Star Trek Reboot was amazing. I don't understand the hate!
- Thread starter OneAngryRomulan
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Isn't using the phrase "true fan" one of those things where you automatically lose the argument?
Be nice
Isn't using the phrase "true fan" one of those things where you automatically lose the argument?
Indeed, it's the local version of Godwin's law.
Apparently, according to the graphic novel Star Trek: Countdown (I have not read it myself), the Narada was retrofitted with reverse-engineered Borg technology. This accounts for its advanced weaponry and, possibly, the effects it has on sub-space communications/transporters. I don't know for sure. I found this via Google image search:
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Narada
I think it is a great film too.
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Apparently, according to the graphic novel Star Trek: Countdown (I have not read it myself), the Narada was retrofitted with reverse-engineered Borg technology. This accounts for its advanced weaponry and, possibly, the effects it has on sub-space communications/transporters. I don't know for sure. I found this via Google image search:
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Narada
I think it is a great film too.
Do yourself a favor RedShirtNoob and don't read it. Countdown, and the follow-up Nero are total fanwank by the authors. The comics were written by authors who had only seen a draft of the script. The weave in alot of material that contradicts what we see in the movie.
The origin of the Jellyfish
The cause of the Supernova
The Narada and her abilities are the biggest plot hole presented by the comics. Robotic tentacles like the one Doc Ock had in Spiderman 2 lay about the ship and attack intruders. For chrissakes, they'll add any sort of garbage to these comics. The special features Blu-ray and dvd provide clarity to the Narada's origins but still present multiple plot holes to the movie context.
The development of red matter and unnecessary political drama between the Vulcans and Romulans.
The TNG characters Picard, Worf, Data and Geordie are interjected into the comics, to piggy back on TNG's popularity.
Lastly they even add V'ger to the Nero comic.
Honestly the comics read like a fanfic written by a highschooler who has extensive Trek knowledge and got a preview of JJ's movie script.
I really enjoyed Countdown, continuity glitches aside. The Nero comic was fine until V'Ger came along, at which point it died a horrible, horrible death.
Isn't using the phrase "true fan" one of those things where you automatically lose the argument?
Indeed, it's the local version of Godwin's law.
In this case, I'm using it in a rare, valid way - someone who would rather see Star Trek destroyed than done any way other than how they want it.
But when people use it in debates over the color of nacelles, yeah, it's BS.
I love that Star Trek was rebooted. I loved the new cast. I thought the movie looked great.
Sadly, it was yet another sloppily written piece of Hollywood blockbuster fodder.
Here's my problems with it - all from a storytelling perspective:
The story structure is that of How James Kirk Became Captain of the Enterprise. The emotional structure is Spock's story through and through. This mismatch was very awkward.
Kirk, as written for this movie, was a tool. There's nothing special about him that we see. We're told he's a genius, but we don't see him being a genius. His great moment at the Kobayashi Maru is delivered with all the flair of a drunken frat boy. He's presented as a Movie!Rebel (i.e. - I'm a dick but people think I'm cool anyway) and he offers nothing except Hey, I've seen that big space storm before! He engenders no emotional identification, no respect and, because his rise to the rank of captain was so arbitrary, completely breaking the suspension of disbelief. Right before he and Sulu launch for Big Action Sequence number whatever, Pike, for no reason whatsoever promotes him to first officer. This kind of WTF? story logic is terrible. It breaks the internal rules set up within the tale by having Starfleet be a quasi-military organization with ranks and chains of command. They tried to hide it by pitching it into the middle of a high-octane moment, but it shows how thin the fabric of the story is any way.
Because of the inexplicable desire to cater to fanboy requirements of rebooting the franchise in-universe, the story comes to a screeching halt at its mid-point so that Kirk can, amazingly, be exiled to the exact planet where Old Spock is sitting there waiting to tell him what the hell is going on and deliver ham-handed dialog about how his best friend is the guy who just kicked him off the ship - for being such a tool. This agains breaks suspension of disbelief because it's an awkward contrivance to have Kirk meet Old Spock, and because it's an awful way to tell a story. Kirk meet Spock, you and he are in this scene for no other reason that that he will now spend 3 minutes filling in story exposition.
Star Trek, more than anything else, has always been about character and great moments of emotional resonance among them. Spock has a couple of genuine moments where you can identify with him, but no one else does, and the proposed Great Friendship that is meant to sit at the center of the story ends up feeling like forced destiny rather than emerging out of the character development of the two men. In short, I didn't buy it because the story didn't sell it well at all.
Did the cast do a great job of reviving and re-inventing the characters while being respectful of their legacies? Absolutely. Unfortunately the writers didn't even pen a decent story, much less a decent Star Trek story. It's like a tale put together in screenwriting 101 by someone with a mediocre grasp of story dynamics.
Yea, especially hated the whole rebel without a cause thing they did to Kirk. It's like, for whatever weird reason, they had to make Kirk some type of 'bad boy' who despite consistently stepping in it, goes off smelling like a rose. Plus him getting beat up so often is ugh, it's like one of those guys who act tough and bad, but in actuality have no guts at all. And like you said, Kirk was just an insubordinate jerk in this one, and yet he is given the Enterprise, when he's even younger than the real Kirk (Sorry, but I'll always call the original Kirk as the real one, akin to the Cybermen from the classic series being the real Cybermen and the Cybusmen from 2006-today being just bad knockoffs, same with JJ Kirk). Call me old fashioned, but I prefer the booky, dorky 'college boy' Kirk from what TOS depicted: someone who respectable, intelligent, and was not just out for himself. JJ Kirk, to me, is more like a caricature.....the fanwank depiction of James Kirk......the Bad Ass with a phaser in one hand, and some good looking alien in his other arm, with stuff blowing up all around him. To me, making Kirk into this.....thing....is the equivalent of Greedo shooting first for the Star Wars fans. I'm sorry, but with Kirk's mutation, bad story writing, the extreme changes in appearances (ie: Sleek, shiny bridge and exterior of the Enterprise, and the cheap-ass, grimy, grungy AXIS Chemicals brewery of engineering), and lousy references of names, places and items from original Trek used sloppily in a shoddily made attempt to appeal to TOS fans, this is not Trek to me, just some B film akin to the countless science fiction films released in the early 1980's, just with a larger budget, flashier visuals, and with "STAR TREK" on the tin to make as a selling point. As I mentioned in another thread, I am so glad that I did not pay money to see this one, and was shown this in the form of a pre production DVD from a guy who was part of the folks making the DVD ready to sell to everyone, otherwise I'd have really felt like I've wasted whatever the price of cinema tickets are these days, have not gone to a theater in 9 years.
Just a note: Kirk was an insubordinate, bad boy genius with an attitude problem, a penchant for fighting and stealing cars, and a lothario, before the timeline was altered. Joining Starfleet did not change him much, either. In fact, his attitude was pretty much the same up until the incident with the Cloud Creature that killed half the crew of the Farragut.
You care to point to a source for that?
Perhaps you should read Starfleet Academy: Collision Course for starters. Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelhof did when writing the character. Kirk just didn't have the benefit of having a respected father to keep him from being shot out of an airlock and floating in space, in the rebooted movie.
Why? It's not an official part of Star Trek continuity in any way, shape or form.
There's enough bad stuff that is canon without dragging in bad stuff that's not.
Yep. Like when Uhura mentions her area of expertise in the bar and Kirk could only sweat and divert her attention to the novelty salt shakers. "Ummm xenolingui... It's a little starship! Isn't that clever?"
Or when he failed to navigate the water turbine interface and Scotty was shredded after only seven minutes in the film. What an idiot!
You got that right! JJ Kirk didn't have one single redeemable quality whatsoever. He mocked that dock worker for admiring his bike, he lol'ed when Sulu fell from the Narada's mining apparatus, and relieved Spock simply because his Maru caused Kirk's academic suspension.
And speaking of which, it wasn't McCoy's fault that Kirk was placed on suspension, but that didn't stop him from stamping his feet and whining until Bones agreed to smuggle him aboard the Enterprise.
I know!!! The real James T. Kirk would have been handing out Karate Chops and Double Axe Handle blows like nobody's business. He also would have jumped off after Sulu when he started to fall towards Vulcan. JJ Kirk has no guts at all!!!
Booky and dorky, but doesn't get beat up too much. I hear ya!
Preach it, brother! The real Kirk don't need no 'splosions!
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