Spoilers Starship Design in Star Trek: Picard

[wayoung]

So this may have already been discussed, but does it bother anyone else that the Titan-A, a neo- constitution class following in the footsteps of the original Connie class, an exploratory vessel which traditionally have been the most advanced, heavily armed and shielded ships in Starfleet so they could deal with any unknown threat against them, the fleets heavy cruisers, apparently is so poorly armed that it's Captain points out how the ship is not designed for combat? In a post dominion war/Borg threat starfleet?

 

[fireproof78]

So this may have already been discussed, but does it bother anyone else that the Titan-A, a neo- constitution class following in the footsteps of the original Connie class, an exploratory vessel which traditionally have been the most advanced, heavily armed and shielded ships in Starfleet so they could deal with any unknown threat against them, the fleets heavy cruisers, apparently is so poorly armed that it's Captain points out how the ship is not designed for combat? In a post dominion war/Borg threat starfleet?

It bothers many.


Not me, but many.

 

[HotRod]

So this may have already been discussed, but does it bother anyone else that the Titan-A, a neo- constitution class following in the footsteps of the original Connie class, an exploratory vessel which traditionally have been the most advanced, heavily armed and shielded ships in Starfleet so they could deal with any unknown threat against them, the fleets heavy cruisers, apparently is so poorly armed that it's Captain points out how the ship is not designed for combat? In a post dominion war/Borg threat starfleet?

One could argue that ever since the Defiant class, Starfleet has been less shy about having ships more dedicated towards combat. Indeed we saw a whole fleet of "the toughest, fastest, and most powerful" ships at the end of season 1 of Picard. Perhaps they are differentiating ships rolls far more often and relying less on a "jack of all trades" approach. Science and exploration ships are geared almost solely on those rolls. Face opposition? Retreat and call in the big guns.

Not saying I like this approach. Kinda dislike it, actually.

 

[fireproof78]

One could argue that ever since the Defiant class, Starfleet has been less shy about having ships more dedicated towards combat. Indeed we saw a whole fleet of "the toughest, fastest, and most powerful" ships at the end of season 1 of Picard. Perhaps they are differentiating ships rolls far more often and relying less on a "jack of all trades" approach. Science and exploration ships are geared almost solely on those rolls. Face opposition? Retreat and call in the big guns.

Yup. Exactly how I see it.

 

[Noname Given]

So this may have already been discussed, but does it bother anyone else that the Titan-A, a neo- constitution class following in the footsteps of the original Connie class, an exploratory vessel which traditionally have been the most advanced, heavily armed and shielded ships in Starfleet so they could deal with any unknown threat against them, the fleets heavy cruisers, apparently is so poorly armed that it's Captain points out how the ship is not designed for combat? In a post dominion war/Borg threat starfleet?

Hence the name Neo Constitution class and not Constitution class or Constitution II class.

(And don't get me started on Starship class... )

 

[fireproof78]

And don't get me started on Starship class... )

It's a very special class.

 

[wayoung]

Hence the name Neo Constitution class and not Constitution class or Constitution II class.

(And don't get me started on Starship class... )

Memory Alpha states its class as Constitution III, Neo-Constitution is seemingly a nickname.

 

[Noname Given]

Memory Alpha states its class as Constitution III, Neo-Constitution is seemingly a nickname.

That's nice. Good for Memory Alpha. When they call it the Constitution III class on screen in an episode, that's when that class designation will become Canon.

 

[wayoung]

That's nice. Good for Memory Alpha. When they call it the Constitution III class on screen in an episode, that's when that class designation will become Canon.

It is on screen. It's stated on the dedication plaque.

 

[Noname Given]

It is on screen. It's stated on the dedication plaque.

You mean in the same way that the original TOs Enterprise plaque on the series states the class of the ship is: Starship class?

My point? I don't recall a shot where we got a good look at the dedication plaque on the screen.

 

[Captain_Amasov]

To be fair, the Stargazer's ship class was never mentioned in dialogue either, the Sagan-class comes from the ship's dedication plaque only, but no one has an issue referring to it as such. By this reasoning the Titan-A is a Constitution III-class starship, according to its own dedication plaque:

 

[wayoung]

You mean in the same way that the original TOs Enterprise plaque on the series states the class of the ship is: Starship class?

My point? I don't recall a shot where we got a good look at the dedication plaque on the screen.

TOS was never consistent in lore. They didn't care about canon then, it was an anthology series with the same main cast/characters focused on the story of the episode, not worried about building a consistent 6 decade franchise. TOS contradicted itself episode to episode.

You said constitution III wasn't on screen so it's not canon. It was on screen. It's on the dedication plaque, even if the camera didn't pause on it for everyone to read. If you don't like it that's fine, and if Star Trek producers want to retcon it later that's also fine, but the fact remains: It is on screen. And recently, to boot

 

[Noname Given]

TOS was never consistent in lore. They didn't care about canon then, it was an anthology series with the same main cast/characters focused on the story of the episode, not worried about building a consistent 6 decade franchise. TOS contradicted itself episode to episode.

You said constitution III wasn't on screen so it's not canon. It was on screen. It's on the dedication plaque, even if the camera didn't pause on it for everyone to read. If you don't like it that's fine, and if Star Trek producers want to retcon it later that's also fine, but the fact remains: It is on screen. And recently, to boot

Yeah, the same old tired "In the old days they didn't care about canon..." BS

TOS was as consistent as ANY of the Berman 24th century era shows. And they did refer back to events from previous episode from time to time as well - but yes, that was rare.

TNG was rife with inconsistencies from day one.

from the Pilot:

RIKER: Then your rank of Lieutenant Commander is honorary?

DATA: No, sir. Starfleet class of '78. Honours in probability mechanics and exobiology.

^^^
Interesting since by the end of Season 1 in TNG The Neutral Zone, Data gives the current calendar year as 2364 in dialog on the screen. And we also know from Datalore:

DATA: I was discovered twenty six years ago

So...doing the math - Data says he graduated with the Academy Class of '78 (assuming 2278), yet he was discovered it 2338?

In Season 1 Worf said he was raised on the farming colony Galt. Buy by season 4 he was saying he was raised on Earth.

And believe me we could go on for pages about TNG's canon inconsistencies; so yeah, please don't sit there and tell me the TNG production team cared more about Star Trek canon than the TOS production team.

Like ANY TV production, when a previous piece of lore/canon conflicts with the story you want to tell this week - IGNORE IT!

That was as true for ANY Trek series from TOS to TNG to today.

TOS was never consistent in lore. They didn't care about canon then, it was an anthology series with the same main cast/characters focused on the story of the episode, not worried about building a consistent 6 decade franchise. TOS contradicted itself episode to episode.

You said constitution III wasn't on screen so it's not canon. It was on screen. It's on the dedication plaque, even if the camera didn't pause on it for everyone to read. If you don't like it that's fine, and if Star Trek producers want to retcon it later that's also fine, but the fact remains: It is on screen. And recently, to boot

Oh please. By that logic the signs on the 1701-D on TNG that read: "Dorothy, we're not in Kansas anymore" and all the other in joke labels and stickers they had on that set during filming are canon too - yeah, who cares if the audience couldn't read it.

If the audience can't make it out, it's not canon.

 

[AdmiralBuck]

Ask Bill Krause why he put them there. That’s their location on the Shangri-La as well.

I didn’t put them there. Someone else decided where they should go on the Titan-A. Shangri-La’s photons were mounted in the bow.

 

[cooleddie74]

Which I like, not to mention there are three torpedo tubes there due to having more available hull space.

 

[fireproof78]

Oh please. By that logic the signs on the 1701-D on TNG that read: "Dorothy, we're not in Kansas anymore" and all the other in joke labels and stickers they had on that set during filming are canon too - yeah, who cares if the audience couldn't read it.

If the audience can't make it out, it's not canon.

Yup.

 

[Tuskin38]

I didn’t put them there. Someone else decided where they should go on the Titan-A. Shangri-La’s photons were mounted in the bow.

I guess there was something on the neck of your model that I mistook as something else. My bad

 

[Tuskin38]

That's nice. Good for Memory Alpha. When they call it the Constitution III class on screen in an episode, that's when that class designation will become Canon.

It’s also seen on a cutaway of the ship on one of the consoles.

I wonder if the ‘Neo-Constitution’ name was something that was made up after production. Considering it’s only called Constitution III on the set.

The only time it’s spoken on screen is during a voice over which was clearly ADR’d in, not recorded the same day as the scene. Makes me think Riker may have originally said Connie 3,

It was either Dave Blass or Terry (or both) that said Neo-Constitution was a nickname, while the technical class name is Constitution III. Hence why it’s on the plaque and engineering console display.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

I guess there was something on the neck of your model that I mistook as something else. My bad

There's a very small round detail there that kinda looks like what was on one or two of the original Phase II Enterprise concepts.

 

[Tuskin38]

Oh please. By that logic the signs on the 1701-D on TNG that read: "Dorothy, we're not in Kansas anymore" and all the other in joke labels and stickers they had on that set during filming are canon too - yeah, who cares if the audience couldn't read it.

If the audience can't make it out, it's not canon.

Oh come on that’s not even remotely comparable. Those decals were never intended to be read on screen.

The dedication plaque and engineering console display were.