Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x07 - "Dominion"

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Picard' started by Commander Richard, Mar 29, 2023.

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Engage!

  1. 10 - Excellent!

    15.5%
  2. 9

    23.5%
  3. 8

    30.3%
  4. 7

    16.4%
  5. 6

    4.6%
  6. 5

    5.0%
  7. 4

    1.7%
  8. 3

    1.3%
  9. 2

    0.4%
  10. 1 - Terrible!

    1.3%
  1. edschen

    edschen Ensign Red Shirt

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    Short scene, actor only seen through the viewscreen, dark background. They likely went with an "off the shelf" solution, as taking new molds and customizing the ears would be quite expensive all the way around.
     
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  2. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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  3. Timelord Victorious

    Timelord Victorious Vice Admiral Admiral

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    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    yeah, it’s different ear prosthetics.
    His face looking a bit thinner probably adds to the prominence of the ears.
    Also Tim Russ’s real ears seem to have gained some. So I don’t have any real problems with his appearance in Picard.
     
  4. vulcancicada

    vulcancicada Commander Red Shirt

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    Great episode generally, much better than last week. But I think I would like this season a lot better if they'd released it all at once. I have zero satisfaction watching it this way. It feels like different people wrote each episode and they don't flow. This one was really good, but it barely connected to last week's. It seemed a bit out of phase, like I watched part of an episode. I still gave it a 9 but the constant cliff hanging and suspense had better lead somewhere good or I will be annoyed. I suspect we aren't going to find out Jack's deal next week either, based on the fact that we didn't explore last week's cliff hanger in this episode.
     
  5. Borgminister

    Borgminister Admiral Moderator

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    The first episode of the season I couldn't give even a rose-colored glasses 10... So I'll go with 8. There were nice moments between Geordi and Data/Lore, and Picard and Beverley, but the Jack/Sydney scenes came off as kind of flat, and I'm not sure real chemistry is there between the actors... This episode was very dark, yet Vadik's backstory is not a unique one as a plot device, and serviceable scenery chewing aside, her story is not all that compelling to me. The talking head is also starting to wear thin, like Skin of Evil thin. I don't know, maybe I just missed some of the banter and quips that were sprinkled into the other episodes. Finally, something was off about the direction in this episode, which called out for an A-lister to make the wannabe gravitas of the story click...
     
  6. Dee1891

    Dee1891 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I'm a little confused. Isn't there someone with authority over Vadik? Or was that person a figment of her imagination? It is interesting that the Federation is paying the consequences for something created by this series and not for the attempted genocide against the Founders or deceiving the Romulans into joining the Dominion War. Also, is this season some attempt for Picard's crew to fight the Dominion War, a conflict they had missed all those years ago?
     
  7. BandoOfBorg

    BandoOfBorg Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    I could be wrong, but given that Vadic was whistling "pop goes the weasel" and referenced her time on Daystrom Station, I thought it was Lore directing her. He likely saved, and is now using, the surviving Founder prisoners.

    I am having a difficult time figuring out what Jack's origin/role is.
     
  8. Caeruleus

    Caeruleus Commander Red Shirt

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    Not a good reason. In season 3 we are going to see real Tuvok in episode 8,9 or 10. Actor told us that yesterday.
     
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  9. Timelord Victorious

    Timelord Victorious Vice Admiral Admiral

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    She wasn’t whistling Pop goes the Weasel.
    Different tune
     
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  10. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Admiral Admiral

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    More relevant dialogue from DS9 pertaining to Section 31, this time from "Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges"...
    The Deep Space Nine Transcripts - Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges (chakoteya.net)

    [Bashir's quarters]


    SLOAN: Section Thirty one is extremely interested in this conference of yours. However, the Tal'Shiar will be handling the security arrangements, so we have virtually no chance of using any technical assets to gather intelligence. As a result, we'll be forced to rely on organic assets, like you. Your mission is to gather data on the Romulan leadership. In essence, we want you to take the pulse of their government. No pun intended.

    BASHIR: You want me to spy on an ally.

    SLOAN: To evaluate an ally. And a temporary ally at that. I say that because when the war is over, the following will happen in short order. The Dominion will be forced back to the Gamma Quadrant, the Cardassian Empire will be occupied, the Klingon Empire will spend the next ten years recovering from the war and won't pose a serious threat to anyone. That leaves two powers to vie for control of the quadrant, the Federation and the Romulans.

    BASHIR: This war isn't over and you're already planning for the next.

    SLOAN: Well put. I hope your report is equally succinct.

    [Captain's office]

    BASHIR: Odo's checked all the security logs. There's no indication of how Sloan got aboard or where he went.

    SISKO: Can't say I'm surprised. From what we've seen of them, Section Thirty one is very meticulous in covering their tracks. I had a conversation with Admiral Ross this afternoon. He and I both agree that the Romulan conference is too important to cancel.

    BASHIR: What about me?

    SISKO: Starfleet Command has promised to send the expert on Dominion biogenic weapons and Ketracel white to the conference. Since that's you, you go. And we want you to carry out your assignment. Make a few discreet observations on the Romulan leadership and then wait for Sloan to contact you again.

    BASHIR: Somehow, I don't think giving Sloan any information is a good idea.

    SISKO: That was my instinct as well, but after talking to Ross I think we might have an opportunity here we can turn to our advantage. Officially, Starfleet Command has said that they are appalled at the very notion that an organisation like Section Thirty one might exist, and that they plan to get to the bottom of this entire business.

    BASHIR: And unofficially?

    SISKO: They have quietly pushed the investigation aside, which means either they don't take Section Thirty one seriously or someone at Starfleet Command is protecting them.

    And now dialogue from "When It Rains"...
    The Deep Space Nine Transcripts - When It Rains... (chakoteya.net)

    [Infirmary]


    BASHIR: The dispersal pattern in this resonance scan. I've seen it before.

    O'BRIEN: What do you mean?

    BASHIR: When I first came to the station, I had to familiarise myself with Odo's physiology. Doctor Mora was kind enough to share his data with me. This looks like the scan he did when he first found Odo.

    O'BRIEN: Are you sure? There's a lot of numbers there.

    BASHIR: I saw it with my own eyes not seven years ago.

    O'BRIEN: You really are genetically enhanced, aren't you.

    BASHIR: According to the date, this scan was done when Odo was at Starfleet Medical.

    O'BRIEN: Two different scans can't have exactly the same dispersal pattern?

    BASHIR: It's impossible. Someone took Mora's results and built up a phony medical workup around them. This isn't Odo's file. They sent a fake.

    O'BRIEN: I can't believe Starfleet Medical would actually make up a fake file just to throw you off.

    BASHIR: You're right. It isn't something Starfleet Medical would do.

    O'BRIEN: Are you thinking what I'm thinking?

    BASHIR: Section Thirty One.

    O'BRIEN: An organisation that's prepared to do whatever it takes to protect the Federation wouldn't even blink at doing something like this.

    BASHIR: They don't want me to find a cure. They're afraid the Founders will get hold of it.

    O'BRIEN: And to keep that from happening, they're willing to let Odo die.

    [Infirmary]

    O'BRIEN: I don't know, Julian. If Section Thirty One is involved in this, maybe we should tell the Captain.

    BASHIR: We've been over this, Miles. If we tell him, he'll have to report it to Starfleet Command. Thirty One'll certainly get wind of it and once they realise we figured out the files are fake, they'll take steps to make sure we don't find a cure.

    O'BRIEN: I see your point. What steps do you think they might take?

    BASHIR: Believe me, we don't want to find out.

    [...]

    BASHIR: Hang on, hang on, I'm just trying to figure out when Odo became infected. I analysed the sample he left and mapped out the life cycle of the virus. I'm programming the computer to calculate just how long it took for the virus to achieve its present level of concentration.

    O'BRIEN: That makes sense. According to that, he was infected over two years ago?

    BASHIR: More than that. I just don't understand. I assumed he became infected when he Linked with the female shape-shifter.

    O'BRIEN: But if it happened that long ago, how come he hasn't shown any symptoms before?

    BASHIR: Good question. Got it. Stardate 49419.

    O'BRIEN: Almost three years ago.

    BASHIR: Wait a minute. 49419. That's the day that Odo was at Starfleet Medical.

    O'BRIEN: You sure?

    BASHIR: Yes. My god. No wonder Hilliard wouldn't let me see the file. Section Thirty one must have created the virus, infected Odo, and then used him as a carrier.

    O'BRIEN: So that when he Linked with another changeling, he'd pass it on, and eventually the entire race would be infected.

    BASHIR: Thirty one isn't just trying to stop us from finding a cure. They're trying to cover up the fact that they set out to commit genocide.

    O'BRIEN: Well if they gave Odo this disease, then they must have a cure.

    BASHIR: We have to find a way to get our hands on that cure.

    O'BRIEN: Before Thirty One gets their hands on us.


    Dialogue from "Tacking Into the Wind"
    The Deep Space Nine Transcripts - Tacking Into The Wind (chakoteya.net)

    [Infirmary]

    O'BRIEN:
    Mind if I ask you a question about Thirty One?

    BASHIR: Go ahead.

    O'BRIEN: Well, if you were to find the cure and they got to know about it, what do you think they'd do?

    BASHIR: Well, I imagine they'd be very concerned. The very existence of a cure would jeopardise their plan to eradicate the Founders. It wouldn't surprised me if Sloan or another operative turned up here on the station to destroy my work. What are you getting at?

    O'BRIEN: I think you should send a message to Starfleet Medical saying that you have found the cure.

    BASHIR: You're trying to lure someone from Section Thirty One?

    O'BRIEN: Yeah. That's right.

    BASHIR: What happens when this operative gets here?

    O'BRIEN: We capture him. Then we figure out a way to get some information out of him.

    BASHIR: He may not know anything about the disease.

    O'BRIEN: Maybe not, but I bet he knows who does. What do you think?

    BASHIR: I think it's a plan. A very good plan. When did you get so devious?

    O'BRIEN: I've been hanging around you too long. Let's just hope this works and we can cure Odo. That's all I care about.

    BASHIR: Me too, Miles.


    Finally, dialogue from "Extreme Measures"
    The Deep Space Nine Transcripts - Extreme Measures (chakoteya.net)

    [Sloan's office]

    (Button 48 opens the door to reveal a room with pieces of paper all over the floor. Sloan is reclining in his desk chair.)

    BASHIR: Sloan?

    SLOAN:
    Welcome to Section Thirty One, gentlemen.

    BASHIR:
    You know exactly why we're here.

    SLOAN:
    You don't really expect me to help you.

    (Bashir starts going through a pile of PADDs.)

    SLOAN:
    You sure you want to throw that one away?

    BASHIR:
    I'm collecting medical information, not surveillance reports.

    SLOAN:
    It's not just any report. That's on Jaresh-Inyo.

    BASHIR:
    Former President Inyo?

    SLOAN:
    The one and only.

    BASHIR:
    My God. Thirty One had a man in his cabinet.

    O'BRIEN:
    Don't let him distract you.

    SLOAN:
    Just one of the little nuggets lying around in this once tidy room. You'd be amazed at what you could find.

    BASHIR:
    Current operations on Kronos. Chancellor Martok would love to get his hands on this.

    O'BRIEN:
    Julian, look at this.

    BASHIR:
    Radodine, lidestolinine, asporanine, adenine. That's it.

    (Big rumble and sparks.)

    O'BRIEN:
    I think it's time we got out of here.

    BASHIR:
    Hold on a moment.

    O'BRIEN:
    What for?

    BASHIR:
    These files, they contain all of Sloan's memories on Section Thirty One. With this information we can destroy the entire organisation.

    O'BRIEN:
    That'll have to wait.

    SLOAN:
    It's not that simple, Chief. There is no building, no room like this in the real world. Section Thirty One has no headquarters. These files, they exist only in the minds of a very select group of people, and I happen to be one of them. If you really want to destroy Section Thirty One, it's now or never.

    BASHIR:
    He's right. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity. We can't pass it up.

    O'BRIEN:
    Julian!

    BASHIR:
    What?

    O'BRIEN:
    Listen to me. He wants us to die with him. If we die, Odo dies too!

    SLOAN:
    All my secrets are yours for the taking, Doctor. If you want them badly enough.

    O'BRIEN:
    Odo needs you, Julian. He's counting on you.

    SLOAN:
    You're making a terrible mistake, Doctor.

    BASHIR:
    I don't think so.

    That covers all the relevant dialogue from DS9 about Section 31 as it pertains to their having infected The Greak Link.
     
  11. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Tuvok looked fine
     
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  12. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    She was whistling three blind mice
     
  13. Yistaan

    Yistaan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Picard rushes in just as a broken Tuvok is about to tell the changelings that he sees 5 lights.
     
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  14. Pubert

    Pubert Vice Admiral Admiral

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    So the whole picard and Beverly attempting to execute Vadic. Not sure I'm good with it. 7 executed a unarmed person that killed Icheb back on season 1 and it really marred her character even to this day. Admiral Kirk lost his son I'm TSFS and even after fighting the Kruge who killed his son he didn't just outright murder Kruge. After Kruge lost the fight and was hanging off a cliff edge Kirk tried to save him. Of course Kruge tried to take Kirk with him so Kirk had no choice but to kick Kruge to his death. The thing is he never contemplated just shooting a unarmed prisoner in cold blood. I can't believe Picard and Beverly felt they had no choice. Same with 7. Q really was right about humanity and all of picards speeches were just bullshit. Lol

    But Kirk wins in my opinion as the better captain and leader at this point in time. But I'm sure if they film more adventure with another actor playing him Kirk will be dragged into a dark place. Too bad.
     
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  15. drt

    drt Commodore Commodore

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    Probably because of all the Berman era shows, DS9 left the most interesting things worthy of exploring further. TNG pretty much wrapped itself up nicely with "All Good Things" closing the book on what started in "Encounter at Farpoint".

    It also doesn't help that the principal antagonists for the TNG crew were the Romulans, and they were already explored (perhaps unsatisfyingly to some) in Nemesis and Picard Season 1.
     
  16. Ssosmcin

    Ssosmcin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I just feel like Picard Season 3 is the vehicle for wrapping up the 24th century Berman Era continuity. I have zero issues with this because I am enjoying the ride and really appreciated the shared Trekverse they had created through all of those shows happening at once. It is the only Paramount + series that doesn't feel like Alt Trek to me. Whatever the relative merits of the other shows (and I don't watch the animateds), they feel like their own thing. So if this is indeed the last season of ST:P, then I am totally on board for tying in the other two contemporary series in a big event that Picard and his crew resolve. They started the 24th century continuity, I'm fine with them finishing it.
     
  17. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Nah, it didn't.
     
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  18. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It was a good episode. I'm guessing Jack has been engineered to puppet people... somehow... for some implausible reason...

    Starfleet are again to blame for everything. And Picard and Beverly did exactly what Section 31 did when they decided to kill Vadic (even though it didn't actually happen). Compromised their morals to help themselves.
     
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  19. The Emissary

    The Emissary Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I am kind of conflicted. After decades of the tiniest shout outs to DS9 from ENT --> Abramsverse --> DISCO (earlier seasons), DS9 is finally getting real recognition beyond the odd Bajoran or Trill in the background (or the open S31 all over the place). We're finally talking about the Dominion War and it's fall out. There is so much material to mine there, that it's shocking the writers didn't do that earlier. If they wanted to militarize Starfleet to be this "darker" organization, they easily could have said the Dominion War and nearly losing to the Founders made them shift from being so blindly pacifistic.

    So while I absolutely love that we are going back to DS9-esque stories, it is jarring that outside of Worf, we haven't had a single DS9 actor come back. And if this is to finalize the TNG-era, it does seem an interesting writer's choice to finish them with DS9 villains (unless the big reveal is that Sela or Armus or some TNG villain is really pulling the strings...).

    I don't dislike it, per se. They already finished plot lines with the Romulans, Borg, and Q. Those were the primary villains of the TNG show. So they are in need of mining the other shows. Since VOY's villains are in the Delta Quadrant, I guess it only makes sense to use DS9's villains. I just wish that we'd get some other DS9 folks in the mix of a Founder threat. I feel like if Rene Auberjonois were still with us, he'd at least cameo at some point. I'm not holding my breath on Avery Brooks returning. :(
     
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  20. Jaster

    Jaster Captain Captain

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    she was whistling “Three Blind Mice”…I wonder if it’s significant?