Tawny Newsome and Justin Simien developing new live-action Trek series

[Dukhat]

"Turning Star Trek into a sitcom" is not exactly accurate. When you say Star Trek, I assume you mean the general franchise. They are not turning the general franchise into a sitcom. Just one show.

It's obvious from Kurtzman"s comments in the past that this is an intentional strategy . He often says certain shows will resonate with some and certain shows with others.

So it's obvious they want to mix in concepts using traditional Trek formulas and some that are not for multiple shows. . He wants to throw the biggest net possible to reach Trek fans and non Trek fans.

Is this a good methodology/is it working? I have my doubts. But that is what they are trying to do.. Think they want a corner of the Star Trek universe to be a comedy, not the entirety of the franchise.

That was fine when there were 5 shows concurrently being produced. One show is a silly animated comedy? Fine, I don’t need to watch it if I don’t want to because I have four other shows I can choose from. But by the time Tawny’s pet project gets off the ground, the only other show that will probably be on the air at the same time is SFA, and that’s not really much of a choice.

In my opinion, Star Trek doesn’t do comedy well. The last time it worked was The Voyage Home, and that was because the comedic elements weren’t thrown in your face and were just undertones of a more serious, bigger story. I get the feeling that the premise of a hotel planet where hijinks occur every episode isn’t going to have a more serious bigger story than that.

To me, it seems that these days these show runners are just using the Star Trek name to peddle their own fanfic projects. Osunsanmi wants to make a Guardians of the Galaxy/Suicide Squad movie? Let’s use Star Trek to make that happen. McMahon wants to make Rick and Morty in space? Let’s use Star Trek to make that happen. Tawny wants to make a comedy show set at a hotel? Let’s use Star Trek to make that happen.

 

[F. King Daniel]

To me, it seems that these days these show runners are just using the Star Trek name to peddle their own fanfic projects. Osunsanmi wants to make a Guardians of the Galaxy/Suicide Squad movie? Let’s use Star Trek to make that happen. McMahon wants to make Rick and Morty in space? Let’s use Star Trek to make that happen. Tawny wants to make a comedy show set at a hotel? Let’s use Star Trek to make that happen.

I think it's more along the lines of those are the safe-sounding pitches which the Trek-novice money men above agreed to. Insert-popular-thing-here-plus-Trek.

 

[Dukhat]

I think it's more along the lines of those are the safe-sounding pitches which the Trek-novice money men above agreed to. Insert-popular-thing-here-plus-Trek.

Oh, I’m well aware of that. And to me, that’s the problem. I would rather CBS come up with their own idea for a show rather than hire showrunners that are just going to easily convince them that such-and-such idea of theirs is what the ‘fans’ truly want. And if CBS’s idea is problematic, I would want them to hire a showrunner that will tell them that, but make changes to the core idea to make it better without trying to weasel in their own ideas.

Edit: After re-reading your post, I think I may have misunderstood you. Are you saying that CBS had the idea for a comedy show set at a hotel, and just hired Newsome to write it? Because I don’t think that’s what happened.

 

[eschaton]

Here's the central problem that Paramount has:

• Trek fans, by and large, want fanwank.
• Not enough Trek fans subscribe to Paramount Plus to make it financially viable to just cater to superfans.

Because of all of this, Secret Hideout is constantly fumbling around for "Trek, and..." hoping to wheedle in the superfans, plus some other group. In practice, this hasn't worked, because every newer Trek show aside from many SNW (which is aggressively derivative of the historic Trek format) alienates some aspect of the Trek base, and it doesn't seem like any new fans have been brought into the franchise. But that's what it's trying to do.

 

[Dukhat]

Here's the central problem that Paramount has:

• Trek fans, by and large, want fanwank.

That's not quite true. That's just what CBS/Paramount think fans want. But even if every single Trek fan wanted that, they still shouldn't cater just to them. Because that's production suicide. That’s how you get movies like Generations, which catered only to Star Trek fans because the casual movie audience would have no clue what’s going on.

 

[eschaton]

That's not quite true. That's just what CBS/Paramount think fans want. But even if every single Trek fan wanted that, they still shouldn't cater just to them. Because that's production suicide. That’s how you get movies like Generations, which catered only to Star Trek fans because the casual movie audience would have no clue what’s going on.

I think fans say they don't want fanwank, but it's pretty clear they're either lying or the fans that say that are a small minority.

TWOK was the fanwankiest of TOS movies - a direct sequel to a TOS episode. It was a smash hit. FC was the most well-received of the TNG movies, and it was an incredibly fanwanky movie, with both subplots (the Borg and Zephran Cochrane) relying upon prior Trek lore. Or, to give a modern example, look at Picard Season 3, which many fans ate up. Or hell, Prodigy Season 2 for that matter.

I'd also say that part of why Discovery and Seasons 1/2 of Picard were disliked was they didn't try and be all that fanwanky. Early discovery honestly could have been an entirely original sci-fi setting with just some changes to names/terminology. Picard's first season went out of its way to not center things which would have been comforting for a TNG fan to see (which the show eventually totally undermined).

Of course "popularity" is all theoretical, because no streamers actually release view data, so we don't know how many people really watch each show. All we can make is educated guesses based upon online discussion.

 

[fireproof78]

Here's the central problem that Paramount has:

• Trek fans, by and large, want fanwank.
• Not enough Trek fans subscribe to Paramount Plus to make it financially viable to just cater to superfans.

Because of all of this, Secret Hideout is constantly fumbling around for "Trek, and..." hoping to wheedle in the superfans, plus some other group. In practice, this hasn't worked, because every newer Trek show aside from many SNW (which is aggressively derivative of the historic Trek format) alienates some aspect of the Trek base, and it doesn't seem like any new fans have been brought into the franchise. But that's what it's trying to do.

I think this is closer to the truth, no matter what I might think. Inevitably, when a new Trek is announced the first several discussion points are "Where's so and so? Can we maybe X's relative or ancestor." Picard had a thread dedicated to it on various possible returning characters.

No matter one's view on fan service, the things that people chitter about are the references. So Paramount goes for that again because they want a semi-sure thing.

And if something is just ok, the louder voices insist about more elements to make it like Trek. Novelty and innovation are not rewarded beyond a "meh."

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

Anyone can have a new idea, it's good ideas I'm interested in.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

But by the time Tawny’s pet project gets off the ground, the only other show that will probably be on the air at the same time is SFA, and that’s not really much of a choice.

I see no reason to assume that SFA won't be a serious show.

God knows I've had my reservations about this NEW program, but I have faith that SFA will still give Trek the dose of drama that it needs.

There's a place for all sorts of different shows in this universe. Whatever your feelings about this new Newsome/Simien show, if you want Trek to take it straight, I'm sure SFA will fit the bill.

 

[fireproof78]

Anyone can have a new idea, it's good ideas I'm interested in.

Define "good idea"?

The only ideas I see being praised as good are going to the past and seeing how they are doing. There's no interest in young people, or watching characters grow or change within the Star Trek paradigm unless they are in Starfleet.

That seems highly limited to me. I don't see it as good.

 

[Dukhat]

I see no reason to assume that SFA won't be a serious show.

I wasn’t saying that it wouldn’t be. Just that if the only two choices I have for Star Trek series are a show about cadets in a 32nd century Academy, or a show about comedy hijinks at a hotel, neither of those things will make me pay for P+.

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

Define "good idea"?

I don't know what a good idea would be, not with any certainty. Something needs to be tested in action before we know whether it works or not. But I'm not about to reward novelty and innovation if it doesn't result in something I consider to be entertaining.

Star Trek: Gardener's World - A series about a team of Starfleet gardeners trying to get their flowers to thrive in an alien climate.

Star Trek: 24 - A series about Starfleet Intelligence operatives racing to stop a Section 31 operation to assassinate a Klingon general within the day, by any means necessary.

Star Trek: Q in Law - Q is banished to 21st century Earth until he can prove he understands morality and justice. To speed up the process he decides to team up with a cop and solve crimes.

See, I can throw ideas at the wall as good as they can. Doing something different is easy. Novelty is easy. At least when it involves taking 'Star Trek' and adding 'school drama' or 'sit-com' etc.

 

[fireproof78]

I don't know what a good idea would be, not with any certainty. Something needs to be tested in action before we know whether it works or not. But I'm not about to reward novelty and innovation if it doesn't result in something I consider to be entertaining.

Star Trek: Gardener's World - A series about a team of Starfleet gardeners trying to get their flowers to thrive in an alien climate.

Star Trek: 24 - A series about Starfleet Intelligence operatives racing to stop a Section 31 operation to assassinate a Klingon general within the day, by any means necessary.

Star Trek: Q in Law - Q is banished to 21st century Earth until he can prove he understands morality and justice. To speed up the process he decides to team up with a cop and solve crimes.

See, I can throw ideas at the wall as good as they can. Doing something different is easy. Novelty is easy. At least when it involves taking 'Star Trek' and adding 'school drama' or 'sit-com' etc.

None of these sound bad and have potential with each premise. Maybe not the Q show.

And most of recent Trek output has been entertaining so I'm again failing to see the problem with a sitcom, or a Section 31 show in the Star Trek world?

 

[F. King Daniel]

Oh, I’m well aware of that. And to me, that’s the problem. I would rather CBS come up with their own idea for a show rather than hire showrunners that are just going to easily convince them that such-and-such idea of theirs is what the ‘fans’ truly want. And if CBS’s idea is problematic, I would want them to hire a showrunner that will tell them that, but make changes to the core idea to make it better without trying to weasel in their own ideas.

Edit: After re-reading your post, I think I may have misunderstood you. Are you saying that CBS had the idea for a comedy show set at a hotel, and just hired Newsome to write it? Because I don’t think that’s what happened.

I was saying that people are coming up with their own ideas, but pitching them to higher ups as Popular Thing But Trek, and that's what is filtering through to us in marketing speak as Guardians of the Galaxy meets Trek for Section 31, or Rick and Morty meets Trek for Lower Decks. Even though they're not (in Lower Decks' case, at least) really like that at all, except in a very superficial sense.

 

[Dukhat]

I was saying that people are coming up with their own ideas, but pitching them to higher ups as Popular Thing But Trek, and that's what is filtering through to us in marketing speak as Guardians of the Galaxy meets Trek for Section 31, or Rick and Morty meets Trek for Lower Decks. Even though they're not (in Lower Decks' case, at least) really like that at all, except in a very superficial sense.

That’s what I thought you meant. And again, despite what those shows turned out to be, they’re still only catering to a specific small segment of the total streaming viewing population. People have lots and lots of choices of streaming shows to watch (unlike the days of TNG where there was zero competition with shows like it), and in order for P+ to get more subscribers, they need to stop catering just to the viewers who want fanwank like LDS.

 

[Daedalus]

I don't know what a good idea would be, not with any certainty. Something needs to be tested in action before we know whether it works or not. But I'm not about to reward novelty and innovation if it doesn't result in something I consider to be entertaining.

Star Trek: Gardener's World - A series about a team of Starfleet gardeners trying to get their flowers to thrive in an alien climate.

Star Trek: 24 - A series about Starfleet Intelligence operatives racing to stop a Section 31 operation to assassinate a Klingon general within the day, by any means necessary.

Star Trek: Q in Law - Q is banished to 21st century Earth until he can prove he understands morality and justice. To speed up the process he decides to team up with a cop and solve crimes.

See, I can throw ideas at the wall as good as they can. Doing something different is easy. Novelty is easy. At least when it involves taking 'Star Trek' and adding 'school drama' or 'sit-com' etc.

Trying to get flowers to grow in an alien climate is TIGHT!

I actually like those ideas.

 

[Danja]

Star Trek: 24 - A series about Starfleet Intelligence operatives racing to stop a Section 31 operation to assassinate a Klingon general within the day, by any means necessary.

That could be a show!

 

[ScottJ85]

Star Trek: 24 - A series about Starfleet Intelligence operatives racing to stop a Section 31 operation to assassinate a Klingon general within the day, by any means necessary.

Not even joking, I'd watch that show. Or at least give it a fair chance.

 

[Cyfa]

Star Trek: Gardener's World - A series about a team of Starfleet gardeners trying to get their flowers to thrive in an alien climate.

~ I would watch this show! I love Star Trek (well, a good chunk of it) and I love gardening. I want senior officers dressed in those tight-fitting black spy suits ready to plant rulot seeds at a moments notice!

 

[Daedalus]

I mean, just think of the B plots and C plots. Federation colonists, far from home, anyone can be out there waiting to outdo our heroes at the interstellar flower show!!