Star Wars: Episode VII: The Nerd Rage Awakens

[Samurai8472]

The documentary is really insightful.

Interesting to hear lucas say things like "I've gone too far...but there's no turning back now"

or

"They're going to want to go home after the pod race"

and of course watching all these people go home confused and disappointed.

 

[DWF]

Lucas obviously intended the droid army to be a brutal occupation force that inflicted unjust and inhumane treatment on the Naboo, so the absence of a lot of visible bloodshed and carnage doesn't really affect the movie too much. As I mentioned earlier, it was a PG film designed for audiences of all ages with a heavy skew towards kids (hence the design and presence of Jar Jar) so neither Lucas nor 20th Century Fox were going to release a Star Wars movie with a lot of (up-close and obvious) killing in it. Star Wars movies just don't do that, and even the genocidal obliteration of Alderaan was done from a distance and we never saw the individual victims.

The droid army marching into Theed reminded me an old photo of the German army maching into Paris. But really teh attack on Naboo was merely a ruse to Palptine in office.

 

[Doctorwhovian]

I saw that. It's nice to know he'll be in more than one of the new films, because the Rebel Alliance always needs at least one fighter pilot besides Luke Skywalker who survives into the next film.

That kind of makes me wonder a bit-will we see Luke in an X-wing (or similar vessel like ESB's snowspeeder)? He didn't use it much in ROTJ (and in no combat whatsoever), but then again Han didn't pilot the Falcon either (Although he might've when they left Tatooine), and I'm pretty sure he'll be doing that in the new movie (Wasn't Ford injured on the Falcon set?)

 

[cooleddie74]

Yeah, Harrison's leg injury happened when a door on the Millennium Falcon set came slamming down on it. I hope he finished filming any piloting scenes before the accident happened.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

Double Rogue

 

[Tosk]

Obi-Wan is almost a gumshoe trying to get to something and his scenes move with real purpose. It comes close to being well-paced, because he actually discovers shit around every corner.

I remember before SW2 came out and Ewan mentioned being a detective in this one, "Like Batman" I was very excited. But that scene where Yoda gets one of the kids to point out the obvious (someone erased the planet from the archive) as though it is a brilliant insight is just painful. Obi-Wan spends a lot of time seeming obtuse.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

That scene was painful.
What I'm saying is that I felt that with some sharper writing, that whole subplot could have led to some amazing insights into the SW universe. When I watch the scenes, I see the potential.. not every SW film has to be the same.

 

[Tosk]

Agreed. AOTC had a lot of potential. ...Damn it.

 

[cooleddie74]

AOTC could have been one of the greatest sci-fi/fantasy films of this new century had such a fantastic story idea not been executed in such a wooden and disappointing fashion. There was a kernel there that if nurtured properly could have turned into one of the best films in the entire franchise.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

Double Rogue

Paramount is bitter

 

[fireproof78]

AOTC could have been one of the greatest sci-fi/fantasy films of this new century had such a fantastic story idea not been executed in such a wooden and disappointing fashion. There was a kernel there that if nurtured properly could have turned into one of the best films in the entire franchise.

Yep.

Personally, I like Obi-Wan's subplot, but the whole clone plot just becomes stupid. The villains feel poorly defined beyond the basic of motivations, and its frustrating because it really could have been a lot more interesting.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

What do you all think about the Paramount vs. Lucasfilm "Rogue" fight that I linked to?

 

[Skywalker]

It's not a big deal in the grand scheme of things, though I have to admit I do like seeing the House of Mouse taken down a peg, even if it's ultimately not gonna harm them in any real way.

 

[Tosk]

What do you all think about the Paramount vs. Lucasfilm "Rogue" fight that I linked to?

What fight? It says they came to a (very fair sounding) agreement.

 

[Reverend]

Obi-Wan is almost a gumshoe trying to get to something and his scenes move with real purpose. It comes close to being well-paced, because he actually discovers shit around every corner.

I remember before SW2 came out and Ewan mentioned being a detective in this one, "Like Batman" I was very excited. But that scene where Yoda gets one of the kids to point out the obvious (someone erased the planet from the archive) as though it is a brilliant insight is just painful. Obi-Wan spends a lot of time seeming obtuse.

That scene could have been better written, but I don't think the intent was that the idea never occurred to Yoda. He was turning his discussion with Obi-Wan into a lesson for the younglings.

On the flip side it's understandable why it didn't occur to Obi-Wan: the Jedi archives are in the temple, only accessible to other Jedi. They're practically sacrosanct. From his point of view, a star system vanishing was the more likely option.

 

[theenglish]

Obi-Wan is almost a gumshoe trying to get to something and his scenes move with real purpose. It comes close to being well-paced, because he actually discovers shit around every corner.

I remember before SW2 came out and Ewan mentioned being a detective in this one, "Like Batman" I was very excited. But that scene where Yoda gets one of the kids to point out the obvious (someone erased the planet from the archive) as though it is a brilliant insight is just painful. Obi-Wan spends a lot of time seeming obtuse.

That scene could have been better written, but I don't think the intent was that the idea never occurred to Yoda. He was turning his discussion with Obi-Wan into a lesson for the younglings.

On the flip side it's understandable why it didn't occur to Obi-Wan: the Jedi archives are in the temple, only accessible to other Jedi. They're practically sacrosanct. From his point of view, a star system vanishing was the more likely option.

Yes, it was supposed to be a lesson--Yoda knew the answer.

Obi-Wan might have suspected the possibility but it was difficult for him to believe that the jedi, or a jedi, would be involved in the conspiracy.

 

[InklingStar]

I remember before SW2 came out and Ewan mentioned being a detective in this one, "Like Batman" I was very excited. But that scene where Yoda gets one of the kids to point out the obvious (someone erased the planet from the archive) as though it is a brilliant insight is just painful. Obi-Wan spends a lot of time seeming obtuse.

That scene could have been better written, but I don't think the intent was that the idea never occurred to Yoda. He was turning his discussion with Obi-Wan into a lesson for the younglings.

On the flip side it's understandable why it didn't occur to Obi-Wan: the Jedi archives are in the temple, only accessible to other Jedi. They're practically sacrosanct. From his point of view, a star system vanishing was the more likely option.

Yes, it was supposed to be a lesson--Yoda knew the answer.

Obi-Wan might have suspected the possibility but it was difficult for him to believe that the jedi, or a jedi, would be involved in the conspiracy.

Exactly. An ongoing theme of the Prequels is that the Jedi have become extremely overconfident about their powers and their ability to control what is happening in the Republic. It takes the near-total destruction of the Jedi Order for Yoda and Obi-Wan to learn Qui-Gon's lesson in trusting the Force.

 

[cooleddie74]

Just consider what Mace Windu says to Senator Amidala after the failed bomb attempt on her life. To paraphrase: "Count Dooku was once a Jedi Knight. Murder isn't in his character. He can't assassinate anybody."

It's that refusal to accept that even the greatest and most skilled Jedi among them can't ever sink so low as to turn to the Dark Side, although that's part of what they teach younglings and Padawans during their many years of training. The Dark Side of the Force can corrupt you and turn you into something you do not want to become if you allow yourself to display certain weaknesses, and all are susceptible to the temptations of the Dark Side.

If you can be seduced by and fall to the Dark Side then an act of murder isn't out of the realm of possibility, and Mace Windu should know that even when it comes to a former Jedi as skilled, respected and admired as Dooku. Perhaps he did, but it was considered extremely bad taste to speak of a former Jedi in such a manner, especially in front of civilians of the Republic who tend to revere the Jedi Order and expect it to display only the best and noblest behavior and other qualities.

 

[AgentCoop]

I think a big part of the frustration of the Prequels is that, as this discussion demonstrates, there's plenty of good stuff there. Interesting, compelling, original ideas. But they just sort of get glossed over. It's like Lucas was a chef who had carefully assembled all of the ingredients for a great gourmet feast, but he wound up not preparing it properly.

 

[davejames]

I think a big part of the frustration of the Prequels is that, as this discussion demonstrates, there's plenty of good stuff there. Interesting, compelling, original ideas. But they just sort of get glossed over. It's like Lucas was a chef who had carefully assembled all of the ingredients for a great gourmet feast, but he wound up not preparing it properly.

Well said. You can clearly see a ton of potential there in the storyline, casting, and design work, but unfortunately they are all let down by screenplays that feel too much like rough, stilted, and unpolished first drafts.