Swine flu, will it depress turnout?

[MANT!]

might I offer a way to see the show in complete safety,

Goldbug's Discount Bio-Hazard suits!!

Just the Spring 2009 collection folks..wait till you see the Eveningwear..

 

[Tulin]

The funny thing is, like the boy who cried wolf, when the media says something these days, in my mind I instantly bring its severity down by a factor of about a third.

With so many news shows and channels competing for your eyeballs, every sniffle has to be a "deadly pandemic" and every fistfight at a pub has to be a "violent riot". The media has very little crdibility with me anymore because, like hopefully a lot of people, I can see through their manipulation and bullshit.

 

[DaveyNY]

^^Troll

Yeah...that's me...

​

Do we know what the swine flu's ground zero was ?

...ummmm...

... Mexico would be a good guess...

...since that's where it started.

Ummm....
You completely missed the point of my post. Which was directed at The Wormhole and his love for the number zero.
It wasn't a real question I was asking there.

I got it... but it would have been a better joke if you had used zero zero ground zero.

I believe this Swine Flu stuff is overblown. It might be horrible for some third world countries, but in the U.S. and other places with clean, running water and access to decent medical care, it's not going to be that bad (meaning, many might get sick, but a large percentage of the country isn't going to die).

Well, that's not how it spreads. It doesn't care what part of the world it's in. People come back to Germany, New Zealand, the United States, Austria carrying the virus with them. It can get a toe-hold anywhere. Look at what's happened in Queens in New York City, where over 100 people may have it. The weird thing is how mild it is in that case compared to other cases.
But for some perspective, almost 2000 people a year in NYC die from the flu. That's any type of flu. And flu can't be cured, you can only treat the symptoms, so that makes it scary for some people. For example, vitamin C is virtually useless, as are the other "preventatives." (And with vitamin C, since the body doesn't store it, if you're taking mega doses every day, you're literally pissing away the excess -- which is good, because otherwise it could become toxic.) Masks are no good as a preventative, either. None. Unless the person wearing the mask has something and is trying to stop from giving it to someone. Then, maybe...

I highlighted this to clarify a bit...

A mask will protect you if you haven't already caught the virus...so it is a good preventative in that instance...

The problem is that it's takes 24 to 48 hours for the virus to start showing symptoms, so you may already be sick and not know it by the time you start wearing the mask.

And wearing a mask once your already sick is the polite thing to do when in public settings, so you don't infect others.

Wearing a mask is also a way to ease peoples fears...

One should be careful to not make flat-out statements that aren't completely factual.

The best preventative BTW, is Washing Your Hands or Using a Hand Sanitizer... Often.

 

[ALF]

They say popcorn prevents swine flu.

 

[DaveyNY]

They say popcorn prevents swine flu.

It works best if you put one or two popped kernels in each nostril.

 

[Franklin]

I believe this Swine Flu stuff is overblown. It might be horrible for some third world countries, but in the U.S. and other places with clean, running water and access to decent medical care, it's not going to be that bad (meaning, many might get sick, but a large percentage of the country isn't going to die).

Well, that's not how it spreads. It doesn't care what part of the world it's in. People come back to Germany, New Zealand, the United States, Austria carrying the virus with them. It can get a toe-hold anywhere. Look at what's happened in Queens in New York City, where over 100 people may have it. The weird thing is how mild it is in that case compared to other cases.
But for some perspective, almost 2000 people a year in NYC die from the flu. That's any type of flu. And flu can't be cured, you can only treat the symptoms, so that makes it scary for some people. For example, vitamin C is virtually useless, as are the other "preventatives." (And with vitamin C, since the body doesn't store it, if you're taking mega doses every day, you're literally pissing away the excess -- which is good, because otherwise it could become toxic.) Masks are no good as a preventative, either. None. Unless the person wearing the mask has something and is trying to stop from giving it to someone. Then, maybe...

I highlighted this to clarify a bit...

A mask will protect you if you haven't already caught the virus...so it is a good preventative in that instance...

The problem is that it's takes 24 to 48 hours for the virus to start showing symptoms, so you may already be sick and not know it by the time you start wearing the mask.

And wearing a mask once your already sick is the polite thing to do when in public settings, so you don't infect others.

Wearing a mask is also a way to ease peoples fears...

One should be careful to not make flat-out statements that aren't completely factual.

The best preventative BTW, is Washing Your Hands or Using a Hand Sanitizer... Often.

Fair enough. What I had read and heard from several doctors is that it's problematic protection at best. Most commercial-grade masks filter only about 60 percent of particulates. Also, someone can still sneeze on you or you can pick up the virus with your hands (and after all you have to eat or scratch your nose some time). As you say, that's why hand-washing often is such a good idea.
As far as masks easing people's fears goes, that seems problematic, too. I gotta say it would make me a bit nervous, although I understand that wearing such masks is perfectly acceptable in certain cultures. One doctor suggested carrying a mask and offering it to anyone around you sneezing or coughing.

 

[Danoz]

It's a possibility. The D.C. metro on the way to work this morning was practically a ghost town now that a World Bank employee has contracted the virus.

 

[urbandk]

Just the Spring 2009 collection folks..wait till you see the Eveningwear..

The eveningwear:

 

[DaveyNY]

Well, that's not how it spreads. It doesn't care what part of the world it's in. People come back to Germany, New Zealand, the United States, Austria carrying the virus with them. It can get a toe-hold anywhere. Look at what's happened in Queens in New York City, where over 100 people may have it. The weird thing is how mild it is in that case compared to other cases.
But for some perspective, almost 2000 people a year in NYC die from the flu. That's any type of flu. And flu can't be cured, you can only treat the symptoms, so that makes it scary for some people. For example, vitamin C is virtually useless, as are the other "preventatives." (And with vitamin C, since the body doesn't store it, if you're taking mega doses every day, you're literally pissing away the excess -- which is good, because otherwise it could become toxic.) Masks are no good as a preventative, either. None. Unless the person wearing the mask has something and is trying to stop from giving it to someone. Then, maybe...

I highlighted this to clarify a bit...

A mask will protect you if you haven't already caught the virus...so it is a good preventative in that instance...

The problem is that it's takes 24 to 48 hours for the virus to start showing symptoms, so you may already be sick and not know it by the time you start wearing the mask.

And wearing a mask once your already sick is the polite thing to do when in public settings, so you don't infect others.

Wearing a mask is also a way to ease peoples fears...

One should be careful to not make flat-out statements that aren't completely factual.

The best preventative BTW, is Washing Your Hands or Using a Hand Sanitizer... Often.

Fair enough. What I had read and heard from several doctors is that it's problematic protection at best. Most commercial-grade masks filter only about 60 percent of particulates. Also, someone can still sneeze on you or you can pick up the virus with your hands (and after all you have to eat or scratch your nose some time). As you say, that's why hand-washing often is such a good idea.
As far as masks easing people's fears goes, that seems problematic, too. I gotta say it would make me a bit nervous, although I understand that wearing such masks is perfectly acceptable in certain cultures. One doctor suggested carrying a mask and offering it to anyone around you sneezing or coughing.

I doubt you heard that it was problematic protection from Several Doctors...

The Doctors I know (and I know many as I have worked in a hospital for over thirty years), would not be so cavalier about giving out half-truth information.

The Medical Masks sold over the counter at drug stores, Will Filter Out 100% of any Airborne Droplets that a person might be exposed to from someone else coughing or sneezing.

Particulates in the air would not include the Flu Virus as it can not be transmitted by the dust floating in the air. (Which is what Particulates are.)

Medical Masks will also pretty much completely contain those same droplets from an infected person who is doing the coughing and sneezing.

Wearing a medical mask is perfectly acceptable in pretty much all modern cultures (though considered a bit unusual) as there are Many Reasons to do so, including Allergy Sufferer's, People with Compromised Immune Systems due to Radiation or Chemo-Therapy Treatments and..., such as in this case, Avoid Getting the Flu.

I will reiterate that one should not make general statements that can be misleading to others.

 

[Squiggy]

Just an FYI, Phase 5 has never been declared, ever.

Mainly because these "phases" were created in 2005.

It's a possibility. The D.C. metro on the way to work this morning was practically a ghost town now that a World Bank employee has contracted the virus.

Sweet! I'll be able to get a seat tomorrow.

 

[Franklin]

I highlighted this to clarify a bit...

A mask will protect you if you haven't already caught the virus...so it is a good preventative in that instance...

The problem is that it's takes 24 to 48 hours for the virus to start showing symptoms, so you may already be sick and not know it by the time you start wearing the mask.

And wearing a mask once your already sick is the polite thing to do when in public settings, so you don't infect others.

Wearing a mask is also a way to ease peoples fears...

One should be careful to not make flat-out statements that aren't completely factual.

The best preventative BTW, is Washing Your Hands or Using a Hand Sanitizer... Often.

Fair enough. What I had read and heard from several doctors is that it's problematic protection at best. Most commercial-grade masks filter only about 60 percent of particulates. Also, someone can still sneeze on you or you can pick up the virus with your hands (and after all you have to eat or scratch your nose some time). As you say, that's why hand-washing often is such a good idea.
As far as masks easing people's fears goes, that seems problematic, too. I gotta say it would make me a bit nervous, although I understand that wearing such masks is perfectly acceptable in certain cultures. One doctor suggested carrying a mask and offering it to anyone around you sneezing or coughing.

I doubt you heard that it was problematic protection from Several Doctors...

The Doctors I know (and I know many as I have worked in a hospital for over thirty years), would not be so cavalier about giving out half-truth information.

The Medical Masks sold over the counter at drug stores, Will Filter Out 100% of any Airborne Droplets that a person might be exposed to from someone else coughing or sneezing.

Particulates in the air would not include the Flu Virus as it can not be transmitted by the dust floating in the air. (Which is what Particulates are.)

Medical Masks will also pretty much completely contain those same droplets from an infected person who is doing the coughing and sneezing.

Wearing a medical mask is perfectly acceptable in pretty much all modern cultures (though considered a bit unusual) as there are Many Reasons to do so, including Allergy Sufferer's, People with Compromised Immune Systems due to Radiation or Chemo-Therapy Treatments and..., such as in this case, Avoid Getting the Flu.

I will reiterate that one should not make general statements that can be misleading to others.

Then you better call The Los Angeles Times and the people they quote in the article from today entitled: "Face Masks Aren't A Sure Bet Against Swine Flu" and set them straight. Here's a bit from it.

Masks may give people a false sense of security, said Dr. Laurene Mascola, director of acute communicable disease control for the Los Angeles County Department of Public Health.
"You would have to wear it 100% of the time that you are outside," she said of masks and respirators.
Further, face masks and respirators shouldn't replace other precautions.
"Somewhat lost in all the excitement is that we continue to need to take standard control measures," said Dr. Paul Holtom, associate professor of medicine at USC's Keck School of Medicine and a hospital epidemiologist at Los Angeles County-USC Medical Center and the USC University Hospital.
To avoid infecting others, ill people should stay home, avoid crowds, cover their mouth when they cough or sneeze, and wash their hands before touching eyes, nose or mucus membranes. Those who want to avoid infection should do the same.
According to 3M, standards show how well respirators filter out particles in industrial settings, but there are no established exposure limits for biological agents such as swine flu virus.
The National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health has nine classifications of respirators based on their ability to filter particles. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention recommends respirators classified as N95 for healthcare workers and caregivers with a respiratory infection.
CDC officials, however, said Monday that they don't know how helpful either type of covering is in preventing swine flu infection. The best CDC could offer is that, if used correctly, masks and respirators might reduce the risk of getting influenza.

Just sayin'. That's what I'm reading. I'll leave it at that. I'm not trying to pick a fight or question your information. But if I'm wrong, they're wrong.

 

[gh4chiefs]

I believe this Swine Flu stuff is overblown. It might be horrible for some third world countries, but in the U.S. and other places with clean, running water and access to decent medical care, it's not going to be that bad (meaning, many might get sick, but a large percentage of the country isn't going to die).

you mean overblown like the great flu outbreak of 1918 that killed nearly 300 million people worldwide? we are way overdue for a global pandemic. lets hope this isnt one.

No overblown like saying 300 million people died.

From wiki:

Older estimates say it killed 40–50 million people while current estimates say 50 million to 100 million people worldwide were killed.

I'm seriously not trying to pick on you, but this is an example of how stuff gets overblown.

 

[btflash]

I believe this Swine Flu stuff is overblown. It might be horrible for some third world countries, but in the U.S. and other places with clean, running water and access to decent medical care, it's not going to be that bad (meaning, many might get sick, but a large percentage of the country isn't going to die).

you mean overblown like the great flu outbreak of 1918 that killed nearly 300 million people worldwide? we are way overdue for a global pandemic. lets hope this isnt one.

No overblown like saying 300 million people died.

From wiki:

Older estimates say it killed 40–50 million people while current estimates say 50 million to 100 million people worldwide were killed.

I'm seriously not trying to pick on you, but this is an example of how stuff gets overblown.

the numbers of dead from that outbreak vary from source to source. i posted the figures that were quoted from a book about this flu released about ten years ago.soooooo its "only" 100 million? that makes me feel way better!

 

[F. King Daniel]

The “swine flu” is just a sham: This is a virus generically-engineered by Trek XI haters who don’t want to see their “sacred canon” destroyed.
I’m going anyway! I don’t care if I fucking die! No way am I missing this after the 2 years of constant hype!
(on the other hand…best re-evaluate in a week, eh? If we’re ankle-deep in corpses, I’ll give it a try. Knee-deep, maybe. Waist-deep? I’ll wait for the DVD, thanks.)

 

[gh4chiefs]

you mean overblown like the great flu outbreak of 1918 that killed nearly 300 million people worldwide? we are way overdue for a global pandemic. lets hope this isnt one.

No overblown like saying 300 million people died.

From wiki:

Older estimates say it killed 40–50 million people while current estimates say 50 million to 100 million people worldwide were killed.

I'm seriously not trying to pick on you, but this is an example of how stuff gets overblown.

the numbers of dead from that outbreak vary from source to source. i posted the figures that were quoted from a book about this flu released about ten years ago.soooooo its "only" 100 million? that makes me feel way better!

I was just trying to point out that things can be often exagerated and the truth is, nobody really does know. 50 million is a lot, but it's a lot less than 300 million too.

There is a lot of hysteria out there, along with contradicting stories concerning this current outbreak. For example:

WHO says confirmed flu cases total 331, 10 deaths
04:40 AM EDT
GENEVA (Reuters) - The World Health Organization said on Friday that as of 0600 GMT the number of officially confirmed cases of a new flu sweeping around the world was 331 in 11 countries, including 10 deaths.
The figures for what the WHO calls influenza A (H1N1), widely known as swine flu, include 109 confirmed cases with one death in the United States and 156 confirmed cases with nine deaths in Mexico, it said in a statement on its website.
Other countries with laboratory-confirmed cases are Austria (1), Canada (34), Germany (3), Israel (2), Netherlands (1), New Zealand (3), Spain (13), Switzerland (1) and United Kingdom (8).
Other estimates of infection are higher. For instance Mexico says up to 176 people have died there and the authorities have confirmed 12 deaths.

So is the WHO right or is Mexico right? Even if the WHO is correct, it's still not a good thing BUT it may not be this "The sky is falling" scenario that some would like to portray it as. I honestly don't know, I'm not a medical expert, but as someone who was recently personally vicitimized by some very bad hysterical "news" reporting, I can tell you, don't trust the news media.

 

[btflash]

No overblown like saying 300 million people died.

From wiki:

I'm seriously not trying to pick on you, but this is an example of how stuff gets overblown.

the numbers of dead from that outbreak vary from source to source. i posted the figures that were quoted from a book about this flu released about ten years ago.soooooo its "only" 100 million? that makes me feel way better!

I was just trying to point out that things can be often exagerated and the truth is, nobody really does know. 50 million is a lot, but it's a lot less than 300 million too.

well, you have to put those figures into the proper context.citing the same wikipedia article you referenced it states that half of the worlds population was affected by the flu of 1918 and anywhere from 50 - 100 million died! a figure which is considered low by INSERM , the french institute for health and medical research which has just finnished and published a paper on this very subject stating that many more than 100 milliuon died.but the fact remains that the world population at that time has been estimated to be at 1 to 1.8 billion people. so do the math. that virus had a very high mortality rate no matter how you look at it. if a virulent disease like that infects half of the worlds population today it could cause a far greater death toll than in 1918. bear in mind there still is really no effective treatment for the flu.look at it this way. would you say aids is overblown? in 50 years it has claimed 180 million. this virus killed close to if not more than that in a mere year!so this is definatly something to be concerned about!thats my point!

 

[QuasarVM]

The funny thing is, like the boy who cried wolf, when the media says something these days, in my mind I instantly bring its severity down by a factor of about a third.

With so many news shows and channels competing for your eyeballs, every sniffle has to be a "deadly pandemic" and every fistfight at a pub has to be a "violent riot". The media has very little crdibility with me anymore because, like hopefully a lot of people, I can see through their manipulation and bullshit.

I agree! I am usually the alarmist one...but I'm just not buying this. Maybe I'll end up being wrong but right now I just don't feel the crisis.

For one, if this is such a big damned species destroying big damned deal then why don't they close the borders? Alledgedly, this thing is coming from Mexico and we all know illegals come into this country by the thousands every day. You know some of these people are carriers.

So, the fact that they continue to allow them to cross into this country tells me this flu must not be as bad as they say.

 

[DaveyNY]

THEY, are trying to avoid an all out panic...

This thing is already a pandemic but fortunately, 98% of the folks that get it don't die.

It's the Elderly, the Infirm and the Youngest among Us that have to be the most worried and cautious.

Just like with Any Flu, if your Immune System isn't up to par then IT IS A Big Deal for you.

 

[Therin of Andor]

I've worn a mask to every Star Trek movie premiere...

 

[Sector 7]

So, the flu I caught yesterday, after eating some pork barbecue?...

I was in the hospital cafeteria Wednesday (my stepmom had surgery). I mentioned, to the lady making stir-fry to order, that the pork tray was still full. She said, "It is amazing how many supposedly intelligent medical personnel think they can get swine flue from eating pork stir-fry."

Wearing a medical mask is perfectly acceptable in pretty much all modern cultures (though considered a bit unusual) as there are Many Reasons to do so, including Allergy Sufferer's, People with Compromised Immune Systems due to Radiation or Chemo-Therapy Treatments and..., such as in this case, Avoid Getting the Flu.

... and it is the height of fashion, just ask Michael Jackson!

I've worn a mask to every Star Trek movie premiere...

... are YOU Michael Jackson?!