Spoilers STAR TREK: SECTION 31 - Grading & Discussion

[Alex1066]

A bad movie can certainly make money. particularly with a name like Star Trek attached. The problem is it damages the brand, which means they generally make less money next time. Considering the critical and audience reception, it didn’t add fans eager to return for the next adventure. The opposite is much more likely true.

Further, when a franchise has as many entries made over half a century as Star Trek, and they make something that is generally considered the worst or near worst film, then that should be a wake up call. It is a pretty loud and clear signal that they moved in the wrong direction.

Surely, Star Trek can weather a bad movie or two. But I would argue that it would be ill advised to give the creative team another shot at Star Trek. At the very least, something with the expectations and challenges of a movie. I mean, Stuart Baird is a great editor but after Star Trek Nemesis, his phone hasn’t exactly been ringing off the hook for for more directing jobs.

It’s something of a misconception that the money a film makes is the only measure of success in this franchise obsessed reality. What they want is to make money AND have fans clamoring for more so they can make even more money next time. On the second criteria it certainly missed the mark.

My own subjective opinion is that the film was technically unimpressive, poorly directed, and poorly written. My opinion falls fairly in line with the general consensus among fans and critics alike. From that perspective, I would not be eager to hand them the franchise again. It seems that no one was really up to the task of making a medium budget sci fi movie. Why would anyone think they would do a better job next time? The world is full of talented people who HASN'T made a trainwreck of a Star Trek film.

 

[The Wormhole]

The problem is it damages the brand,

That hasn't stopped Transformers movies, which are still going strong after eighteen years of bad movies. To say nothing of the Fast and Furious series.

I would argue that it would be ill advised to give the creative team another shot at Star Trek.

Fortunately we don't need to worry as like I said, the movie's writer is now showrunner of a successful CBS show and therefore isn't likely to be available to do Star Trek in the near future. The movie's director will probably continue to direct episodes of the various Trek shows, which he has done on many of the popular episodes of the modern shows.

I mean, Stuart Baird is a great editor but after Star Trek Nemesis, his phone hasn’t exactly been ringing off the hook for for more directing jobs.

Which probably has more to do with the reports of him being rude to the cast than the movie's quality. He's the guy who argued with LeVar Burton claiming Geordi is supposed to be an alien.

You'll note John Logan continues to get steady work as a movie writer even after Nemesis, even getting scooped up by the James Bond franchise to write Skyfall.

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

A bad movie can certainly make money. particularly with a name like Star Trek attached. The problem is it damages the brand, which means they generally make less money next time. Considering the critical and audience reception, it didn’t add fans eager to return for the next adventure. The opposite is much more likely true.

We've been seeing this with Marvel and DC, who are having to re-establish their reputations after losing the confidence and interest of their fans.

That hasn't stopped Transformers movies, which are still going strong after eighteen years of bad movies. To say nothing of the Fast and Furious series.

Transformers and Fast and Furious both found a thing that worked for them and that audiences responded to. It doesn't matter if a movie's getting trashed on Rotten Tomatoes, if the audience gets what they expect and want from a film, then the brand is delivering as promised.

I'm not a Transformers fan, I don't know how that's been going, but I loved Fast and Furious 5-8. I always got what I wanted from those movies. But when I saw that 9 and 10 got a bad reception I decided to quit while I was ahead. I doubt I'll be returning to that franchise now, except to maybe rewatch some of the old films.

 

[Tosk]

That hasn't stopped Transformers movies, which are still going strong after eighteen years of bad movies

There are several underperforming instalments, especially the last two which is a shame because IMO the last three are the only remotely good ones.

Furious' box office numbers have also been trending downward ever since Part 7. Not to the point of calling any of them a bomb, but enough that they are apparently pulling way back on the budget for the final one.

 

[fireproof78]

bad movie can certainly make money. particularly with a name like Star Trek attached. The problem is it damages the brand, which means they generally make less money next time. Considering the critical and audience reception, it didn’t add fans eager to return for the next adventure. The opposite is much more likely true.

What damage?

Are people less interested in Star Trek because of this movie? Are less people going to watch SNW because of this?

Sometimes you have bad movies. You continue on. Look at Marvel. If they have up after a bad movie we would never have gotten to Endgame.

 

[Turtletrekker]

What damage?

Are people less interested in Star Trek because of this movie? Are less people going to watch SNW because of this?

Sometimes you have bad movies. You continue on. Look at Marvel. If they have up after a bad movie we would never have gotten to Endgame.

I mean, you don't even have to go to Marvel. You can just keep looking at Star Trek.

 

[Dukhat]

Star Trek didn’t die after TFF bombed. Heck, it got better. Of course, the same can’t be said about Nemesis.

 

[Noname Given]

Why? Bad movies can still make insane amounts of money. People are only fired over a movie's performance if that bad performance caused the studio to lose money. And while Section 31 clearly didn't help anyone buy a golden bathtub or anything, it must have been profitable enough to satisfy Paramount as if they had in fact lost money on it, there would already have been high profile firings. No one's been fired, the only consequences we can expect from this are not getting anymore streaming Star Trek movies.

Seriously, Section 31 may not be the best movie around, but it is not the disaster everyone makes it sound like, and it most certainly is not grounds to get anyone fired, particularly given everyone involved in the production side of things have proven their wort on other projects, Star Trek and otherwise.

Section31 made top 10 in the Nielsen streaming ratings for at least two reports.

That's something neither Daredevil Born Again nor ironheart managed to do for Disney Plus.

I bring the above up because that's one thing the suits consider when considering doing more. In other words I don't think we've seen the end of streaming Star Trek films.

The film seem to perform well enough for Paramount Plus.

And yeah I even I don't think it's the worst Star Trek film made. For me that dishonor goes to Star Trek V The Final Frontier.

I also found it more washable than any of the Next Generation feature films with the exception of Star Trek: First Contact which was itself a good film.

YMMV.

 

[The Wormhole]

That's something neither Daredevil Born Again nor ironheart managed to do for Disney Plus.

Well, Ironheart hasn't premiered yet.

 

[Detached Nacelle]

Don't you know companies pay for their views in advance as well as their review scores.

 

[cooleddie74]

If one bad MCU movie would have tanked the entire franchise then The Dark World would have been its swan song.

 

[Tosk]

I also found it more washable than any of the Next Generation feature films with the exception of Star Trek: First Contact which was itself a good film.

Section 31 definitely needs to be washed away.

 

[Tiran O'Saurus]

Well, Ironheart hasn't premiered yet.

That's how much a failure it is, ZERO WHOLE PEOPLE have watched it!!!

 

[The Wormhole]

That's how much a failure it is, ZERO WHOLE PEOPLE have watched it!!!

You joke, but I remember someone actually did seriously make that claim about She-Hulk before it premiered.

 

[Lord Garth]

This week, I'm not sure which day, I'll finally be watching the Section 31 TV Movie a second time. I'll be putting on "Terra Firma" first, and then I'll go straight into Section 31.

I know it condensed a 10-episode arc into a 96-minute movie and it subsequently went through re-write after re-write after re-write, but I'm still going to try to see if I can spot where the episode breaks would've been, had this actually been 10 episodes. It might or might not be possible, but I'm curious either way.

 

[Turtletrekker]

This week, I'm not sure which day, I'll finally be watching the Section 31 TV Movie a second time. I'll be putting on "Terra Firma" first, and then I'll go straight into Section 31.

I know it condensed a 10-episode arc into a 96-minute movie and it subsequently went through re-write after re-write after re-write, but I'm still going to try to see if I can spot where the episode breaks would've been, had this actually been 10 episodes. It might or might not be possible, but I'm curious either way.

I'd be willing to bet that the titles of the three "coded transmissions" -- A Night at the Barram, The Godsend and The Passageway were all originally episode titles.

 

[Lord Garth]

Looks like the day is going to be today! Tonight, rather.

At least I know what I'm in for this time. 35 years as a fan and I was never caught as off-guard with anything as I was with S31.

 

[Lord Garth]

Things ran a little late last night. The first thing I watched was the "Terra Firma" two-parter. I still think one last trip to the Mirror Universe to see how Georgiou would do things differently now, before she's sent on the next chapter of her life was a great way to finish her time on Discovery and set up Section 31. She mentions San to Burnham just before she departs.

Then I grabbed some coffee, and put on Section 31. I watched the first hour of it before going to bed, now I'm picking up where I left off.

I took some notes, for the structure, like I said I would.


Act I. One Night at Baraam is the first 40 minutes. Coded Transmission 1.
Act II. The Godsend is the next 30 minutes. Coded Transmission 2.
Act III. The Passageway is the last 25 minutes. Coded Transmission 3.

Act I is a little longer because it needs more exposition.

• Throughout these four episodes would've been the flashback scenes with Georgiou where she kills her family, makes San her servant, and becomes Emperor would've also been here. Then we would've seen her time as Emperor and her created the Godsend before abandoning it.
  
  
• Episode 1 would've been an expanded version of the first 18 minutes of the TV Movie. Alok and others infiltrate the establishment Georgiou was discovered at. We'd have for sure gotten fleshed-out scenes where we see them all doing their thing. Georgiou can tell they're all Section 31.
  
  Then it goes into the meeting between Alok and Georgiou, ending with Georgiou saying she's in. Does she want to stay at the establishment she has or does she want to be part of the action? She wats to be part of the action. Just like in her Section 31 recruitment scene that was cut from the end of Discovery Season 1.
  
  
• Episode 2 would've started with the briefing about Metalhead. I don't remember his name, so that's what I'll call him. We get more of the other characters in S31 being fleshed out, mainly through their interactions with each other, as opposed to the first episode where they were all mostly in their own individual lanes. It would've ended on an action cliffhanger. I'm guessing at the 28-minute mark where the guy covered in all black with the goggles and the distorted voice shows up.
  
  
• Episode 3 picks up with the fight between Georgiou and that guy with the goggles. After this, Georgiou pieces together things are worse than Alok thought. She figures out something is going on, something familiar to her. This is where Georgiou thinks back to the Godsend and when she (thinks) she killed San. After that, Georgiou and Alok talk again. They formally agree to become partners in arms after Georgiou points out that Alok gave her a taste of the action, knowing that she wants more. This is where Alok reveals that, like her, he's also from another time. Specifically, he's from the Eugenics Wars and he talks about his own history with tyrants. From this point on, they're all in on the mission. Georgiou knows they're after someone using the Godsend, a weapon that she created. "Gather your people," she tells Alok, "We're going to need every one of them."

With where Section 31 Season 1 would've been at with the end of its third episode is where Picard Season 1 was at the end of its third episode. A clearly defined mission. In PIC S1, they have to find Soji. In S31, they have to find the Godsend. By the end of PIC S1 Act I, the core group (minus Elnor) are on La Sierna. By the end of S31 Act I, Georgiou is firmly in S31 again with a clear mission and a core group.

I'll stop here for now. Because of the way other seasons of New Trek have been, I'm going to assume that Act II would've been Episodes 4-8. That means there was a subplot (or several) and detours that were cut out for sure, to focus on the main story.

Because of the detail I'm going into, you probably figured my opinion of S31 has gone up. It has, since I'm watching it for what it is, as opposed to what I thought it was going to be: something more like DSC, DS9, or a cross between the two. I don't know how I'd re-rate it yet. Higher than the 3 that I initially gave, but lower than a 7. So definitely a "mid". What type of "mid", I don't know yet.

Michelle Yeoh is a critically acclaimed actress, but she's also someone who likes to do all the action stuff, she likes quirky characters, and stories that are bizarre and go all-out. She also likes stories that challenge norms and puts her in roles that would usually be played by men. Section 31 fits all of that. She can do award-winning movies and does, but she's also not above doing things like S31. I've seen enough of her movies now to know this for a fact. She doesn't like to be bored always doing the same thing.

 

[Alex1066]

Things ran a little late last night. The first thing I watched was the "Terra Firma" two-parter. I still think one last trip to the Mirror Universe to see how Georgiou would do things differently now, before she's sent on the next chapter of her life was a great way to finish her time on Discovery and set up Section 31. She mentions San to Burnham just before she departs.

Then I grabbed some coffee, and put on Section 31. I watched the first hour of it before going to bed, now I'm picking up where I left off.

I took some notes, for the structure, like I said I would.


Act I. One Night at Baraam is the first 40 minutes. Coded Transmission 1.
Act II. The Godsend is the next 30 minutes. Coded Transmission 2.
Act III. The Passageway is the last 25 minutes. Coded Transmission 3.

Act I is a little longer because it needs more exposition.

• Throughout these four episodes would've been the flashback scenes with Georgiou where she kills her family, makes San her servant, and becomes Emperor would've also been here. Then we would've seen her time as Emperor and her created the Godsend before abandoning it.
  
  
• Episode 1 would've been an expanded version of the first 18 minutes of the TV Movie. Alok and others infiltrate the establishment Georgiou was discovered at. We'd have for sure gotten fleshed-out scenes where we see them all doing their thing. Georgiou can tell they're all Section 31.
  
  Then it goes into the meeting between Alok and Georgiou, ending with Georgiou saying she's in. Does she want to stay at the establishment she has or does she want to be part of the action? She wats to be part of the action. Just like in her Section 31 recruitment scene that was cut from the end of Discovery Season 1.
  
  
• Episode 2 would've started with the briefing about Metalhead. I don't remember his name, so that's what I'll call him. We get more of the other characters in S31 being fleshed out, mainly through their interactions with each other, as opposed to the first episode where they were all mostly in their own individual lane. It would've ended on an action cliffhanger. I'm guessing at the 28-minute mark where the guy covered in all black with the boggles and the distorted voice shows up.
  
  
• Episode 3 picks up with the fight between Georgiou and that guy with the googles. After this, Georgiou pieces together things are worse than Alok thought. She pieces together something is going on, something familiar to her. This is where Georgiou thinks back to the Godsend and when she (thinks) she killed San. After that, Georgiou and Alok talk about again. They formally agree to be become partners in arms after Georgiou points out that Alok gave her a taste of the action, knowing that she wants more. This is where Alok reveals that he's also from another time. Specifically, he's from the Eugenics Wars and he talks about his own history with tyrants. From this point on, they're all in on the mission. Georgiou knows they're after someone using the Godsend, a weapon that she created. "Gather your people," she tells Alok, "We're going to need every one of them."

With where Section 31 Season 1 would've been at with the end of its third episode is where Picard Season 1 was at the end of its third episode. A clearly defined mission. In PIC S1, they have to find Soji. In S31, they have to find the Godsend. By the end of PIC S1 Act I, the core group (minus Elnor) are on La Sierna. By the end of S31 Act I, Georgiou is firmly in S31 again with a clear mission and a core group.

I'll stop here for now. Because of the way other seasons of New Trek have been, I'm going to assume that Act II would've been Episodes 4-8. That means there was a subplot (or several) and detours that were cut out for sure, to focus on the main story.

Because of the detail I'm going into, you probably figured my opinion of S31 has gone up. It has, since I'm watching it for what it is, as opposed to what I thought it was going to be: something more like DSC, DS9, or a cross between the two. I don't know how I'd re-rate it yet. Higher than the 3 that I initially gave, but lower than a 7. So definitely a "mid". What type of "mid", I don't know yet.

Michelle Yeoh is a critically acclaimed actress, but she's also someone who likes to do all the action stuff, she likes quirky characters, and stories that are bizarre and go all-out. She also likes stories that challenge norms and puts her in roles that would usually be played by men. Section 31 fits all of that. She can award-winning movies and does, but she's also not above doing things like S31. I've seen enough of her movies now to know this for a fact. She doesn't like to be bored always doing the same thing.

I just am very thankful it wasn’t an entire series. The greatest compliment I have for it is the runtime is short.

 

[Turtletrekker]

I just am very thankful it wasn’t an entire series. The greatest compliment I have for it is the runtime is short.

I would have loved to have read all 10 scripts. I think it's disingenuous to judge what the series might have been based on this hodgepodge Frankenstein's monster of a script.