Star Trek V: The Final Frontier...LOVE

[EnriqueH]

I think the misfired humor and the bad effects all pigeon-holed this into a "bad film".

Couple that with Shatner's infamous ego, and it's easy to really let this movie have it. After all, everyone enjoys busting Bill Shatner's chops, especially those that love him.

Shatner is an idol of mine, my whole life. I love the guy. If I meet him, I'll probably faint. (I'm half kidding), and he's probably the only actor I'd be starstruck to meet. But he does have a giant ego and sometimes he has seemed a little aloof on what makes Trek work (despite the fact that I do think he's a smart man). So in viewing the movie a couple of days ago, I was really struck by how well he "got" Star Trek. Of course, Harve Bennett did hold his hand, so that might play into it too, but I like to think that Bill gets it.

 

[Terran_Empire]

I really liked this one. No one film or episode touched on the unspoken, beautiful friendship of these three men in such a charming way. The music just amplifies the undertones and themes of the film, and Shatner is not a bad director at all.

The ending is one of my favorite movie endings of all time, and I didn't find the effects to be that bad.

 

[Galileo7]

For my money this one holds up just as well as any of the others. In fact, it gets more rewatch time than the "better" films.

There are great character moments, some decent one-liners (and some stinkers), and the fan dance doesn't bother me a bit. The Planet Hell scenes aren't any worse than the ones in TSFS, in my opinion.

All in all, it's just a fun Star Trek movie.

Agree. I loved the full-scale shuttlecrafts and 1701-A shuttlecraft hangar deck set too. If they had the budget, then the finale rock creature might have been worth watching.

 

[Belz...]

So I just watched Star Trek V last night and wrote about it in my "Films Revisited" thread, but it's not doing the job.

I want to hear about why Star Trek V is AWESOME to you guys.

Can't help you. I'm finally doing some cleaning up of my DVD collection, reducing the number from 750 to about 400, and The Final Frontier is one of three Trek movies to go, along with Generations and Nemesis. Seeing it again the other day, I couldn't even get to the end.

It's unfortunate because it has potential, the character interaction is good, and the Romulan ambassador ! Woah ! It's unfortunate that the script didn't call for a Roman rescue ship. Apparently only the Federation cares at all, contra what the characters claim in the movie. It's just dissapointing.

 

[eyeresist]

Thats one of the problems I had with it. The guy is just a vulcan. Since when did they have the powers to create living hallucinations in front of people. Like you said it came across as 'hokey'.

I figured it was just a variation on the mind-meld.
I recall when the film came out there was some outrage at the very notion of a laughing Vulcan, which I thought missed the point, which is that he's not like other Vulcan's, he's something different.

If there's one thing that I've always thought is true about TFF, it's that its like a very calculated distillation of what TOS often was. Maybe in other ways it doesn't live up to the ideals of the franchise, but Shatner's memory/understanding of what Star Trek was can not be faulted. The Final Frontier comes across like TOS boiled down to its purest base elements.

It's maybe the most TOS-like of all the TOS movies. That's no bad thing.

I agree - TFF is the most TOS-like of the movies. I think fans who started with TNG are most likely to reject TFF as bad Star Trek, because it's almost diametrically opposed to that series in tone. OTOH, I have a theory that people who do like TFF are most likely to also like both TOS and ENT.

 

[Praxius]

Well to throw my view on the movie.....

I like it. I know in the past I put it down lower in the ranks compared to other ST movies, but in all honestly, It's a great ST movie.

It was the first Star Trek movie I ever watched, in fact, it was my first experience with Star Trek ever. I saw it before I got into TNG and before I saw that movie, I only saw passing TOS episodes on TV which I never watched all the way through.

Even though I didn't know what a Vulcan, Klingon or Romulan was, and I had no background understanding of any of the characters, it was done quite well.... also despite the first time I watched it, I was a kid and thought it was boring (though I thought all ST was boring)

I haven't watched it in a few years now, but I'm currently going through The Original Series right now (For the very first time after decades of ignoring it) and this Christmas, I'm getting the entire ST Movie Franchise on BluRay which will be right around the time I should be finishing with TOS. I will then be able to watch all the movies in order and in excellent quality, unlike the VHS's I watched in the past.

The last time I watched through the movies was around 2008. Watching through all the movies in order at that time (being 28 years old) I got a lot of it and appreciated it even more. At the time, I figured WoK and Undiscovered Country were the best in the original movies..... but the more and more I get into TOS and after going through all of the new movies a few times, WoK isn't really as great as I remember and TFF is a lot better than I originally thought.

I know a lot of people don't like the TNG movies and think most (if not all of them) are crap.

I honestly like the TNG movies more than any of the Originals. At first I didn't like Generations when it first came out and thought it was a bit bland, even though funny in some areas.

After I watched through all the movies back in 2008, I appreciate and in fact love Generations due to the emotions brought into the story and what Picard was going through. I actually appreciate how they linked TNG with TOS with having Kirk help save the day. Some may hate it, but I don't (to each their own)

I won't get into the other TNG movies but I thought Insurrection was the weakest of the TNG movies, but I still liked it.

When I get to watch TOS all the way through and the TNG movies when I get the BluRays, I'm sure this will all change but if I was going to order all the movies from most fav to least fav, it'd be the following:

First Contact
Nemesis
Generations
Undiscovered Country
Final Frontier
Insurrection
Wrath of Khan
Search for Spock
Voyage Home
The Motion Picture

.... I think that's all of them..... excluding the two new reboots of course.

 

[Maurice]

Re the budget...

In 2010, Executive Producer Ralph Winter made this candid observation about his role in the production... "I don’t agree that Paramount short-changed the movie. They didn’t give [Shatner] as much money for the story that he wanted to tell, but remember Star Trek II was done for $12 Million, and III was done for just under $16 Million, and IV came in a million under budget at $21 Million – I have a letter at home from the president of the studio that shows that. And I think we did the fifth movie at around or just under $30 Million, so it was more. But what he wanted to do was a big grander thing. But I don’t think more money would have made the movie better."

Source (link)

So, ST V got a significant budget bump over previous films, it's just not as much as Shatner wanted.

 

[eyeresist]

Gee, that "Other" sure is expensive.

 

[Smellmet]

Why were the visual effects so bad with the higher budget? All the shots of the Enterprise (bar the rear shot in front of the moon) looked absolutely dreadful

 

[DrBeverly]

Why were the visual effects so bad with the higher budget? All the shots of the Enterprise (bar the rear shot in front of the moon) looked absolutely dreadful

Because they were done by a different company. Shatner talks briefly in the commentary about that exact shot (the one in front of the moon) about how it was a test shot supplied by one of the companies they contacted, and they liked it enough to leave it in the final print.

 

[Smellmet]

I figured it was just a variation on the mind-meld.
I recall when the film came out there was some outrage at the very notion of a laughing Vulcan, which I thought missed the point, which is that he's not like other Vulcan's, he's something different.QUOTE]

It just wasn't explained enough for me, as good as Laurence's performance is, there was not enough backstory for the character - it just came across like he was some kind of magician - McCoy even says 'Is this some kind of trick?'

 

[Praxius]

It's been a while so I may be mistaken, but didn't he follow Vulcan teachings that were banned or something? Chances are he was using the Vulcan mind to it's fullest without any of the usual Vulcan restrictions?

*goes to look up*

 

[Memory Alpha]

I had always heard that Industrial Light and Magic, who would normally have done the effects, were contracted elsewhere - Indiana Jones and something else (Red October?) and were not available plus were going to be too expensive. That always struck me as odd, but I guess ST V was kind of the odd man out. To me, at the end is where it really shows that it's not ILM doing the effects. Some of that looks pretty slapped-together.

As to Sybok, what lost me about his powers was that evidently the others (Spock, McCoy, Kirk) were witnessing the hallucination or paranormal event or whatever you want to call it. If it's a type of mind meld, then it takes corporeal form? Didn't buy that.

The movie is honestly a huge mixed bag for me. I just think of it as kind of intentionally retro - I'm sure it was to an extent. The closing scene is really great, so I agree with who said that.

 

[Timby]

I had always heard that Industrial Light and Magic, who would normally have done the effects, were contracted elsewhere - Indiana Jones and something else (Red October?) and were not available plus were going to be too expensive. That always struck me as odd, but I guess ST V was kind of the odd man out. To me, at the end is where it really shows that it's not ILM doing the effects. Some of that looks pretty slapped-together.

There was some discussion about this earlier this year, and trevanian made a very convincing case that ILM's third-string team could have fit The Final Frontier into their schedule. (The A team was on Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, while the B team was doing Ghostbusters II and farming stuff out to Apogee and VCE in order to meet the deadline.)

In any event, the issue with the movie isn't that they didn't have money to spend ... it's that it wasn't spent wisely. The accelerated shooting schedule hurt a lot (they didn't begin filming until late October of '88, and wound up having to deal with a Teamsters strike that delayed a lot of on-location shooting, even having to pay extra to guys willing to cross the picket line), and the effects situation has been well-documented. A lot of that responsibility and blame falls on the shoulders of Bennett and Winter, really, who should have been much more judicious in how dollars and cents were being allocated (and going with Ferren & Associates was pretty much unforgivable).

 

[Maurice]

Gee, that "Other" sure is expensive.

"Other" for Above/Line includes the director, writers, producers, cinematographer, etc.

"Other" for BELOW/LINE is everyone/everything not otherwise called out by the other items, including film crew, rentals, props, craft services, etc., etc.

 

[eyeresist]

As to Sybok, what lost me about his powers was that evidently the others (Spock, McCoy, Kirk) were witnessing the hallucination or paranormal event or whatever you want to call it. If it's a type of mind meld, then it takes corporeal form? Didn't buy that.

It's a group mind-meld.

For me this ties into a plot element from ENT, where the mind meld was actually a forbidden practice at that earlier time. Sybok may have drawn on the same forbidden ancient knowledge.

 

[David Ellerman]

Let's here everyone's thoughts if and when there is a properly done director's cut. Has anybody heard anything about it?

 

[eyeresist]

I think it's generally agreed that a new cut of TFF would need redone SFX, and there isn't enough interest in the film to justify the expenditure. A shame. I'm sure there are a number of talented fans who'd do the work for free!

 

[CaptainMurdock]

I found some fan made CGI enhancements of ST:V Not perfect but gives you an idea on what could be done.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCbJ9pG6Sv0&list=UU0fQ6-jyJ3Z1WyJO_4_8Urw

 

[eyeresist]

^ Thanks for that. I knew the footage was out there but never got round to watching it. I'd forgotten how good Koenig was in this! OTOH, I still find those Klingons a bit embarrassing...