Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x03 - "Seventeen Seconds"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
Unfortunately, it makes sense on a meta-level, even if I don't agree with it. Why? Because it sounds like something that would be... Roddenberry Approved.
I'm holding my nose here.
Jean-Luc Picard: "We kept trying to call it off but those damn Love Instructors kept telling us to try again..."
"Where was your evolved sensibility then?!"
I wrote an essay once talking about Gulliver's Travels, specifically abut the Huonymhmns. I posited that they couldn't be an ideal society, because they thought they were an ideal society, so they would never see a need to second guess themselves. I think we've seen that conceit show up in Star Trek a few times. Humans in Trek, by and large, tend to pat themselves on the back for how far they've come. And we saw on Enterprise that they have a chip on their shoulder regarding how other races perceive them. With that in mind, I can absolutely see Crusher coming to a conclusion based on faulty premises and not being willing to question herself because, frankly, she's far too evolved to even need to do such a thing.
Haha. That's not really a favor to me.
It's their loss if they don't want to view it, and there's only a select few of 4 or 5 that would be dead-set against it.
It was an interview/discussion panel with the showrunner, so it was worth posting regardless. And it offered some new context to this current season.
Thanks for the "gratitude". Next time you post a link like that, I won't go through the trouble typing what I listened to. So what you'll post will fall on deafer ears. I helped you, whether you want to admit it or not. And this is the thanks I get?
How does that automatically make it worth someone's times? @Lord Garth made the effort to listen and describe it, and actually tell us what it is about, and what he took from it. It creates discussion rather than posting random videos of long diatribe with no clue to context.
One of the challenges is coming across a live stream in progress, so it's more of a "this exists" and sharing it for any posters or lurkers that might be interested in checking it out.
For completed streams that have subtitles enabled, https://youtubetranscript.com/ can be a major help in locating which part of the stream has the content you're interested in, and then can be used to copy/paste pertinent information.
If the title doesn't grab me, I don't know the channel, and it's more than a few min long, I won't bother searching a transcript for interesting bits.
A summary can help decide:
In this podcast, they talk about upcoming PIC episodes and easter eggs you can look forward to. => I open it immediately and listen to the whole thing.
In this 4 h video, 3 blurry pixels are analyzed by 2 heads that think it could be that 1 ship, but they mostly mention that they want more likes and subscribers and donations, and one of them has a malfunctioning universal translator. => No thanks.
A summary can help decide:
In this podcast, they talk about upcoming PIC episodes and easter eggs you can look forward to. => I open it immediately and listen to the whole thing.
In this 4 h video, 3 blurry pixels are analyzed by 2 heads that think it could be that 1 ship, but they mostly mention that they want more likes and subscribers and donations, and one of them has a malfunctioning universal translator. => No thanks.
Exactly this. You have one shot to get me hooked. Posting a link and saying "Watch/listen" doesn't do it.If the title doesn't grab me, I don't know the channel, and it's more than a few min long, I won't bother searching a transcript for interesting bits.
A summary can help decide:
In this podcast, they talk about upcoming PIC episodes and easter eggs you can look forward to. => I open it immediately and listen to the whole thing.
In this 4 h video, 3 blurry pixels are analyzed by 2 heads that think it could be that 1 ship, but they mostly mention that they want more likes and subscribers and donations, and one of them has a malfunctioning universal translator. => No thanks.
The best part of this episode:
1) Michael Dorn as Worf
2) The scene with Picard and Beverly in the sickbay and especially Patrick Stewart's acting
Multiple early reviews wrote that Michael Dorn would "effortlessly slide back into his role". I didn't believe it, but it happened.
This is a prime example of what a returning TNG character should look like (with fewer decapitations of unarmed Ferengis half his size).
The scene in sickbay shows that either Patrick Stewart is deliberately playing Picard as a decrepit/frail old man, or that he is written this way. He can act differently.
Patrick Stewart still can play Jean-Luc Picard and not JL.
These positive aspects get undermined by negative aspects:
1) Raffi
2) Beverly's reasoning for not talking to JL for 20 years and hiding his son from him is deplorable.
We also get a huge info dump from Beverly about what happened to Picard after Nemenes. Show don't tell.
3) Bad de-aging
Riker Picard conflict: A forced conflict that came out of nowhere. This show does not let a chance to dress down Picard slip away.
I hope there is more to this (Riker not the real Riker?). Otherwise, this was another style-over-substance scene (an attempt to recreate the Riker-Picard bridge scene from "All Good Things" or the "Konovalov" scene from "The Hunt for Red October").
Changelings:
Being away from the great link is not detrimental for Changelings. Being in solid form is. They don't get "withdrawal symptoms" from being away from the great link (Odo, Laas).
Double Changeling reveals: After the fight with Jack, the audience knows that we are dealing with Changelings, and yet then we get a second dramatic Changeling reveal.
Strange dramaturgy.
Looking out of windows? What happened to cameras or "optical sensors"? The whole "optical sensors" issue is a problem within Star Trek, it's not new to this show, but it's nonetheless strange and should be addressed.
Gasleak:
How does a gas leak from inside an airtight pressure hull leak outside?
Ignoring that problem, and that the warning system was deactivated, why did the external sensors of the Titan not detect that they are leaving a trail behind?
There are so many examples from past Trek shows how someone can send a secret signal from a ship:
- The method that Seska / Jonas used to communicate with the Kazon.
- Riker's manipulation of the Ferengi Marauder to send a signal when the and the Trois were abducted.
- In "Face Of The Enemy" the chief engineer manipulated the Warbird so the Enterprise could detect it.
- A new gadget like an LPI transmitter.
- ETC
All of these methods are more elegant than a gas-farting ship.
The writers needed a way to make Jack useful, but they did it in a way that made the bridge crew look incompetent.
Nobody else had the idea to check for hidden signals? Only Jack came up with the idea?
Why did Seven not contact the bridge or tell someone to contact the bridge? How lucky for the Changeling that nobody entered the room by chance.
Raffi and the investigation subplot:
Obnoxious character, bad acting, info dumps, and on top of that contrived, strange and very convenient sequence of events.
Last episode Raffi had an exposition info dump about Sneed.
In this episode, Worf shows up with a data pad, says "this is our target", they go to the same backstreet/alleyway, wait for the target, by random chance he shows up, he sees them, he flees, he gets body slammed and dragged back to the La Sirena.
Really clunky and contrived storytelling. That's how I imagine CW shows.
Why is the Changeling in the backstreet/alleyway? What is he doing there, what are his plans? Why is he even still on the planet? Why is he still in the same form? Why does a Changeling have a criminal record? Why doees he imiate a single person for so long?
So convenient, so contrived.
Worf is saying that he knows who paid Sneed to lie. What was Sneed lying about and to whom? He facilitated a transaction. That is what he was paid for. He didn't lie about it. Raffi knew about it because Sneed said it.
I think this is an example of bad writing. Writers write a conspiracy story and they can't keep track of their own story and fictional events and of who knew what about whom and who lied to whom about what and when.
Good cop, bad cop, Raffi is the bad cop...
We get an info dump from Worf about post-Dominion war events.
We are three episodes into season 3.
So far the Titan has spent three episodes in a nebula and we are going to spend more time there next episode.
Raffi was on two sets in three episodes. The backstreet/alleyway on the Blade Runner planet and the upper deck on La Sirena.
It's getting stale. A bit more variety.
4/10
1) Michael Dorn as Worf
2) The scene with Picard and Beverly in the sickbay and especially Patrick Stewart's acting
Multiple early reviews wrote that Michael Dorn would "effortlessly slide back into his role". I didn't believe it, but it happened.
This is a prime example of what a returning TNG character should look like (with fewer decapitations of unarmed Ferengis half his size).
The scene in sickbay shows that either Patrick Stewart is deliberately playing Picard as a decrepit/frail old man, or that he is written this way. He can act differently.
Patrick Stewart still can play Jean-Luc Picard and not JL.
These positive aspects get undermined by negative aspects:
1) Raffi
2) Beverly's reasoning for not talking to JL for 20 years and hiding his son from him is deplorable.
We also get a huge info dump from Beverly about what happened to Picard after Nemenes. Show don't tell.
3) Bad de-aging
Riker Picard conflict: A forced conflict that came out of nowhere. This show does not let a chance to dress down Picard slip away.
I hope there is more to this (Riker not the real Riker?). Otherwise, this was another style-over-substance scene (an attempt to recreate the Riker-Picard bridge scene from "All Good Things" or the "Konovalov" scene from "The Hunt for Red October").
Changelings:
Being away from the great link is not detrimental for Changelings. Being in solid form is. They don't get "withdrawal symptoms" from being away from the great link (Odo, Laas).
Double Changeling reveals: After the fight with Jack, the audience knows that we are dealing with Changelings, and yet then we get a second dramatic Changeling reveal.
Strange dramaturgy.
Looking out of windows? What happened to cameras or "optical sensors"? The whole "optical sensors" issue is a problem within Star Trek, it's not new to this show, but it's nonetheless strange and should be addressed.
Gasleak:
How does a gas leak from inside an airtight pressure hull leak outside?
Ignoring that problem, and that the warning system was deactivated, why did the external sensors of the Titan not detect that they are leaving a trail behind?
There are so many examples from past Trek shows how someone can send a secret signal from a ship:
- The method that Seska / Jonas used to communicate with the Kazon.
- Riker's manipulation of the Ferengi Marauder to send a signal when the and the Trois were abducted.
- In "Face Of The Enemy" the chief engineer manipulated the Warbird so the Enterprise could detect it.
- A new gadget like an LPI transmitter.
- ETC
All of these methods are more elegant than a gas-farting ship.
The writers needed a way to make Jack useful, but they did it in a way that made the bridge crew look incompetent.
Nobody else had the idea to check for hidden signals? Only Jack came up with the idea?
Why did Seven not contact the bridge or tell someone to contact the bridge? How lucky for the Changeling that nobody entered the room by chance.
Raffi and the investigation subplot:
Obnoxious character, bad acting, info dumps, and on top of that contrived, strange and very convenient sequence of events.
Last episode Raffi had an exposition info dump about Sneed.
In this episode, Worf shows up with a data pad, says "this is our target", they go to the same backstreet/alleyway, wait for the target, by random chance he shows up, he sees them, he flees, he gets body slammed and dragged back to the La Sirena.
Really clunky and contrived storytelling. That's how I imagine CW shows.
Why is the Changeling in the backstreet/alleyway? What is he doing there, what are his plans? Why is he even still on the planet? Why is he still in the same form? Why does a Changeling have a criminal record? Why doees he imiate a single person for so long?
So convenient, so contrived.
Worf is saying that he knows who paid Sneed to lie. What was Sneed lying about and to whom? He facilitated a transaction. That is what he was paid for. He didn't lie about it. Raffi knew about it because Sneed said it.
I think this is an example of bad writing. Writers write a conspiracy story and they can't keep track of their own story and fictional events and of who knew what about whom and who lied to whom about what and when.
Good cop, bad cop, Raffi is the bad cop...
We get an info dump from Worf about post-Dominion war events.
We are three episodes into season 3.
So far the Titan has spent three episodes in a nebula and we are going to spend more time there next episode.
Raffi was on two sets in three episodes. The backstreet/alleyway on the Blade Runner planet and the upper deck on La Sirena.
It's getting stale. A bit more variety.
4/10
Regarding having crew look out a window instead of optical sensors or cameras...
We have a Nest camera for the front of the house, and it works well. But if there is no wifi, it doesn't work. Maybe something similar happens in the nebula... it clearly makes sensors useless, so why wouldn't it affect optical sensors?
I always thought there should be some crew posted at various windows in all Starfleet ships so that if sensors are down (which happens far too often), they can at least inform the bridge of what they see outside.
We have a Nest camera for the front of the house, and it works well. But if there is no wifi, it doesn't work. Maybe something similar happens in the nebula... it clearly makes sensors useless, so why wouldn't it affect optical sensors?
I always thought there should be some crew posted at various windows in all Starfleet ships so that if sensors are down (which happens far too often), they can at least inform the bridge of what they see outside.
He wasn’t unarmed.
Sneed got what was coming to him.
You miss the point that people don’t have hours to watch YouTube videos. Either they have other things to do or choose not to spend 3 hours watching a stream. It would be kind if those who do post about them could try to summarize it even if after the fact. It’s not a big ask honestly.
Cool story.
Not every post in this forum is about you, and I wasn't posting it for you specifically.
An interview with the showrunner is worth posting. You were under no obligation to watch it.
There will be more. Including a panel with Terry, Todd Stashwick, and the Production Designer this weekend.