This sums up my feelings on Lucas pretty well. He's a great idea guy, but his execution of those ideas isn't always the greatest.
As for the EPVIII title, until it pops up on a more reliable site I'm calling BS.
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Star Wars: Episode VII: The Nerd Rage Awakens
- Thread starter cooleddie74
- Start date
This sums up my feelings on Lucas pretty well. He's a great idea guy, but his execution of those ideas isn't always the greatest.
As for the EPVIII title, until it pops up on a more reliable site I'm calling BS.
The ideas are his and his alone any thought that the execution is wrong is Monday morning quartbacking at best. You can't alway leave your ideas in the hand of others. Joss Whedon is still complaining about how Alien Resurrection came out, Alan Moore famously hates movies based on his works and those are but two examples.
Pardon me? Isn't questioning and analyzing artistic endeavors, film and otherwise, a part of engaging the work? Monday morning quaterbacking is part of the process, isn't it?
I like GL, a lot, and harbor no ill will against him personally. I think he made the films that he wanted to in the PT, and enjoyed the process. I think they are professionally done, high-polished, ground breaking in terms of the technology, but lacking in character creation and directing.
The ideas are his, absolutely. But, having collaborated with others on film projects and the like, and other creative ideas, it doesn't happen in a vacuum. The original Star Wars was an exercise in this. GL was constantly revisiting drafts and concepts (Utupau, Mace Windy, Starkiller, and the like) and updating based upon different inputs and influences.
It may be his ideas, but I certainly don't have to agree with the final product. Same can be said of any artistic work put to the public.
Pardon me? Isn't questioning and analyzing artistic endeavors, film and otherwise, a part of engaging the work? Monday morning quaterbacking is part of the process, isn't it?
I like GL, a lot, and harbor no ill will against him personally. I think he made the films that he wanted to in the PT, and enjoyed the process. I think they are professionally done, high-polished, ground breaking in terms of the technology, but lacking in character creation and directing.
The ideas are his, absolutely. But, having collaborated with others on film projects and the like, and other creative ideas, it doesn't happen in a vacuum. The original Star Wars was an exercise in this. GL was constantly revisiting drafts and concepts (Utupau, Mace Windy, Starkiller, and the like) and updating based upon different inputs and influences.
It may be his ideas, but I certainly don't have to agree with the final product. Same can be said of any artistic work put to the public.
No, I don't think he made the films he wanted he massively rewrote and reshot the fall of Anakin in ROTS because the test audience didn't understand why he joined the dark side, then he couldn't change the ending to fit the changes made to the second act. There were a number of influences on the prequels besides that, so things are quie so simple of just blaming him for how things turned out that failed to meet people's expectations. Had he been able to get other writers and directors he would have, but he got turned every time. But on his own he wrote, produced and directed three blockbusters on his own. I await even more than the film itself the reactions to TFA.
Good. Just open with the Lucasfilm logo and a new Star Wars introductory fanfare and start the title crawl. Disney may own the franchise now but it's not my favorite corporate logo to see at the start of a non-animated film.
So you're pre-disposed to hate it, even before it comes out?
I see the problem here - you're way too caught up in the whole fandom and get hung up on what people think of the films, rather than just enjoying(or not)the films themselves.
One of the best things I learned in the last few years is to MASSIVELY downgrade the importance of others' opinions and to make up my mind for MYSELF.
Some people will like the PT, some won't. Some(deluded)people will LOVE them, some will hate them. They're allowed to have their opinion, as are you. It's when you take on the role of fanantical defender of the faith and feel the need to fight on behalf of Lucas(who, from all accounts stretching back to 1977, quite frankly, thinks all fanatical followers of SW are a little unhinged!), and to scream down like an internet keyboard warrior every slight against him, that you cross a line.
Enjoy TFA or don't but, again, it's sad if you've already made up your mind because a man who made the equivalent of 1.5 really good SW movies out of six is not involved, is, frankly, kind of sad!
I want to see the movie and enjoy it. What others think is interesting to me at most or insignificant at the bare minimum. They love it? They just kind of like it and think it's a decent film? It sucks and they won't let you forget it? Good for them. I care about my opinion of TFA.
Everything else is secondary, tertiary or completely irrelevant.
Everything else is secondary, tertiary or completely irrelevant.
<<he massively rewrote and reshot the fall of Anakin in ROTS because the test audience didn't understand why he joined the dark side, then he couldn't change the ending to fit the changes made to the second act. >>
I don't think I've heard this before. What was the original version?
I don't think I've heard this before. What was the original version?
There IS no other version.
The OP is less of a Lucas worshipper than he thinks because EVERYBODY knows George LOATHES the idea of screening for test audiences and getting feedback the way the studios do.
Love them or hate them, the OT was basically one man's vision, flawed as it was.
I respect anybody's opinion of any movie...good, bad or lukewarm (no pun intended). They have the right to voice what they think.
Do I have to like or give two flying craps about that opinion? Nope.
Do I have to like or give two flying craps about that opinion? Nope.
So, you aren't goinigto read the review thread or respond to to any of the posts in it? Since you obviously don't care what anybody else thinks about the movie, yet again I await the reviews.
No, I didn't say I wasn't curious and wouldn't read reviews. I said I don't particularly care if they like it or not. I'm going to be the one seeing it so my viewing of the film is what really matters to me.
Opinions of other people are less important than my own reaction to the film. I'm curious and I read a hundred reviews of the last two Star Trek films before ever seeing them, but I didn't decide if each film was good or disappointing until I saw it for myself.
Opinions of other people are less important than my own reaction to the film. I'm curious and I read a hundred reviews of the last two Star Trek films before ever seeing them, but I didn't decide if each film was good or disappointing until I saw it for myself.
Pardon me? Isn't questioning and analyzing artistic endeavors, film and otherwise, a part of engaging the work? Monday morning quaterbacking is part of the process, isn't it?
I like GL, a lot, and harbor no ill will against him personally. I think he made the films that he wanted to in the PT, and enjoyed the process. I think they are professionally done, high-polished, ground breaking in terms of the technology, but lacking in character creation and directing.
The ideas are his, absolutely. But, having collaborated with others on film projects and the like, and other creative ideas, it doesn't happen in a vacuum. The original Star Wars was an exercise in this. GL was constantly revisiting drafts and concepts (Utupau, Mace Windy, Starkiller, and the like) and updating based upon different inputs and influences.
It may be his ideas, but I certainly don't have to agree with the final product. Same can be said of any artistic work put to the public.
No, I don't think he made the films he wanted he massively rewrote and reshot the fall of Anakin in ROTS because the test audience didn't understand why he joined the dark side, then he couldn't change the ending to fit the changes made to the second act. There were a number of influences on the prequels besides that, so things are quie so simple of just blaming him for how things turned out that failed to meet people's expectations. Had he been able to get other writers and directors he would have, but he got turned every time. But on his own he wrote, produced and directed three blockbusters on his own. I await even more than the film itself the reactions to TFA.
Certainly, there are a number influences, since art cannot occur in a vacuum. Not sure what films he wanted to shoot then, unless there is a version of Anakin's fall that makes more sense
Might have been better if what Matt Stover wrote in his novelization had remained as part of the script, rather than editing it out. What version he received, I don't know.Also, I'm trying to follow what other directors or writers he didn't have access too. There are scenes of him talking with Spielberg in preproduction in TPM. He had the time, resources and backing to do most of what he wanted. I'll not say all, because there is always a part of a creative work that feels "incomplete" (to quote GL from the Special Edition BTS).
So, I'm curious as to what I'm missing that GL was lacking that he couldn't have access to?
There was another version try reading The Secret History Of Star Wars, the web site if it's still up had the changes in detail.
Pardon me? Isn't questioning and analyzing artistic endeavors, film and otherwise, a part of engaging the work? Monday morning quaterbacking is part of the process, isn't it?
I like GL, a lot, and harbor no ill will against him personally. I think he made the films that he wanted to in the PT, and enjoyed the process. I think they are professionally done, high-polished, ground breaking in terms of the technology, but lacking in character creation and directing.
The ideas are his, absolutely. But, having collaborated with others on film projects and the like, and other creative ideas, it doesn't happen in a vacuum. The original Star Wars was an exercise in this. GL was constantly revisiting drafts and concepts (Utupau, Mace Windy, Starkiller, and the like) and updating based upon different inputs and influences.
It may be his ideas, but I certainly don't have to agree with the final product. Same can be said of any artistic work put to the public.
No, I don't think he made the films he wanted he massively rewrote and reshot the fall of Anakin in ROTS because the test audience didn't understand why he joined the dark side, then he couldn't change the ending to fit the changes made to the second act. There were a number of influences on the prequels besides that, so things are quie so simple of just blaming him for how things turned out that failed to meet people's expectations. Had he been able to get other writers and directors he would have, but he got turned every time. But on his own he wrote, produced and directed three blockbusters on his own. I await even more than the film itself the reactions to TFA.
Certainly, there are a number influences, since art cannot occur in a vacuum. Not sure what films he wanted to shoot then, unless there is a version of Anakin's fall that makes more sense
Also, I'm trying to follow what other directors or writers he didn't have access too. There are scenes of him talking with Spielberg in preproduction in TPM. He had the time, resources and backing to do most of what he wanted. I'll not say all, because there is always a part of a creative work that feels "incomplete" (to quote GL from the Special Edition BTS).
So, I'm curious as to what I'm missing that GL was lacking that he couldn't have access to?
Lucas upon leaving the Director's Guide over the fine over the credits to Empire meant that he was something of a pariah in Hollywood, a number of actors turned down his offeres to be in the prequels as did writers and directors, he would've gladly have hand the movies ove to them.
Strangely enough you think after the OT was numbered four though six there'd be people lining up to do the first three movies, yet that wasn't the case. But now of course that it's out of Lucas' hands it's a different story. But then he did keep the costs down and I'm not really thrilled by how much movies cost nowadays 200 million plus is a bit much for a movie's budget but that's just me I guess.
Yes, I'm happy about this. Also need "A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away...."
LucasFilm Ltd (Music/silence?)
A long time ago (silence)
STAR WARS (YEAH, BABY!)
Crawl
There is no other version? That's... not entirely true.
Most of the scenes building up to Anakin's fall were as shot, except with a deleted element - Anakin was insanely jealous of any man who even glanced in Padme's direction. Palpatine played on this in a still-unreleased deleted scene by hinting that Obi-Wan was sleeping with Padme behind his back (Yeah, that might not even be your kid). When Padme tells him Obi-Wan visited her apartment (in yet another deleted scene), Anakin snaps at her. "You told him about us! DIDN'T YOU?!?"
Other deleted material played up how cold and hostile the Jedi Council was towards him (especially Mace Windu, who flat out hated him), which culminated in the scene where Palpatine reveals all and makes his pitch... and Anakin sides with him then and there.
No returning to the Temple and talking to Mace. No agonized stare out the window at Padme's apartment. Just "screw them, they never wanted me anyway, I don't owe them a damn thing."
So (in the original filmed version of the scene) he's standing there beside Palpatine in his office when Mace and his posse arrive. Mace tells Palpatine Grievous is dead and orders him to give up his emergency powers. When Palpatine refuses, Mace declares him under arrest. The scene then plays as in the final film, with the Jedi learning only then that Palpatine is a Sith Lord and caught completely unprepared. Anakin stands and watches until Mace has Palpatine at his mercy, then attacks and kills Mace without a moment's remorse.
The other remaining change was on Mustafar when Obi-Wan makes his appearance. With the added hint of infidelity in the air, Anakin not only Force-chokes Padme but violently slams her head-first into the side of her ship, cracking her skull. "We don't know why (she's dying), she has lost the will to live" was a reshoot addition - Palpatine originally told the truth. Anakin straight-up murdered Padme in a fit of passionate rage.
Most of the scenes building up to Anakin's fall were as shot, except with a deleted element - Anakin was insanely jealous of any man who even glanced in Padme's direction. Palpatine played on this in a still-unreleased deleted scene by hinting that Obi-Wan was sleeping with Padme behind his back (Yeah, that might not even be your kid). When Padme tells him Obi-Wan visited her apartment (in yet another deleted scene), Anakin snaps at her. "You told him about us! DIDN'T YOU?!?"
Other deleted material played up how cold and hostile the Jedi Council was towards him (especially Mace Windu, who flat out hated him), which culminated in the scene where Palpatine reveals all and makes his pitch... and Anakin sides with him then and there.
No returning to the Temple and talking to Mace. No agonized stare out the window at Padme's apartment. Just "screw them, they never wanted me anyway, I don't owe them a damn thing."
So (in the original filmed version of the scene) he's standing there beside Palpatine in his office when Mace and his posse arrive. Mace tells Palpatine Grievous is dead and orders him to give up his emergency powers. When Palpatine refuses, Mace declares him under arrest. The scene then plays as in the final film, with the Jedi learning only then that Palpatine is a Sith Lord and caught completely unprepared. Anakin stands and watches until Mace has Palpatine at his mercy, then attacks and kills Mace without a moment's remorse.
The other remaining change was on Mustafar when Obi-Wan makes his appearance. With the added hint of infidelity in the air, Anakin not only Force-chokes Padme but violently slams her head-first into the side of her ship, cracking her skull. "We don't know why (she's dying), she has lost the will to live" was a reshoot addition - Palpatine originally told the truth. Anakin straight-up murdered Padme in a fit of passionate rage.
The digital downloads of Episodes I - VI had a truncated version of the closing notes of the ESB theme superimposed over the Lucasfilm logo, if I'm not mistaken. A shortened clip of a recognizable piece of Star Wars soundtrack music to replace the 20th Century Fox logo and fanfare for the digital releases.
