this universe is because nobody can, it is so huge that it is beyond human comprehension. And that's only the observable universe, there is a chance that the universe expands much further than we now know.

In all that space, in all that time, and with all those wonders contained within, we have no reason to expect that humans are considered worthy of study. If aliens had the ability to study 1%, 10%, or even 50% of this galaxy, there is no reason for us to expect that they would choose to study us rather than something else. I'm not saying that it is impossible, I'm just saying that its improbable.

Why are we studying a single steam vent on the bottom of the ocean floor for bacteria? Ocean's a huge place, full of stuff to look at... Gotta study something... if not us, what?

And while they study that steam vent 99 others are ignored.

 

[Deckerd]

I disagree Godben. If any travellers came across the Earth it would be mind-blowing, no matter how big the intelligence or indeed how many heads they had.

 

[Argus Skyhawk]

Someone can correct me if I'm mistaken, but I believe I have read that, thanks to radio and TV broadcasts, the Earth outshines the rest of the solar system in the radio wave spectrum. It seems to me that aliens from afar could notice this and say, "Hey, that planet over at that otherwise unremarkable corner of the galaxy is pumping out tons of radio wave radiation which does not appear to be naturally occurring. Let's go check it out." It probably won't happen within our lifetimes since most broadcasts have propagated far less than 100 lightyears from Earth, but give them time.

 

[Jadzia]

I often get the impression that the human desire to know of alien civilizations is more about wanting salvation than it is about discovery. It's a dream that provides hope for the fate of our own civilization. Aliens would be the closest things we have to gods in a irreligious world.

 

[TIN_MAN]

^^I think it's about knowing ourselves better, isn't that really why we study any unknown? Only by comparieng and contrasting ourselves with something else can we begin to truly comprehend who and what we are?

 

[Zachary Smith]

It doesn't matter if they live for 2000 years and can spend another 2000 in suspended animation; the chances of anyone stumbling on our little rock are infinitessimal.

What is this "stumbling" onto us nonsense? For crying out loud, we OURSELVES are on the verge of being able to detect earth-like planets from tens of light years out or more. Anyone with the capability of deep space travel who bothers to look at all will know we're here.