Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion thread

[mswood]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

My question is what about say the Vamps who have been killed by the colt (one in the first season one in the third). Is there a dead going to Purgatory level or an utterly destroyed you cease to exist in any form anywhere?

 

[mswood]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

And I am still waiting for a logical reason why Sam in the last year never used his abilities?

Seriously what possible reason would soulless Sam have in not using his own abilities to make Crowley pay?

 

[Dorian Thompson]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

Perhaps he didn't have a supply of demon blood available to him. He doesn't seem to crave it anymore.

 

[Kaijima]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

Sam having demon powers is a tempting deus ex machina to get out of any jam; after all, when your back is to the wall, and lives are at stake (or even the world), you're gonna risk yourself to save the day.

So, I think the writers have just swept Sam's powers under the rug in order to allow the boys to be backed into a corner. For example, I seriously doubt they would have gone up against Crowley without a backup plan of a jug of demon blood in the trunk.

As for purgatory... Crowley specifically said he was wondering about where things like him went when they were destroyed. He couldn't have been talking about regular destruction of a meatsuit or banishment; demons just go back to hell. So he only could have been talking about demonic/supernatural being "death" or Surefire Termination (tm).

If we go for a moment with the business about energy neither being created or destroyed, perhaps the intent here is that using a true killing weapon such as the Colt or an angel's lance, can't literally destroy the energy a demon/angel is made of... but it can scramble it, and blow it straight through every level of reality to the place of no return - purgatory.

 

[mswood]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

See I have to disagree slightly with that. Especially since they clearly made his abilities only able to work on Demons, which hasn't been a lot of this season.

Its no more a deus ex machina, then having Castiel swoop in a burn Crowley's Bone's or using the colt to kill a demon or the knife to kill a demon, or a ritual or devil's trap to stop a demon. They are all just tools.

And since Sam feels responsible for releasing LUcifer in using his abilities, the normal Sam has a very legitimate reasons for not using them. But Soulless Sam, has no legitimate reason at all.

Thematically (and certainly a rational use of character ability and motivation) Soulless Sam being the one who killed Crowley makes worlds more since. And it isn't like he just trapped and made helpless two demons right before that to fuel up with (or even the demon he killed with the knife in front of Meg.

Its really the one logical failure that I found with this season, and its just glaring.

 

[Aeon]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

My biggest gripe this season? The Cambells. Now they are all gone and the whole family angle feels pretty pointless. They were just cannon fodder. And quite frankly I don't think the blood relation or the resurrection of Samuel was all that necessary.

 

[hyzmarca]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

And since Sam feels responsible for releasing LUcifer in using his abilities, the normal Sam has a very legitimate reasons for not using them. But Soulless Sam, has no legitimate reason at all.

Soulless Sam has a very good reason, withdrawal isn't fun.

Personally, I think getting rid of the Colt in Season 5 was a mistake. In the first three seasons demons were a huge deal. The Colt was an equalizer that allowed the brothers to win. It had to be removed to make room for Sam's corruption arc, but when that was done with its absence lessened the demons. They became mooks that two reasonably fit humans can defeat in large.

The knife made sensewhen Ruby used it because she was a demon, and Sam had his superpowers in Season 4 to balance things out, but five was beging to strain disbelief.

The Weapons of Heaven arc was a god opportunity to remedy this.

 

[mswood]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

The problem with the colt, is that it doesn't have an endless supply of bullets.

And we never did find out if Bobby was capable of replicating those bullets (we know Ruby could), and I assume its save to assume that Crowley also did. And Unlike Sam's abilities or the knife it worked an almost anything in creation. So in relationship to pretty much anything else the guys have ever had access to it really gives them a huge edge. Just keep your distance and be a good shot.

AS for Soulless Sam not wanting to deal with the withdrawal I don't think it would be much of a real issue for him. Clearly he wouldn't be able to process the emotional anguish that Sam endured, all he would have to deal with is the pure physical side of the pain. And frankly Soulless Sam didn't seem to worked up about pain. It didn't seem to deter him much.

Sure he might not have wanted to (by the time they confronted Crowley and he had plenty of access to demons to bleed) gets Crowley to free his soul. He certainly had a strong desire to have the demons chains of him and the threat of being sent back to hell gone.

Its not my biggest issue with this season, but its the one thing that just doesn't hold up logically (based on what we know of his abilities) nor does it hold up from a character point of view.

 

[hyzmarca]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

The problem with the colt, is that it doesn't have an endless supply of bullets.

That's not a problem, that's a feature. It adds ongoing tension. Do we use this incredibly limited and precious resource on the MOTW or do with try to gank it the old fashioned way? Is the creature sufficiently dangerous to justify such an expenditure?

During those few Season 1 and 2 episodes where they had the Colt, using it was a huge deal for precisely that reason. They had to pick their shots carefully.

 

[Dorian Thompson]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

Perhaps Samuel Colt will be able to shed some light on the situation.

 

[Checkmate]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

The problem with the colt, is that it doesn't have an endless supply of bullets.

That's not a problem, that's a feature. It adds ongoing tension. Do we use this incredibly limited and precious resource on the MOTW or do with try to gank it the old fashioned way? Is the creature sufficiently dangerous to justify such an expenditure?

During those few Season 1 and 2 episodes where they had the Colt, using it was a huge deal for precisely that reason. They had to pick their shots carefully.

Ruby showed them how to make more, though, didn't she? It wasn't an limitation any longer, beyond running out just like any other ammo they were carrying.

 

[Dorian Thompson]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

I was under the impression that Ruby made more, but didn't share the "recipe" so to speak. I could be wrong.

 

[Skywalker]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

That was the impression I'd gotten, too. Making some new bullets made sense for her at the time, but it wouldn't have made much sense, given her long-term goals, to share the secret with them.

 

[Dorian Thompson]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

Yeah. Ruby was running a long term con on them. Help, but not too much.

 

[Lt. Trull]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

Hmmmm.... I'm wondering if the writers could come up with:

Angelic Lightsabers which weild the power of the light of god.....
those would be intersting weapons for our friends sam and dean.

 

[Snaploud]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

I was under the impression that Ruby had figured out how to make any regular bullet work with the Colt.

 

[hyzmarca]

Re: Supernatural 6x16 "And Then There Were None" spoiler discussion th

I was under the impression that Ruby had figured out how to make any regular bullet work with the Colt.

The bullets they use in Season 3 have the same markings as the ones made by Samuel Colt. And the fact that they only had one shot left (apparently they lost the box of bullets that they had) prevented them from using it against the hellhounds in Abandon Al Hope.