Star Wars Books Thread

[Sparkle Fabulosa]

I finished the Leia book. I thought it was very slow-paced. I didn't start getting into it until it was more than half over.

Still it was interesting to read about her life on Alderaan, and see the dynamics of the Organa family.

Someone mentioned a character that reminded them of Luna Lovegood. I thought the exact same thing. She was definitely a highlight!

Spoiler

It was a treat to have little bits with C-3PO and R2-D2. And I noticed some overlapping with Lost Stars.

 

[Ithekro]

But...was there a Winter?

 

[Reverend]

But...was there a Winter?

There was not. Honestly, I'm glad they didn't go there since there isn't really a place for her in canon and she sort of undermine's Leia's role somewhat. I'm still holding out hope for an interpretation of Targeter though, she was always way more interesting than Winter.

 

[Tuskin38]

I don't even know who this Winter is, I had to google.

 

[Sparkle Fabulosa]

^ I thought the question was about if Alderaan experienced winter, the season.

 

[Reverend]

Ah, so my Targeter joke clearly flew over both of your heads. never mind, I'm sure somebody out there got it!

 

[kirk55555]

Then nothing will ever compete so why read it? If the pinnacle has been reached, then there is no going forward.

By that logic, after finishing the Republic Commando books I never should have read another book again because they are my favorite books of all time (not just SW, and I read a lot). Just because the new canon stuff will never approach the old EU doesn't mean it can't be good or worth reading. Some of the books have been

Though, I will always prefer the films to the books, with the rare exception. To me, the films get closer to Lucs' vision than the books do..

Well, since I don't care about Lucas's vision at all, I don't care if the books are filled with things he'd never do. He's the last person whose vision of Star Wars I'd want the books to follow. He helped make three good to great SW movies and one watchable movie but since I consider many EU books far superior to even the great SW movies that doesn't really matter.

You haven't even read it.

Well, I'm only speaking based off of my opinion. The Yoda story and the author list alone cemented my opinion. If the public library gets it, I might crack it open just to see if the few writers I both know and like ended up

I could say your opinion is garbage, but that would be just a bit unfair (barely). But it is formed by a lot of presumption and bias against a author who dares to write young adult books. Couple of dozen pages back you said you wouldn't read Bloodlines because the author wrote Lost Stars which you equalated to garbage because it was mostly aimed at young adults, you eventually did read Bloodlines and declared it wasn't terrible (I think...) doesn't that say to you and everybody here that your really hasty in your opinions and rarely admit when your wrong.

I admit when I'm wrong. I admitted I was wrong about Bloodlines, Ahsoka, Rebel Rising (although RR was weaker then the other two it was still ok) and Tarkin, and I admitted that A New Dawn actually defied my expectations and told the (in my opinion) only really good story involving Hera and Kanan in the entire new canon (I'm including Rebels in that statement). Although I didn't go after AND like I did the other books I'll still bring it up since even though I didn't doubt its author's ability I doubted anyone being able to use the characters well. That said, I was right (when it comes to forming my own opinion) of Lost Stars when I tried to read it and really disliked it, and I generally have a pretty good track record. A bit shaky when it comes to the new canon books I'll admit, but I'm only talking about my personal opinion, no one has to agree with me

 

[fireproof78]

By that logic, after finishing the Republic Commando books I never should have read another book again because they are my favorite books of all time (not just SW, and I read a lot). Just because the new canon stuff will never approach the old EU doesn't mean it can't be good or worth reading. Some of the books have been

Yes.

Well, since I don't care about Lucas's vision at all, I don't care if the books are filled with things he'd never do. He's the last person whose vision of Star Wars I'd want the books to follow. He helped make three good to great SW movies and one watchable movie but since I consider many EU books far superior to even the great SW movies that doesn't really matter.

That's interesting.

 

[Sparkle Fabulosa]

I have a question about Captain Phasma. When the book about her origin was released a few weeks ago, I had no memory of her at all. So I looked up all her scenes in TFA and she's onscreen for a little over a minute.

How does such a minor character get an entire book written about them? Is she going to have a bigger role in TLJ? Just curious...

 

[Tuskin38]

I have a question about Captain Phasma. When the book about her origin was released a few weeks ago, I had no memory of her at all. So I looked up all her scenes in TFA and she's onscreen for a little over a minute.

How does such a minor character get an entire book written about them? Is she going to have a bigger role in TLJ? Just curious...

She has the Boba Fett effect, very minior character that was really popular.

Also she showed up quite a bit in Pre-release TFA media.

I think she was one of the first characters revealed.

 

[Sparkle Fabulosa]

^ Thanks for clearing that up for me.

 

[WebLurker]

Since I loved the Tales From... anthologies, I'm looking forward to the Certain Point of View book. The idea of seeing the side characters stories from more than just one scene is great.

That is so terrible but hilarious that I'm more amused then infuriated.

I'm not sure I understand why you think the reveal was bad. IMHO, it did fit pretty well with the movies (given that Yoda argued against Luke initially and brought up Leia as their other hope if Luke failed).

Well, that book is joining Catalyst in the "SW books I won't read even if I was paid" category. I swear, the next time someone complains about a supposedly bad old EU book I'm just going to collapse laughing.

Given that it's a short story anthology, isn't it a bit extreme to write off the whole thing because one of the 39 stories in it doesn't appeal to you?

I've read a lot of Trek books, a LOT, and the best of them can't compare to the best of SW. Its not even a contest, Star Wars demolishes Trek in the book/comic department.

In general, I'd agree that Star Wars has had better books than Star Trek (although Trek has the superior reference books). However, The Final Reflection, by John M. Ford, is superior to pretty much every Star Wars book to date, "no contest," as you would say (and I'm saying this as someone who likes the Star Wars books better than that one). Diane Duane's Doctor's Orders is also a cut above a lot of Star Wars stuff, IMHO. "Make-Believe," a short story in the anthology Star Trek Constellations, was better than any Star Wars short story I've seen (although I haven't seen as many) and was a more meaningful story than a lot of Star Wars fiction generally is. "This Drone," from the Strange New Worlds 8, also put a lot of Star Wars short fiction to shame.

I love the old EU much, much more then the movies. I wouldn't be a huge SW fan without the EU.

Can't really relate. The reason I like Star Wars books is because of the movies. Take away the movies, the books aren't worth a quatloo.

I'd like them a lot, but the reason SW is neck and neck with Trek as my favorite franchise is the old EU. It had great characters and stories that put both the OT and Prequels to shame.

Star Trek and Star Wars are my two most favorite franchises, too. I've always been a Trekkie first, though. While I will say that I've found Star Wars more enjoyable lately (really liking the movies and the books, while I haven't liked the Abrams' movies overall, or the new novels and stuff), I still think that Star Trek comes on top. I can't see a case were Legends would be better than the Star Trek franchise though, (although such things are subjective); pound for pound, Trek has a wider range of stories and a lot more good ones.

Anyway, there I am arguing. I just hate how the Old EU gets no respect. To me, the Old EU is the franchise. It is Star Wars. its like how Stargate was a mediocre, badly written movie but SG-1 was much better and basically is the franchise. The books shouldn't have kept to the OT (although they did a fairly perfect job of doing so in the books set during the OT, the only difference is they improved on every element of the era), and not "keeping to it" lead to amazing stories that made Star Wars a universe and not just a few good to great movies.

I think that in retrospect, its easier to see the flaws in things. Also, with Legends being made up as it went along and huge chunks being written before all the movies were made, it's a bit messier, which may not appeal to everyone. I've also found that the differences between the old books and the new books/movies are different enough that it's very strange going back and reading Legends materials. It feels like Star Wars, but things aren't "right." (I also find that I really miss the post-Disney characters. It's not fair to the old stuff, since they were made before they were created, but at this point, I'm not sure I really want a Star Wars saga where Rey, Finn, Dr. Aphra, the Ghost crew, and the rest, are not in it.)

Also, if you're in my camp, I was finding that 99% of Legends output in the last few years of its existence was very bad and the new direction with the reboot made me like Star Wars tie-ins again, so there is those associations with each version ("Legends was a good thing that went bad," "new canon made it good again").

Also, new canon has the advantage of being new. If they ever did a reboot again in the future, there is a good chance that we might be somewhat harsher critics of the current iteration.

So, long story short, I'm not sure Legends deserves any "hate" it gets. There is some very good stuff in it, it's provided a lot of material for the new stuff, and is worthy of respect for the world it built onto itself. However, I think that it does have flaws, many of which the Disney canon has improved on (and planned for better) and am not sure at how well it's "aging," if that makes any sense. However, it does remain to be seen how the new canon fairs long-term. It's arguably had a stronger start than its predecessor, but a good start does not guarantee a good finish.

 

[Reverend]

I have a question about Captain Phasma. When the book about her origin was released a few weeks ago, I had no memory of her at all. So I looked up all her scenes in TFA and she's onscreen for a little over a minute.

How does such a minor character get an entire book written about them? Is she going to have a bigger role in TLJ? Just curious...

She has the Boba Fett effect, very minior character that was really popular.

Also she showed up quite a bit in Pre-release TFA media.

I think she was one of the first characters revealed.

Just to add to that: yes, it appears she's going to have a larger role in TLJ and both the comic and the novel seem to function as a way to account for why she gave into Han & Finn so easily and how she even survived TFA's finale.

Having read the book, I can say her actions now make perfect sense and makes her a *much* more interesting character than I'd previously thought.

Regarding the Boba Fett effect: In a way, her character was born out of that before the movie was even shot. IIRC the sequence of events correctly she was a fairly late addition (hence he impact of the script being minimal) and came about when Kennedy was reviewing some concept art for possible looks for Kylo and came across one titled "Stormtrooper Cloak Front Red Stripe" and basically said "That looks cool. Let's use that in there somewhere!"
The design came first and they've pretty much assembled a character around it after the fact.

 

[kirk55555]

Since I loved the Tales From... anthologies, I'm looking forward to the Certain Point of View book. The idea of seeing the side characters stories from more than just one scene is great.



I'm not sure I understand why you think the reveal was bad. IMHO, it did fit pretty well with the movies (given that Yoda argued against Luke initially and brought up Leia as their other hope if Luke failed).



Given that it's a short story anthology, isn't it a bit extreme to write off the whole thing because one of the 39 stories in it doesn't appeal to you?



In general, I'd agree that Star Wars has had better books than Star Trek (although Trek has the superior reference books). However, The Final Reflection, by John M. Ford, is superior to pretty much every Star Wars book to date, "no contest," as you would say (and I'm saying this as someone who likes the Star Wars books better than that one). Diane Duane's Doctor's Orders is also a cut above a lot of Star Wars stuff, IMHO. "Make-Believe," a short story in the anthology Star Trek Constellations, was better than any Star Wars short story I've seen (although I haven't seen as many) and was a more meaningful story than a lot of Star Wars fiction generally is. "This Drone," from the Strange New Worlds 8, also put a lot of Star Wars short fiction to shame.



Can't really relate. The reason I like Star Wars books is because of the movies. Take away the movies, the books aren't worth a quatloo.



Star Trek and Star Wars are my two most favorite franchises, too. I've always been a Trekkie first, though. While I will say that I've found Star Wars more enjoyable lately (really liking the movies and the books, while I haven't liked the Abrams' movies overall, or the new novels and stuff), I still think that Star Trek comes on top. I can't see a case were Legends would be better than the Star Trek franchise though, (although such things are subjective); pound for pound, Trek has a wider range of stories and a lot more good ones.



I think that in retrospect, its easier to see the flaws in things. Also, with Legends being made up as it went along and huge chunks being written before all the movies were made, it's a bit messier, which may not appeal to everyone. I've also found that the differences between the old books and the new books/movies are different enough that it's very strange going back and reading Legends materials. It feels like Star Wars, but things aren't "right." (I also find that I really miss the post-Disney characters. It's not fair to the old stuff, since they were made before they were created, but at this point, I'm not sure I really want a Star Wars saga where Rey, Finn, Dr. Aphra, the Ghost crew, and the rest, are not in it.)

Also, if you're in my camp, I was finding that 99% of Legends output in the last few years of its existence was very bad and the new direction with the reboot made me like Star Wars tie-ins again, so there is those associations with each version ("Legends was a good thing that went bad," "new canon made it good again").

Also, new canon has the advantage of being new. If they ever did a reboot again in the future, there is a good chance that we might be somewhat harsher critics of the current iteration.

So, long story short, I'm not sure Legends deserves any "hate" it gets. There is some very good stuff in it, it's provided a lot of material for the new stuff, and is worthy of respect for the world it built onto itself. However, I think that it does have flaws, many of which the Disney canon has improved on (and planned for better) and am not sure at how well it's "aging," if that makes any sense. However, it does remain to be seen how the new canon fairs long-term. It's arguably had a stronger start than its predecessor, but a good start does not guarantee a good finish.

Well, we'll just have to agree to disagree. There were a few bad EU books, but overall it was good to amazing and the only noticealbe weak points for me (when it comes to universe spanning events of the nold EU) was the terrible Dark nest trilogy and what happened with Jacen Solo. The last few years, outside of the Jacen stuf and things connected with it, were just fine. In no way has disney improved anything. Not one change has been for the better, and none of the characters are done as well as the old EU did them. Not everything is done bad (I do like the new movies), but nothing has been done better and very little has been done that's as good as the good EU. I'd drop Rey in a second to get back Mara Jade or Jaina, and I consider Rey probably a top 5-6 SW character after just one movie.

That's all I have to say right now. I don't really want to argue. I love the old EU, and think the new canon, even though it has two good movies and some good books, is nowhere near the level of the old EU and never will be. The old EU is also better then anything Trek has ever produced, book wise. Well, outside of reference books (although there are some pretty good SW reference books).

As for the anthology, more then half of the stories don't appeal to me. Even outside of the terrible Yoda story, if an author in the anthology has either never worked on SW or only worked on kids books, their stories don't appeal to me. If their names are Chuck Wendig or Claudia Grey, their story doesn't appeal to me. Basically, if the library ever gets the book I'll read the story by Paul Dini, the stories by the authors of new canon books I like (aka the stoires by the authors of Ahsoka, AND, Lords of the Sith) and the stories by the SW comic writers that I like (Gillen and Soule). Soul, probably around 8-10 stories out of 40 have even the slightest appeal, that's 25% of the book at best. But I don't know if they'll even get the book, and I'm not going to bother to request the library gets it. If it pops up I'll check out a few stories, but I'm putting no effort into it because I think most of it just sucks.

 

[fireproof78]

In no way has disney improved anything.

I'll leave you to your opinion, absolutely. But, I will disagree on this point because eliminating the Vong, and Palpatine somehow serving a purpose by preparing for their invasion is one facet that I am glad is completely eliminated.

And the green bunny rabbit alien.

Ok, to end this post on a positive note, here is the EU getting some respect:

The Expanded Universe no longer counts as canon, but that doesn't make its stories any less real. In fact, despite the new timeline, material is still being released under the Legends banner, so fans of the EU need not despair. I like to imagine the Episode 7 timeline and the Legends events as simply two different outcomes of the galaxy. As a certain pointy-eared green Jedi once said, always in motion is the future. Star Wars fans have been gifted with numerous ways to explore the galaxy far far away, and I look forward to seeing the future of the series - canon and otherwise.
May the Force be with you!

 

[The Wormhole]

Just to add to that: yes, it appears she's going to have a larger role in TLJ and both the comic and the novel seem to function as a way to account for why she gave into Han & Finn so easily and how she even survived TFA's finale.

Having read the book, I can say her actions now make perfect sense and makes her a *much* more interesting character than I'd previously thought.

Regarding the Boba Fett effect: In a way, her character was born out of that before the movie was even shot. IIRC the sequence of events correctly she was a fairly late addition (hence he impact of the script being minimal) and came about when Kennedy was reviewing some concept art for possible looks for Kylo and came across one titled "Stormtrooper Cloak Front Red Stripe" and basically said "That looks cool. Let's use that in there somewhere!"
The design came first and they've pretty much assembled a character around it after the fact.

IIRC, they didn't even decide on a gender for Phasma and were looking at both male and female actors before finally casting Gwendoline Christie. I think Abrams had initially tried to get Benedict Cumberbatch cast as Phasma.

 

[WebLurker]

Well, we'll just have to agree to disagree. There were a few bad EU books, but overall it was good to amazing and the only noticealbe weak points for me (when it comes to universe spanning events of the nold EU) was the terrible Dark nest trilogy and what happened with Jacen Solo.

Read the first Dark Nest and didn't like it. Wasn't exactly a fan of Jacen going dark sider, but since I was never that fond of the character in the first place, so I was kind of indifferent to it overall.

The last few years, outside of the Jacen stuf and things connected with it, were just fine.

When I say that I think the last few years of Legends were bad, I'm thinking of the post-ROTJ novels, esp. Fate of the Jedi. The stand-alones published during that time that jumped around were still good to me. Kenobi was published during that era and remains my favorite Star Wars book to date. However, since Fate of the Jedi and the other stuff were kind of the backbone of Legends, I think something was missing.

In no way has disney improved anything. Not one change has been for the better...

Major major improvement that Disney has over Legends; the next generation has actually been allowed to become the leads. The post-ROTJ novels started to do with, with the Solo kids and their peers stepping up, but after that, the reset button was mashed hard and they continued to play second fiddle to the old guard. While opinions on quality of storytelling may differ, Disney avoided one of the huge mistakes Legends made in this case.

I'd also say that the level of integration of all the different mediums goes beyond what Legends ever did, and I've found that I prefer that. Beyond that, I think it gets really subjective (do you prefer the more streamlined Death Star plan heist or the more inclusive one that tried to fit mutually exclusive accounts together, etc.?).

...and none of the characters are done as well as the old EU did them.

Well, most of the characters who made it over were either from the movies or Clone Wars. The majority of original characters from the tie-ins were not grandfathered in, and most of them who were have primarily been the really obscure ones that were never major players in the first place, or basically just using Legends names (like Emperor's staff or the people at the Death Star briefing in ANH). So, most of the canon characters we have now are originals.

As far as comparing Legends versions with canon versions, I'd argue that Depa Bilaba has become a better character, to name one. I also think that Palpatine was given more interesting motivations than just "live forever."

Not everything is done bad (I do like the new movies), but nothing has been done better and very little has been done that's as good as the good EU.

It's hard to make those assessments, since everyone has a different idea of what "better" is.

I'd drop Rey in a second to get back Mara Jade or Jaina, and I consider Rey probably a top 5-6 SW character after just one movie.

Since Rey is currently on top of my "favorite female Star Wars characters" list, I wouldn't make that bargain myself. Jaina was okay, but I don't really miss her any. I'm not sure she ever really clicked or reached her full potential as a character (although I think that did have a lot more to do with DelRey not letting the next generation take the lead than anything else). I will also concede that I found those last batches of novels really strained my liking any of the characters.

Mara would be good to see back in canon on paper, but I don't think the character's bio would work anymore. You bring back an iconic character like that, you want to give them the space they deserve to used to full effect. I'm not sure Mara could be given that in canon (unlike Thrawn in Rebels; setting aside whether he worked on the show in practice or not, on paper it would allow him to do the stuff we expect to see him do). There's also the thing that canonizing a character kind of overwrites our perceptions of the original iteration as not being that accurate. So, I'd honestly rather Mara Jade be left alone; she might not be canonical, but the Legends version will still be the "real" one, if that makes any sense, and I think any practical way to canonize where would be an "in-name" version at best.

That's all I have to say right now. I don't really want to argue. I love the old EU, and think the new canon, even though it has two good movies and some good books, is nowhere near the level of the old EU and never will be. The old EU is also better then anything Trek has ever produced, book wise. Well, outside of reference books (although there are some pretty good SW reference books).

I think the lack of "behind the scenes" information and references is the real reason I like the Star Trek reference stuff better.

As for the anthology, more then half of the stories don't appeal to me. Even outside of the terrible Yoda story, if an author in the anthology has either never worked on SW or only worked on kids books, their stories don't appeal to me. If their names are Chuck Wendig or Claudia Grey, their story doesn't appeal to me. Basically, if the library ever gets the book I'll read the story by Paul Dini, the stories by the authors of new canon books I like (aka the stoires by the authors of Ahsoka, AND, Lords of the Sith) and the stories by the SW comic writers that I like (Gillen and Soule). Soul, probably around 8-10 stories out of 40 have even the slightest appeal, that's 25% of the book at best. But I don't know if they'll even get the book, and I'm not going to bother to request the library gets it. If it pops up I'll check out a few stories, but I'm putting no effort into it because I think most of it just sucks.

If you don't want to read the book that much, that's as fair a way as any to deal with it (I have similar thoughts in regards to the X-Wing stuff). Me, I need to get a pre-order arranged, but that's just me.

 

[JD]

Have any of you guys/girls read the Red Rising books? Their author, Pierce Brown, has a story in From A Certain View, and I was curious how much like Star Wars like they are.

 

[fireproof78]

Mara would be good to see back in canon on paper, but I don't think the character's bio would work anymore. You bring back an iconic character like that, you want to give them the space they deserve to used to full effect. I'm not sure Mara could be given that in canon (unlike Thrawn in Rebels; setting aside whether he worked on the show in practice or not, on paper it would allow him to do the stuff we expect to see him do). There's also the thing that canonizing a character kind of overwrites our perceptions of the original iteration as not being that accurate. So, I'd honestly rather Mara Jade be left alone; she might not be canonical, but the Legends version will still be the "real" one, if that makes any sense, and I think any practical way to canonize where would be an "in-name" version at best.

As much as I would be loathe to have Mara Jade back in current canon, I do think she could work as a replacement for the Grand Inquisitor, a Force side to Thrawn's military side.

 

[WebLurker]

As much as I would be loathe to have Mara Jade back in current canon, I do think she could work as a replacement for the Grand Inquisitor, a Force side to Thrawn's military side.

As I understand it, the Rebels team phased out the Inquisitors on purpose, with the idea that Vader and Palpatine were the only Force users working for the Empire by the time of ANH, although I do agree that an Inquisitor would be one place Mara could've been placed. Another possibility would've been to make her a career smuggler from the get-go (maybe her folks managed to keep her away from the Empire and she would up on a career felon).